Quantcast KVCD Not Made with the Official Method? - digitalFAQ.com Forums [Archives]
  #1  
12-31-2006, 06:37 AM
rainer rainer is offline
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and not 120min either..

tried something different this time and got quite nice results.

movie: DOA - Dead or Alive
length: 83min

target: KVCDx3 mpeg-1 PAL 528x576
audio: 128kbit/stereo
edit: i also added permanent subtitles with ffdshow but they are not visible in that clip.

I encoded this with 2-pass VBR option (TMPGenc) because I haven't had success with any CQ prediction programs lately.
I also used ffdshow to enhance the picture a little.

Download 2min clip here

I'm pretty surprised how good quality it is.
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  #2  
12-31-2006, 07:18 AM
gamma gamma is offline
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That has me figuring some time now. When you set a 2-pass, the encoding
program calculates a average bitrate to fill the available space.
So, you're encoding targeted at a specific filesize, the avg bitrate will be calculated.
When using CQ, you're encoding at a minimum contant quality, "ignoring" the filesize.

What wonders me: is the 2-pass VBR at lets say 1000kbps average bitrate, the same in quality as a CQ encoding with avg rate of 1000kbps?
My common sense says: yes, because you're using the same average bitrate.
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  #3  
12-31-2006, 07:20 AM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rainer
I'm pretty surprised how good quality it is.
Excuse me ??? This clip is awfull

Pixelated all the long - even on the scenes not under the rain - , hardcoded combo artefacts due to bad deinterlacing...

Have you ever see a KVCD correctly encoded

http://www.kvcd.net/downloads/tomb.raider.sample.mpg
http://www.kvcd.net/downloads/red-pl...y-cq63.031.mpg
http://www.kvcd.net/downloads/NewScript.m1v.cut.40.mpg

These scenes are easier to encode than the one you show but trust me, your KVCD should/could look like them.
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  #4  
12-31-2006, 07:24 AM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gamma
What wonders me: is the 2-pass VBR at lets say 1000kbps average bitrate, the same in quality as a CQ encoding with avg rate of 1000kbps?
My common sense says: yes, because you're using the same average bitrate.
And practical experience says that this is not true. The rate control is unfortunately not good enought to reach the same quality in 2-pass than in CQ mode. It would need more pass to adjust the bits repartition. Only CCE allows to encode in more than 2-pass, and with 1 or 2 more, then yes : the quality reached in 3 (or 4) passes is the same than in 1-pass Q mode... in 3 or 4 more time !

With tmpgenc I often had better quality in CQ mode using only 90% of the disc due to a bad prediction than in 2-pass mode filling the whole 800 MB available.

Note: did you look at Rainer's sampler before to answer what you said ?
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  #5  
12-31-2006, 08:09 AM
rds_correia rds_correia is offline
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Arrgh!!
I can't watch this clip!
Two gorgeous women fighting without oil in their skin?
That's awful .
Kiddin'!
No, I mean, the picture looks horrible.
I don't know the final bitrate found by tmpgenc but this is a really bad encode.
I can't remember encoding such a bad clip.
Maybe...in 2000 or 2001?
You gotta tell us what you did because either something is wrong in the encoder (bug or something) or you crewed up somewhere in the rest of the process and we might be of help.
Cheers
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  #6  
12-31-2006, 08:17 AM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rds_correia
You gotta tell us what you did
The matter is that we are talking about VCD there, so max bitrate is limited to 2300 and that is few for rain scenes. Nevertheless, I'm suspecting a crappy source (Divx...) especially for the combo artefacts everywhere.
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  #7  
12-31-2006, 09:16 AM
rainer rainer is offline
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well, the quality is good enough for me and i think that's the thing that counts the most.
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  #8  
12-31-2006, 09:44 AM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rainer
well, the quality is good enough for me and i think that's the thing that counts the most.
Of course ! But our duty is to tell you that this is several light years from the quality you can expect . It 's a little like enjoying stereo sound when 5.1 DTS can be used.
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  #9  
01-03-2007, 01:05 PM
gamma gamma is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dialhot
And practical experience says that this is not true. The rate control is unfortunately not good enought to reach the same quality in 2-pass than in CQ mode. It would need more pass to adjust the bits repartition. Only CCE allows to encode in more than 2-pass, and with 1 or 2 more, then yes : the quality reached in 3 (or 4) passes is the same than in 1-pass Q mode... in 3 or 4 more time !

With tmpgenc I often had better quality in CQ mode using only 90% of the disc due to a bad prediction than in 2-pass mode filling the whole 800 MB available.
Ah, I understand, thanks

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dialhot
Note: did you look at Rainer's sampler before to answer what you said ?
Nope, I didn't....
I've just watched it, man o man......I totally get your point!
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  #10  
01-04-2007, 06:26 AM
supermule supermule is offline
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btw, which movie is this ???
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  #11  
01-04-2007, 06:52 AM
gamma gamma is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rainer
and not 120min either..

tried something different this time and got quite nice results.

movie: DOA - Dead or Alive
length: 83min
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