Quantcast Besweet: AC3 2.0 to AC3 5.1 - digitalFAQ.com Forums [Archives]
  #1  
06-30-2005, 01:45 PM
dvdreasy dvdreasy is offline
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Hi,

Donīt know if this is the right forum . . .

It is possible to convert an AC3 2.0 to AC3 5.1 ?
if so, what sound will be available in the rear channels ?

How can I do it ? using besweet ?



Thanks !
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  #2  
06-30-2005, 02:40 PM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
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it is not possible with besweet.
but a few days ago someone talk about ADCTools that can do that.
I tired it on a mp3 I had, something is really created on the rear channel (I can see that on my PC with ac3filter), but I didn't put that on a DVD to listen the result on my AC3 amp.

http://www.dvdidle.net/audiodvdcreat...opic.php?t=275
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  #3  
07-05-2005, 08:14 PM
dvdreasy dvdreasy is offline
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This tool is amazing !!!

In a movie with AC3 2.0 I did the following :
1) belight to convert AC3 to WAV stereo
2) ADCTOOLS to convert WAV to AC3 5.1
3) Create ISO, burn it and played in my AC3 amp.

The result is GREAT !
- Voices only in the center channel
- True feeling of surround in front/rear channels (although I feel that rear left and right are almost the same)
- Subwoofer working right

It sure feel much better watching this movie after converting the sound to AC3 5.1 than the original AC3 2.0

This program rocks !
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  #4  
07-06-2005, 05:31 AM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dvdreasy
It sure feel much better watching this movie after converting the sound to AC3 5.1 than the original AC3 2.0
That is the point I do not understand : almost all ac3 2.0 are Dolby Surround encoded. So you just have to put your amp in DPL mode, and have the same result that what ADCTOOLS did when it transforms your 2.0 into 5.1 (except that in DPL you miss the .1)

So, what is your purpose in doing all these transformations ?
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  #5  
07-06-2005, 08:09 AM
incredible incredible is offline
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Same thought like Phil
http://www.kvcd.net/forum/viewtopic....t=dolby#118090
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  #6  
07-06-2005, 08:19 AM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
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For me, passing from ac3 2.0 to ac3 5.1 has a purely technical reason : when you want to author a mono VTS DVD from 2 sources with 2 different audio format (that is not allowed).

But in this case, it's better to go from 5.1 to 2.0 than the opposite.

Now, if the 2.0 is not Dolby Surround but pure stereo, the discussion is different (as you pointed in your thread).
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  #7  
07-06-2005, 01:03 PM
AlexandreBH AlexandreBH is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dialhot
So you just have to put your amp in DPL mode, and have the same result that what ADCTOOLS did when it transforms your 2.0 into 5.1 (except that in DPL you miss the .1)

So, what is your purpose in doing all these transformations ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by dvdreasy
- Voices only in the center channel
- True feeling of surround in front/rear channels (although I feel that rear left and right are almost the same)
- Subwoofer working right
no Dialhot, the result from ADCTools don't loose the .1
did you remember that test? http://www.jltoca.uaivip.com.br/test.ac3
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  #8  
07-07-2005, 03:19 AM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexandreBH
no Dialhot, the result from ADCTools don't loose the .1
did you remember that test? http://www.jltoca.uaivip.com.br/test.ac3
Read again my post.
Quote:
your amp in DPL mode, and have the same result that what ADCTOOLS did when it transforms your 2.0 into 5.1 (except that in DPL you miss the .1)
(note: and this does not take in account that any good DPL amp has a bass management system that send all freq under 80Hz to the .1).
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  #9  
07-07-2005, 10:15 AM
AlexandreBH AlexandreBH is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dialhot
Read again my post.
your amp in DPL mode, and have the same result that what ADCTOOLS did when it transforms your 2.0 into 5.1 (except that in DPL you miss the .1)
right! (i understood why reading the next part)


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dialhot
(note: and this does not take in account that any good DPL amp has a bass management system that send all freq under 80Hz to the .1).
i was thinking that all DPL had this feature(not all? ) because my old "Gradiente"(label in Brasil) can do that bass management.
thanks for clarify the details.
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  #10  
07-07-2005, 02:51 PM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexandreBH
i was thinking that all DPL had this feature(not all? ) because my old "Gradiente"(label in Brasil) can do that bass management.
thanks for clarify the details.
This is not a requirement of DPL process. To be accurate, DPL is 4.0 (surround is mono, that explain the 4 and not 5).
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  #11  
07-07-2005, 07:16 PM
dvdreasy dvdreasy is offline
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I understand what you guys said . . .

