KVCD: Which Filters Should I use?

Jack · #1 01-17-2003, 05:25 PM

A few days ago I streamed the movie Red Planet (103 min, PAL in 704x576 16:9) from Premiere. I know that many other guys did that before and posted theier settings, but I still have a few questions:

- Which Template should I use?
- I have to change the min bitrate to at least 600kb (Pioneer dv-444). Is that a problem?
- Which Filters should I use?

I asked you this because I'm a little bit frustrated using KVCD templates. The first thing I hate is that I have to increase the min. bitrate to something about 650 till 750. And my sources are PAL so I never get the results those guys will get with NTSC material.

or not?

kwag · #2 01-17-2003, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack

- Which Template should I use?

KVCDx3

Quote:

- I have to change the min bitrate to at least 600kb (Pioneer dv-444). Is that a problem?

Not really

Quote:

- Which Filters should I use?

Look at this as a framework:

Code:

LoadPlugin("C:\WINDOWS\System32\mpeg2dec3.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\encoding\fluxsmooth.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\encoding\GripFit_preview.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\encoding\blockbuster.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\encoding\legalclip.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\encoding\sampler.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\encoding\vobsub.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\encoding\convolution3d.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\encoding\dustv4.dll") 
Mpeg2Source("k:\temp\VTS__01_P01_1.d2v")
LegalClip() 
GripCrop( width=528, height=480, overscan=2 ) 
GripSize() 
GripBorders() 
vobsub("K:\temp\VTS_01_VSUB_P1")
FaeryDust()
Convolution3D(preset="movieLQ") 
LegalClip() 

#Sampler(length=24) 
## MPEG size = ((Total frames/MovieTimeInMinutes)/24) * MPEG sample file size ##

And you'r result should be something like this: http://www.kvcd.net/redplanet-cq78-faery-c3d.mpg

-kwag

Jack · #3 01-17-2003, 05:43 PM

I know this sample and the avs but I think that won't work for me.

Because of this:

1.) I have to choose a height=576 instead of 480 (because of PAL)
2.) I have to tune up my min. bitrate to 650kb at least

I think in sum I ca'n fit the movie on 1 80 min CDR with this settings.

Please tell me that I'm wrong!

Jack · #4 01-17-2003, 05:52 PM

Now I'm using the template 'KVCD-CQ-352x576-_PAL_-PLUS' with the following settings:

min bitrate: 600
max bitrate: 2500
cq: 60

My Output is ca. 6,3 MB per minute --> 103 min * 6,3 MB = 649 MB M1V

BUT I'M VERY INTERESTING IN YOUR ANSWER TO MY SORROWS!

kwag · #5 01-17-2003, 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack

I know this sample and the avs but I think that won't work for me.

Because of this:

1.) I have to choose a height=576 instead of 480 (because of PAL)

Just change the 480 above to 576

Quote:

2.) I have to tune up my min. bitrate to 650kb at least

Not if you encode to MPEG-2 for your Pioneer DVD player.

Quote:

I think in sum I ca'n fit the movie on 1 80 min CDR with this settings.

Please tell me that I'm wrong!

Yes you're wrong

. By using file prediction, you can fit any movie you want in the number of CDs you want

-kwag

Jack · #6 01-20-2003, 03:21 AM

Yeeah! I made it. I used the SKVCD PAL MPEG2 Template and changed the width to 480. So I got a SVCD conform resolution.

min Bitrate: 500
max Bitrate: 2800
VBV Buffer: 64 (because I got Underflows with lower values!)
Audio: 160kb

It fits one CDR80 with this settings. I integrated the filters convolution3D and ....dust, LegalClip and the Grip-Functions.

nicksteel · #7 01-21-2003, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwag

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack

- Which Template should I use?

KVCDx3

Quote:

- I have to change the min bitrate to at least 600kb (Pioneer dv-444). Is that a problem?

Not really

Quote:

- Which Filters should I use?

