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  #1  
05-22-2003, 12:21 AM
jorel jorel is offline
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with and without temporalsmoother(1,2)

comparing some results, i see that in dark scenes shows "obscures" green colors.
it's a really ugly dark green

removing the filters one by one,only stay
with unfilter and temporalsmoother filters.

in bright scenes all hue (matiz) are changed,
the skin faces seems like "anemic"
black hair is opaque wrapped in muddy cloud.
the image in general show LESS NOISES

without temporalsmoother, the dark scenes came to black,
got more contrast and normal colors,
but with MORE NOISES

then i did samples with and without temporalsmoother to compare.

the results in MPEG1 SVCD adjusting to 284 mb spacing free,
and free audio size to 0 (zero) in ToK

the script was edited for each case to encode:

Legalclip()
Unfilter(50,50)
BicubicResize(448,448,0,0.6,0,0,720,480)
"with and without temporalfilter(1,2)"
AddBorders(16,16,16,16)
Legalclip()

1-finding prediction using sample with 00:31:22
from ToK
Resolution (fps):480x480 (29,970 fps)
Total Frames: 56417
Total Time : 00:31:22 <---for predictions

CQ found (time and size here are irrelevants)

unfilter WITH temporalsmoother(1,2)
Next CQ: 70,473. Sample Size: 4.694.221
Exit Condition: 1,000 % reached ! yahoo !
Final CQ: 70,473

unfilter WITHOUT temporalsmoother
Next CQ: 63,472. Sample Size: 4.694.083
Exit Condition: 1,000 % reached ! yahoo !
Final CQ: 63,472


2-using the final predictions obtained,
selectin period with trim in the end of script

trim(30000,32000) <---selection for encode

from ToK
Resolution (fps):480x480 (29,970 fps)
Total Frames: 2001
Total Time : 00:01:07 <---for encode final CQs

TIMES and SIZES after encode

unfilter WITH temporalsmoother(1,2)
Encoding... CQ : 70,470
Final Encoded Size: 11.439.732
Total Time (all operations): 00:04:01

unfilter WITHOUT temporalsmoother
Encoding... CQ : 63,470
Final Encoded Size: 10.852.522
Total Time (all operations): 00:03:35


now i'm "dazed&confused".
what is better
with temporalsmoother and
bad colors,more CQ,more size, more time to encode
or
without temporalsmoother and
real colors, less CQ,less size, less time to encode



i can't answer this after hours testing and comparing

i need your point of view

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  #2  
05-22-2003, 01:05 AM
Kane Kane is offline
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hmmm,
i never noticed that, when looking a kvcd on my tv, maybe because my tv itself does not show a really black colour
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05-22-2003, 01:06 AM
kwag kwag is offline
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Hi jorel,

Probably the answer is that it's a better result WITHOUT temporal filters, unless the material is not very clean. That's one of the reasons why I removed the "temporal" values completely on the STM filter, and only used "spatial" filtering. Spatial filtering works "within" the frame, as oposed to "temporal" filters that work on adjacent frames. Even with slightly lower CQ, the final result is probably more natural without the filter, at the cost of file size . Or maybe not drop the filter completely, but change it to read: TemporalSmoother( 1, 1 )
You might want to try that

-kwag
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05-22-2003, 02:19 AM
jorel jorel is offline
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thanks you Kwag,

the material is clean, i only encode dvds
and my samples are from dark scenes.

your explanations for Spatial filtering,
temporal filters and the conjugation between
CQ / size are a course.

i will try like you wrote, adjust TemporalSmoother( 1, 1 )

hi Kane

i see it on the tv too,not only in pc.
someone here in forum, posted a faster observation
like mine about the "green color" of temporalsmoother.
don't remember where this was posted and who was.
i'm trying to remember.
i did a kvcd from "Dune" using temporalsmoother
and the colors are really differents from others kvcds.
strange but true....the skin of the face is strange
but the color of the dvd is cool.
better is testing like Kwag Wrote:
"maybe not drop the filter completely, but change it to..."

thanks.
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05-22-2003, 10:50 AM
girv girv is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jorel
someone here in forum, posted a faster observation
like mine about the "green color" of temporalsmoother.
don't remember where this was posted and who was. :?
I believe it was me :)

I noticed the green tinging from TemporalSmoother(1,2) when I was experimenting with MSoften to get rid of blocks in xvid encodes. To save you some testing effort, I found that changing the parameters didnt seem to make a difference to the effect. I've since stopped using TemporalSmoother altogether in favour of FluxSmooth or one of the Dust filters.
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  #6  
05-27-2003, 01:50 AM
jorel jorel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by girv
Quote:
Originally Posted by jorel
someone here in forum, posted a faster observation
like mine about the "green color" of temporalsmoother.
don't remember where this was posted and who was.
I believe it was me

I noticed the green tinging from TemporalSmoother(1,2) when I was experimenting with MSoften to get rid of blocks in xvid encodes. To save you some testing effort, I found that changing the parameters didnt seem to make a difference to the effect. I've since stopped using TemporalSmoother altogether in favour of FluxSmooth or one of the Dust filters.
yeah girv

...excuse my later answer friend

i change the parameters in the filter and
didn't make any difference in the image like you posted.

the skin of the face got more yellow with the filter
red with more green
change the face to yellow....just a little but change.
the red color loose the "proud" too!

without temporalsmoother the matizes got more naturality

Kwag post this explanation:
"Even with slightly lower CQ, the final result is probably more natural without the filter, at the cost of file size "
Kwag is right and was very clear ...
the quality is better if the filter is removed and the size increase a little.

@ all
i have pictures to show the differences in small zip file!
they are teeny but real.
just pm with a mail to send!

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