My A/V amp doesnīt have DPL II.

All I can say is that I'm really sure that the 5.1 converted AC3 sounds a lot better that the original 2.0 AC3.

Cheers
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  #12  
07-07-2005, 09:19 PM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dvdreasy
I understand what you guys said . . .

My A/V amp doesnīt have DPL II.
I told about DPL. All AC3 amp have a DPL mode. DPL II is a special DSP that all amp does not have (mine doesn't for instance).

Quote:
All I can say is that I'm really sure that the 5.1 converted AC3 sounds a lot better that the original 2.0 AC3.
Did you try in DPL ?

Note: I remember that I noticed that ACDTOOLS produce something I compared to DPL II DSP of an amp. That is surely a better result than "simple" DPL, that's right. But does it worth the cost ? You loose quite some space for the video !
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  #13  
07-08-2005, 11:28 AM
AlexandreBH AlexandreBH is offline
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@ dvdreasy
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dialhot
You loose quite some space for the video !
yes,Dialhot is right. 5.1 need more space.
are you doing kdvd?


maybe a good idea:
can we post in portuguese forum dvdreasy?
i know that Dialhot can read and write in portuguese(i don't know if incredible can) and we can change more informations.
if don't,we can change pms!
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  #14  
07-08-2005, 11:43 AM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexandreBH
and we can change more informations.
More informations with 10% of the members taht can read the thread instead of 90% that read english ? I'm not sure

Note: AC3 is possible only on DVD.
For a one movie DVD, the lack of place is not important. And I think perhaps dvdreasy thinks about adding this to his app.
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  #15  
07-08-2005, 05:46 PM
dvdreasy dvdreasy is offline
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@ AlexandreBH
No, I did it on a standart DVD

@ Dialhot
I just tried it because the DVD in question "Secret Agents - French movie" only had AC3 2.0 and the movie + new audio (AC3 converted to 5.1) was below 4.3 GB

Yes, it would be nice to have this kind of feature in DVDREasy, but only if ADCTools has command line support. I didn't check it yet.

@ both
Thanks for all your help and support

Cheers,

DVDREasy
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  #16  
07-08-2005, 06:28 PM
AlexandreBH AlexandreBH is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dvdreasy
Yes, it would be nice to have this kind of feature in DVDREasy, but only if ADCTools has command line support. I didn't check it yet.
DVDREasy

if you have adobe audition i can send some scripts to create and encode to 5.1 from stereo source. i don't know if audition suport command line to be used inside your prog but i think that belight can .
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  #17  
07-09-2005, 12:35 PM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
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Hi,

Today I compared severel audio tracks. I didn't have an ac3 2.0 so I took a mp3 issued from an Xvid, encoded in dolby surround, that I'd decompressed into WAV using virtualdubmod.

This is what I compared on my amp, DPL mode and bass management ON for 2.0 tracks and AC3 for 5.1 track.

1/ original DS PCM WAV
2/ mp2 at 128 kpbs produced by besweet
3/ ac3 2.0 at 128 from Besweet
4/ ac3 2.0 at 128 from ACDTools
5/ ac3 5.1 at 384 from ACDTools

3 and 4 are the worst choice. The audio quality is not in cause but there is a big level drop very noticiable when you switch the track (even is this is not so obvious on the PC)

High freq in 2 have a lesser quality then in 1, but it is not a surprise. 1 has the best high freq compared to all others. It's not only due to what Inc discovered there : http://www.kvcd.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=15987.

Now the things that is the toppic of this thread : what about 5 compared to other tracks ?

Well, first I didn't have an ac3 2.0 as source, and as tell above 3 and 4 aren't good, so I can't compare directly 2.0 and 5.1 but I can dfo for mp2 and ac3 5.1 (tracks 2 and 5).
  • 5.1 produced ACDTools is not pleasant at all ! Too much informations that belongs to front row go to rear one. Especially voices. That makes the dialogs hard to be distinguished from the ambiant music. Very tiring...

    mp2 result is better about front/rear. But if you compare only the front line, there is a little bit too much things on the central channel. This time this is the music that is covered by the voices and the "width" of the audio field is narrower (eyes closed, you don't feel the sound the same way. 5.1 is more pleasant, more "opened").

    Also the low frequencies are better with 5.1 than with DPL. They are more punchy, more "dry". This can be due to the poor bass management of my amp (Sony's is good for that).

So finally ? I'll keep my mp2 as best choice but what ACDTools produce can be interresting if you have some free room on the disc after you had encoded the m2v.

note : filesizes are 85 MB for 128 kbit/s tracks and 256 MB for the 5.1 one.
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