Look at this as a framework:

Code:

LoadPlugin("C:\WINDOWS\System32\mpeg2dec3.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\encoding\fluxsmooth.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\encoding\GripFit_preview.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\encoding\blockbuster.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\encoding\legalclip.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\encoding\sampler.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\encoding\vobsub.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\encoding\convolution3d.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\encoding\dustv4.dll") 
Mpeg2Source("k:\temp\VTS__01_P01_1.d2v")
LegalClip() 
GripCrop( width=528, height=480, overscan=2 ) 
GripSize() 
GripBorders() 
vobsub("K:\temp\VTS_01_VSUB_P1")
FaeryDust()
Convolution3D(preset="movieLQ") 
LegalClip() 

#Sampler(length=24) 
## MPEG size = ((Total frames/MovieTimeInMinutes)/24) * MPEG sample file size ##

And you'r result should be something like this: http://www.kvcd.net/redplanet-cq78-faery-c3d.mpg

-kwag

I'm using this script for KVCDx3. The description for Sampler() shows 3 parameters. The #scrip line above shows one parameter.

Do I paste the above script into FitCD for size prediction and later for TMPGEnc (without size prediction section)?

Do I use Sampler() or the code produced by FitCD for size prediction?

kwag · #8 01-21-2003, 01:58 PM

Hi nicksteel,

Use the code above. Just change the Mpeg2Source line to point to your .d2v file and change the GripCrop to your target resolution. Use sampler like it is above. "Sampler(length=24) "

-kwag

nicksteel · #9 01-21-2003, 04:50 PM

If I want to use Telecide and Decimate from the Decomb package in my AVS script instead of Force Film in DVD2AVI to go from 29fps to 23fps, where would I place each in the AVS script?

SansGrip · #10 01-21-2003, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nicksteel

If I want to use Telecide and Decimate from the Decomb package in my AVS script instead of Force Film in DVD2AVI to go from 29fps to 23fps, where would I place each in the AVS script?

Place them first, i.e. right after the Mpeg2Source line.

Code:

Mpeg2Source("new_movie.d2v")
Telecide()
Decimate()
# Other filters here

nicksteel · #11 01-21-2003, 05:03 PM

Thanks. And, the TMPGEnc GOP answer is really " 1 12 2 1 24 " for latest KVCDx3 template?

SansGrip · #12 01-21-2003, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nicksteel

Thanks. And, the TMPGEnc GOP answer is really " 1 12 2 1 24 " for latest KVCDx3 template?

Technically it should be 1-7-2-1-24, but anything will work as long as it's greater than 6. Just download the latest template -- it's all set up correctly.

nicksteel · #13 01-22-2003, 01:28 PM

Ran the script as you said. I still get major blocks, especially on the opening credits which are stationary on a black background. Also, the motion is quite jerky. This is a Force Film from DVD2AVI muxed with BBMPEG. Testing an encode/mux with the standard TMPGEncPlus film template produces a smooth copy, but I still want the improved quality of KVCDx3. This is DVD low action source, but with some dark scenes.

I was wondering if my CyberHome 500 (same as 52

may be a problem. I viewed your new sample for KVCDx3 Mpeg1 file on the player and it worked ok. (I couldn't get the menu to work with/without PBC and had to burn with NERO as a mpg).

Also, could the bit rate be a problem for me and should I try MPEG2?

Are some versions of DVD2AVI, BBMPEG or TMPGEnc more stable than others.

KingTuk · #14 01-22-2003, 04:15 PM

I know some players need the audio to be 44100Hz
also when you burn the cd try lowering your write speed to 8x or lower

KVCDX3 Mpeg1 is the best choice

I use VCDEasy to burn the KVCD's
http://www.vcdeasy.org/

nicksteel · #15 01-22-2003, 04:45 PM

Would the audio rate affect the video quality?

I am burning with NERO at 4x to be safe.

If the audio rate doesn't affect the vidio quality, I don't know what to try, except to try another DVD.

nicksteel · #16 01-23-2003, 09:56 AM

I've given up on the film and am using another with more positive results. I do find that motion is about perfect with KVCDx3Mpeg2, jumpy with KVCDx3Mpeg1 on my CyberHome 500. I will use Mpeg2.

I feel my problems are more in muxing than templates. When I produce video only mpg with TEMPGEnc using KVCDx3, I have better results. I must be somehow screwing up BBMPEG.