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-   -   My first KVCD! Feedback? (http://www.digitalfaq.com/archives/encode/13327-first-kvcd-feedback.html)

dnstommy 02-18-2005 08:51 PM

My first KVCD! Feedback?
 
Im a smart guy who programs for a living, but this KVCD is killing me.

Here is my info:

Code:

SOURCE:

- Filetype (divx/xvid/mpeg/mjpg - so what says Gspot??) ? : DVD
- interlaced(means combing on fast moving scenes) or not interlaced ? :
- Framerate (29.97, 23.976, 25.000) ? : 29.97
- Resolution ? : 4:3
- Audiosamplerate (44.1 khz, 48 khz)? : 48
- Audio Type (AC3, mp3, mp2) ?: AC3 -> MP2
- Is Audio VBR or CBR ?
(some answers you get if using Gspot on the source!)


DESTINATION:

- KVCD, K(S)VCD or KDVD ?: KVCD
- Mode (mpeg1 or mpeg2) ?: 2
- Framerate (29.97, 23.976, 25.000) ? : 23.9
- Resolution ? 352x480
- Audiosamplerate (44.1 khz or 48 khz) ? : 44.1
- Audio Enc Type (mp2, AC3) ?: mp2
- Encoding Appl. (CCE or TmpgEnc) ?: tmpgEnc
- muxing Appl. (TmpgEnc, BBmpeg, etc.) ?: BBmpeg
- Authoring Appl. (Vcdeasy, VCDgear, Nero) ?: Nero
- Burning Appl. (Vcdeasy, Nero, etc.) ?: Nero

If Avisynth is used:

- Which Version of Avisynth Do you use? 2.5
- Post your last state of your script here!:  script below

I ripped my DVD with DVD Decrypt
got the audio out d2v file with DVD2AVI.
got the audio to mp2 with BBmpeg
got the CQ with CQMatic
Encoded and joined them with Mplex.

Here is my script:
Code:

LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files\AviSynth 2.5\plugins\MPEG2Dec3.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files\AviSynth 2.5\plugins\asharp.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files\AviSynth 2.5\plugins\UnDot.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files\AviSynth 2.5\plugins\UnFilter.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files\AviSynth 2.5\plugins\vsfilter.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files\AviSynth 2.5\plugins\STMedianFilter.dll")

Mpeg2Source("D:\Temp Vid Folder2\casablanca.d2v")

undot()
Limiter()
asharp(1, 4)
BicubicResize(336, 222, 0, 0.6, 0, 2, 720, 476)
STMedianFilter(3, 3, 1, 1 )
MergeChroma(blur(1.5))
MergeLuma(blur(0.1))

ScriptClip(" nf = YDifferenceToNext()" +chr(13)+ "unfilter( -(fmin(round(nf)*2, 100)), -(fmin(round(nf)*2, 100)) ).TemporalSoften( fmin( round(2/nf), 6), round(1/nf) , round(3/nf) , 1, 1) ")

AddBorders(8, 9, 8, 9)
Limiter()

function fmin( int f1, int f2) { return ( f1<f2 ) ? f1 : f2}

The thing that bothers me most is the ending CQ was 11.7. So of course the video came out like shit. I used this template SKVCD NTSCFilm
352x480.

I basically used this guide (http://www.kvcd.net/guides/kguide/kvcdguide.htm) but used my own script (above) and CQMatic to get my size. The size was good 800 mb, but the video sucked.


Thanks for any help.

Dialhot 02-18-2005 09:06 PM

What is the length in minute of the movie ?
Is it fullscreen ?
Is is black and white ?

kwag 02-18-2005 09:11 PM

Hi dnstommy,

First of all, if your source is a DVD, and specially the movie Casablanca!, that should be FILM and not 29.97fps.
Run your VOBs again through DVD2AVI, press F5 and let it run for a minute or so, and verify that it indeed says FILM on the statistics.

-kwag

dnstommy 02-18-2005 09:11 PM

Quote:

What is the length in minute of the movie ?
102:42

Quote:

Is it fullscreen ?
4:3

Quote:

Is is black and white ?
Yes

dnstommy 02-18-2005 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwag
Hi dnstommy,

First of all, if your source is a DVD, and specially the movie Casablanca!, that should be FILM and not 29.97fps.
Run your VOBs again through DVD2AVI, press F5 and let it run for a minute or so, and verify that it indeed says FILM on the statistics.

-kwag

Its FILM 98%

dnstommy 02-18-2005 09:15 PM

Here it is after 2 minutes

http://www.digitalfaq.com/archives/error.gif

Dialhot 02-18-2005 09:16 PM

Fullscreen + BW = nightmare. Once I dropped the idea to convert a 1h20 long fullscreen movie because it was BW and the result was crappy.

You should start with an other movie :o

@karl
The source is 29.97 but the target is 23.976 and there is no fps conversion in the script, so we can assume that DVD2AVI is correctly set to FILM and that the "29.97" is just a newbie error.

kwag 02-18-2005 09:19 PM

I agree with dialhot.
Also, your movie is FILM, and you should have set "Force FILM" on DVD2AVI, as the frame rate is really 23.976fps.
That will give you a higher CQ value.
Try that :)

-kwag

kwag 02-18-2005 09:20 PM

@Phil,

I'm typing too slow today :lol:

-kwag

dnstommy 02-18-2005 09:22 PM

Thanks guys for the replies. I'll try another movie and see how it comes out. Thought Casablanca would be easy with greyscale and short, could keep my encode time down.

