Quantcast DVD-RB/CCE for PAL to NTSC? - digitalFAQ.com Forums [Archives]
  #1  
08-14-2004, 07:14 PM
Jimblob Jimblob is offline
Free Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 87
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I've been looking for a way to convert a PAL DVD to NTSC. I've been using DVD-RB/CCE to compress DVDs and wondered if I could use it to do the conversion by modifying the AVS Script. Essentially, I believe, all I need is to change the frame size and frame rate. For frame size, I just need a resizer line in the script. However, I don't know what to do with the frame rate.
If I can get the VOB files properly converted, I can use IfoEdit to fix the IFO files.
Any suggestions on changing the frame rate from 25 fps to 29.97 fps?

Thanks
Reply With Quote
Someday, 12:01 PM
admin's Avatar
Site Staff / Ad Manager
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 42
Thanks: ∞
Thanked 42 Times in 42 Posts
  #2  
08-15-2004, 11:01 AM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
Free Member
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 10,463
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
You don't have to go from 25 to 29.9 but you have to do a 23.976 target then apply pulldown on it.
That is the way second part that gave me problems (the first one is done simply by adding a "ChangeFPS(23.976)" as last line of the script).

I never find the way to have CCE to produce an output that is already pulled down. But perhaps someone else has the answer...
Reply With Quote
  #3  
08-15-2004, 11:24 AM
incredible incredible is offline
Free Member
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Germany
Posts: 3,189
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Send a message via ICQ to incredible
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dialhot
That is the way second part that gave me problems (the first one is done simply by adding a "ChangeFPS(23.976)" as last line of the script).
I think thats one of the worsed conversions you could do. As a change FPS just doubes delete frames if proceeded on framebased sources (means not bobbed ones). This will do end up in jerky videos. Sometimes less, sometimes more.

And thats why there does exist "changeFPS()" which procceds the source on a differrent way as by this beside doubled frames dynamical phase shifts and blendings are applied, so the stream looks smooth afterwards. BUT then you have to encode interlacedfinaly.

And even here it isn't the right way to just apply a convertFPS(23.976).

Normally you do it as describet below.

SourceImport(...)
fullfields=(23.976*2)
KernelBob(...) # A very good bobber (= full field to framerate deinterlacer, 50fps will be the result)
LanczosResize(720, 576)
ConvertFPS(fullfields)
SeparateFields()
SelectEvery(4, 1, 2)
Weave()

But anyway, to me it seems that its quite difficult doing a conversion from PAL-NTSC or the other way around in DVD RB, as you need a function above .... IF DVD RB doesnt reencode the Audio (which I do assume).

Reply With Quote
  #4  
08-15-2004, 11:28 AM
incredible incredible is offline
Free Member
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Germany
Posts: 3,189
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Send a message via ICQ to incredible
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dialhot
YI never find the way to have CCE to produce an output that is already pulled down. But perhaps someone else has the answer...
Well there does exist in CCE a "pulldown" option but I never testetd it and so I dont know its deep processing!
But IF DVD Rebuilder is capable (for shure) to handle progressive NTSC Sources for NTSC DVD reencodings, it for shure should have a post pulldown-flag processing option/engine

And please do keep separated the words "pulldown" and "pulldown-flag", as many people will do get confused as you for yourself know exactly whats the difference between them
Reply With Quote
  #5  
08-15-2004, 11:41 AM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
Free Member
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 10,463
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by incredible
Well there does exist in CCE a "pulldown" option but I never testetd it and so I dont know its deep processing!
No. it is a "3:2 pulldown detection" and the goal is (I guess) to perform an automatic IVTC.

Quote:
But IF DVD Rebuilder is capable (for shure) to handle progressive NTSC Sources for NTSC DVD reencodings, it for shure should have a post pulldown-flag processing option/engine
Yes it is but here DVD*RB thinks it has a PAL stream to encode, and there is no need to pulldown in this case. So why/how should DBD-RB be abble to add it ?

Quote:
And please do keep separated the words "pulldown" and "pulldown-flag", as many people will do get confused as you for yourself know exactly whats the difference between them
You're right

Note: Yes DBD-RB does not reencode the audio that is why I suggested to use ChangeFPS. Because I'm not sure that your way will keep the playing time unchanged. Will it ?
Reply With Quote
  #6  
08-15-2004, 11:52 AM
incredible incredible is offline
Free Member
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Germany
Posts: 3,189
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Send a message via ICQ to incredible
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dialhot
Note: Yes DBD-RB does not reencode the audio that is why I suggested to use ChangeFPS. Because I'm not sure that your way will keep the playing time unchanged. Will it ?
And thats the problem!
ConvertFPS() does a stupid framedoubling at specific intervals, convertFPS() does it the way explained above, so both do end up in the same Time-length but you do change the stream frame/field architecture significantly. I would never do that in case of a simple about 1fps difference of source/target.

I think DVD Rebuilder should keep the quality as most as possible, and BTW! performing a pulldown-flag (or hard pulldown) on a converted 25 to 23.976 wont work in my eyes as that resulted 23.976 (the way above) isnt progressive anymore or it doesnt contain the regular progressive correct framecount.

Everything "just IMHO" and should be clearified at doom9 or wherever ..


My suggestion!: Leave that one at PAL IF the consumers SAP will play back PAL 625 line DVDs on a NTSC 525 Line TV (as i.E. my SAP plays back 23.976 or 29.97 streams without no problem on my PAL tv.


Change/convert fps best explained here (use a translation tool):

changefps()
http://home.arcor.de/scharfis_brain/...rlacing/#2.2.1

Convertfps()
http://home.arcor.de/scharfis_brain/...rlacing/#2.2.2
Reply With Quote
  #7  
08-15-2004, 02:40 PM
SansGrip SansGrip is offline
Free Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,135
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimblob
I've been looking for a way to convert a PAL DVD to NTSC.
Since PAL is 25fps (and usually, for film material, it's just been speeded up from 24fps to 25fps in the first place) I just use AssumeFPS(23.976) to slow it back down again. I then find the exact runtime of the new video and use a wave editor to resample at the desired rate. Reencode, remux and voila.

As for using DVD-RB to do it, that's currently not possible because there's no way to change the runtime of the audio.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
08-15-2004, 02:41 PM
SansGrip SansGrip is offline
Free Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,135
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dialhot
I never find the way to have CCE to produce an output that is already pulled down. But perhaps someone else has the answer...
There is no way. You have to use pulldown.exe (or the GUI version).
Reply With Quote
  #9  
08-18-2004, 03:47 PM
Jimblob Jimblob is offline
Free Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 87
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I understand enough to get that it won't work. It's a shame. I'll continue frameserving the PAL source into TMPGEnc XPress which does a pretty good job in converting the movie portion.

Thanks
Reply With Quote
Reply




Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
DVD NTSC 29.970fps A KSVCD NTSC 23.976fps <-ESCENAS NEGRA centella Convertir y Codificar Video (Español) 2 09-06-2004 02:44 PM
DVD NTSC a PAL Xavierator Convertir y Codificar Video (Español) 3 09-06-2004 03:48 AM
Which is better - PAL or NTSC? Dmaster87 Video Encoding and Conversion 1 11-10-2003 06:47 AM
KVCD: PAl to NTSC? have to convert them to NTSC before encoding? WhiteKnight54 Video Encoding and Conversion 2 12-18-2002 10:32 PM
KVCD: How to convert from NTSC 23.xxx to PAL or NTSC 29.xxx StevetheSwede Video Encoding and Conversion 0 09-18-2002 09:23 AM

Thread Tools



 
All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:16 AM  —  vBulletin © Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd