Quantcast KVCD Request: Template Explained? - digitalFAQ.com Forums [Archives]
  #1  
07-13-2002, 05:46 PM
b00n b00n is offline
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Hey kwag:

It would be cool to have a Sticky thread, where you explain your chosen settings in a few words.

Although from what I gather the templates are nearly "finished", there are still some changes every now and then, and it's quite tough to follow the changes ("Output YUV as basic YCbCr..." is now unchecked for example - why?).

This would also give everyone who is trying the KVCD template for the first time some understanding of it...
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  #2  
07-13-2002, 08:32 PM
kwag kwag is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b00n
Hey kwag:

It would be cool to have a Sticky thread, where you explain your chosen settings in a few words.

Although from what I gather the templates are nearly "finished", there are still some changes every now and then, and it's quite tough to follow the changes ("Output YUV as basic YCbCr..." is now unchecked for example - why?).

This would also give everyone who is trying the KVCD template for the first time some understanding of it...
Hey b00n:

Most of the standard settings were set as they are by hundreds of encodes of a reference clip for consistency. Taking notes on the file sizes, blockiness, quality, etc, until they were peaked to the best size/quality.
The change for "Output YUV as basic YCbCr" was set to the default, as on TMPEG again. It's the user's choice to change that. It depends on what material they're trying to encode. The latest tests were that the file size is much smaller with the option "unchecked", even though the color space then fluctuates between 16-235 and not from 0-255. So it depends on what you're trying to encode. The Q. Matrix is another story. I did an analysis of the frequency domain, which corresponds to each block of the DCT on the 8x8 matrix, and played with some of the values based on the "default" Q.Matrix of TMPEG until I got what I wanted. The best source for that explanation is the book "Video Demystified" by Keith Jack. It has been the source for most of my MPEG information and education.

As for the beta templates, yes, they're finished! They're not beta anymore. I just havent changed the names on the page yet. Only the 352x480 will probably have minor changes, in order to try and optimize the file size. That's about it. The 352x240 should fit about any average 120 minute movie in a single CD, and the 704x480 in two CD's. The 352x480 is the problem!. If falls between the other two. So maybe it should be tweaked and split into two templates. One for one CD, and another one for two CD's. That's what I'm working on. So you'll have a 352x240 on one CD. Two 352x480's for one and two CD's, and the 704x480 for two CD's. The best, of course, is the 704x480. Same numbers apply to the PAL templates.
BTW: These betas are the new X2 templates.

Update: The betas are posted as the "Plus" templates"

-kwag
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07-14-2002, 12:44 PM
b00n b00n is offline
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Thanks for the detailed answer!

As for the 352x480(576) templates:
They should be fine for fitting 90 min movies to one CD I guess.
Or fitting monumental movies with ~3h playtime on 2 CDs.
It's the same ratio per cd, so I guess you don't have to make two different templates.

It's a matter of solving the task to fit the movie:
(a) lower resolution
(b) lower relative quality

You could just chose optimal quality for each resolution and chose the resolution according to the number of minutes you want to fit on one CD.

for example:
120 min per CD: 352x240
90 min per CD: 352x480
60 min per CD: 704x480

One would have to find the optimal trade-off between
(I) bitrate
(II) resolution
(III) quality/compression settings (quantization etc.)

And I guess you already did that with your templates, so a 80 min movie on one cd would look better with the 352x480 than with a "down-tweaked" 704x480 template.
On the other hand, a 60 min movie(-part) would look better with the 704x480 template than with an "up-tweaked" 352x480 template.
Since I only tested your standard PAL resolution template, I am not speaking from experience. I just wanted to share my "train of thought".

Guess it's time to buy myself a decent (=KVCD supporting ) DVD player.

Keep up the good work!

mfG, (German ~ "with friendly greetings")
b00n
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07-14-2002, 02:27 PM
kwag kwag is offline
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Thanks b00n!

And that's the way they'll go

120 min per CD: 352x240
90 min per CD: 352x480
60 min per CD: 704x480

I'm not going to mess around with the 352x480, to try to fit more space. The quality of the three templates as they are, is the best I've seen so far. So there's no sense in trying to tweak that middle template. The result would probably be less quality.

So you're right. I'll make a note about the suggested video size for each template, and update the download page.

Thanks,
-kwag
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