Thanks again guys.

dnstommy 02-19-2005 12:49 AM

what am I doing wrong.

Ok I took Fight Club, its 100% FILM, 23.97 fps.

Ripped it with DVD Decrypt.
opened VOB with DVD 2AVI, Forced FILM is on.

Here is the guts of my d2v file.

Code:

Stream_Type=1,0,0
iDCT_Algorithm=2 (1:MMX 2:SSEMMX 3:FPU 4:REF 5:SSE2MMX)
YUVRGB_Scale=1 (0:TVScale 1:PCScale)
Luminance_Filter=0,0 (Gamma, Offset)
Picture_Size=0,0,0,0,0,0 (ClipLeft, ClipRight, ClipTop, ClipBottom)
Field_Operation=1 (0:None 1:ForcedFILM 2:SwapOrder)
Frame_Rate=23976
Location=0,0,4,1BEE9

here is my TempgEnc file
http://www.rage-board.com/files/FightClub.tpr

When I use CQMatic it went to 21 right away.

Why is my encoded files sooo big.

kwag 02-19-2005 07:37 AM

First of all, your target is "MPEG-2 720x480" :!:
You can't expect to fit a movie on one CD like that :!:
How long is that movie and what average bitrate are you giving CQMatic :?:

-kwag

dnstommy 02-19-2005 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwag
First of all, your target is "MPEG-2 720x480" :!:
You can't expect to fit a movie on one CD like that :!:
How long is that movie and what average bitrate are you giving CQMatic :?:

-kwag

its 139 long and 374.9 is the average that I am giving it.

Dialhot 02-19-2005 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dnstommy
its 139 long and 374.9 is the average that I am giving it.

Let imagine that a standard VCD birate is 1150, a good 2-CD SVCD bitrate is 900 and a correct divx is 750. So you can see that 375 can't be a good value :-D

Your movie is long, very long. For a decent KVCD starting from a widescreen (not fullscreen) movie, the resolution are generally :
544x480 up to 1h40
480*480 up to 2h00
352*480 up to 2h15
352*240 above.

And I don't know how you are using calcumatic but for 139 min, and an audio at 128, I find 645 for video bitrate. How did you find this 374.9 ?

dnstommy 02-19-2005 05:53 PM

I think you just solved alot of my problems. I read from one of the other guides to write down the [.57] * Average number and that is what I have been using. I'll try to follow your film length chart and see what I come up with.

One additional question. Is there a guideline somewhere that tell you per what GSpot tells you about your DVD/AVI source what options should be on in you avs script. Like Fight Clubs is:

Interlaced
Is 3:2 pulldown to 29.7
is 16:9
is NTSC

I have read alot of the scripting posts and from the AviSynth site, but I cant get a handle on the conversion of source. I like this post

http://www.kvcd.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=9808

Thanks again for your help

Chris

Dialhot 02-19-2005 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dnstommy
Interlaced
Is 3:2 pulldown to 29.7
is 16:9
is NTSC

GSpot is not for analysing DVD, use it only for Avi.
The info you have there shows that your source is nothing else than the common NTSC source : Anamorphic (16:9), 23.976 (3:2 puldown).
YOu have nothing special to do in the script as this is the normal situation.

Your movie he is not interlaced but 3:2 pulled down (the result is also an interlaced stream, but not what we call "true" interlace). 3:2 is the situation a almost all movies. True interlaced stream are generally materials shooted for TV, or music shows.
In casse of 3:2, the stream is correctly handled by DVD2AVI by using the "force film" setting and you have nothing else to do. For a true interlaced stream you should deinterlace it in the avisynth script, but you can also decide to let it interlaced and encode as well.

dnstommy 02-19-2005 07:42 PM

Thanks for all your help 'dial', I am ripped it to 2 CD80's @QC = 70 with a min rate of 680. We
ll see how it looks.

I just wonder how some of these guys get these incredibly clear single CDR KVCD's. Only time and scripting will tell.

kwag 02-19-2005 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dnstommy
I am ripped it to 2 CD80's @QC = 70 with a min rate of 680.

WHY 680 :!:
That's too high, unless your player can't handle lower bitrates.
Try setting your MIN bitrate to 300Kbps, or you will loose precious bitrate.

-kwag

dnstommy 02-19-2005 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwag
Quote:

Originally Posted by dnstommy
I am ripped it to 2 CD80's @QC = 70 with a min rate of 680.

WHY 680 :!:
That's too high, unless your player can't handle lower bitrates.
Try setting your MIN bitrate to 300Kbps, or you will loose precious bitrate.

-kwag

I was going off of the original post from Dialhot

Quote:

Let imagine that a standard VCD birate is 1150, a good 2-CD SVCD bitrate is 900 and a correct divx is 750

I thought that the higher the bitrate the better?

kwag 02-19-2005 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dnstommy
I thought that the higher the bitrate the better?

Not for MIN bitrate.
The higher the average bitrate, the better the quality :)
Use the lowest MIN bitrate that your standalone will support. 300Kbps seems to fit just about every player.

Edit: Lowering the MIN bitrate to 300 will give you a higher CQ value in CQMatic.

-kwag


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