TMPGEnc: Mintek DVD-1600, [B]am I Encoding Correctly for Best Visual?

[mpierce]

As stated above, I have Mintek DVD-1600. I am ripping DVD then using DVD2AVI then on to TMPGEnc with KVCD templates 704X480 1CD or 704X480 2CD (NTSC).

I am happy with the results except for jitters that appear when there are quick vertical/horizontal movements/camera panning.

Questions:

1) How can I correct these jittery movements? I have encoded changing only the aspect ratio (to 16:9) and the frame rate (to 29.97) to get KVCD to play on the Mintek DVD-1600.

Should I change any other default KVCD template settings? I have read that perhaps the following can help:

*change the field setting from A>B to B>A
*change VBV to "o"- automatic
*change motion screen to high (not very high)
*change CQ value to something else (not going below 50 though)

Are these good suggestions? I don't want to be introducing too many variables to correct my problem noted above.

2) Which template is best? I mean what are the primary differences between the 704X480 1CD and 2CD templates- only the CQ values 50 vs. 70?

3) Is it possible to use only the 352X480 template and achieve a comparable level of quality while sidestepping these jitters and saving some CD-R space to boot (eg: increasing CQ?)

4) Last one, folks. Aspect ratios. Do I leave the AR alone after it first appears when I open up my .D2V file? Then change it to the desired AR in the next wizard screen when it prompts me for output information? If so, what is the best rule of thumb if you just want to copy the DVD as it is originally? (If the .D2V file is read as 4:3 NTSC, do I also enter 4:3 NTSC for output? I have been entering 16:9 mostly because that is how it is read by the DVD2AVI program.)

Sorry this is such a long post, but I just need a littlle feedback to put me on the right track.

Thanks.

100571

[kwag]

Let's try one thing first
Have you tried to encode at 23.976, and run your .m1v video file through pulldown.exe, and burn to CD and see if that works in your Mintel?

-kwag

[mpierce]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwag

Let's try one thing first
Have you tried to encode at 23.976, and run your .m1v video file through pulldown.exe, and burn to CD and see if that works in your Mintel?

-kwag

Hi Kwag.

Is this what you were referring to?

http://guiguy.wminds.com/downloads/pulldownbatchfe/

I'll give it a whirl and see.

Also, does the 4:3 mean that other aspect ratio settings are not necessary to adjust any longer (eg: 4:3, 16:9?)

Any feedback on questions 2 and 4 above.

Sorry for all the questions.

Thanks.

100571

[mpierce]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 100571

Quote:

Hi Kwag.

Is this what you were referring to?

http://guiguy.wminds.com/downloads/pulldownbatchfe/

I'll give it a whirl and see.

Also, does the 4:3 mean that other aspect ratio settings are not necessary to adjust any longer (eg: 4:3, 16:9?)

Any feedback on questions 2 and 4 above.

Sorry for all the questions.

Thanks.

100571

Meant to say does the 3:2 mean that other aspect ratio settings are not necessary to adjust any longer (eg: 4:3, 16:9?)

[kwag]

No. 3:2 has nothing to do with aspect ratio.
Here's the detailed explanation of what pulldown is:
http://www.zerocut.com/tech/pulldown.html

kwag

[mpierce]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwag

No. 3:2 has nothing to do with aspect ratio.
Here's the detailed explanation of what pulldown is:
http://www.zerocut.com/tech/pulldown.html

kwag

Thanks, Kwag. Very informative. I plan on testing your suggestions tonight. Would appreciate it if you could clarify the following before I get started though.

1) What are the primary differences between the 704X480 1CD and 2CD templates- only the CQ values 50 vs. 70?

2) Aspect ratios. Do I leave the AR alone after it first appears when I open up my .D2V file? Then change it to the desired AR in the next TMPGEnc wizard screen when it prompts me for output information? If so, what is the best rule of thumb if you just want to copy the DVD as it is originally? (If the .D2V file is read as 4:3 NTSC, do I also enter 4:3 NTSC for output? I have been entering 16:9 mostly because that is how it is read by the DVD2AVI program.)

Thanks a lot.

100571

[kwag]

1) The 1CD template is to fit your movie in one CD, and the 2CD template makes higher quality, but larger file size, so it has to fit in two CD's.

2) Use FitCD to open your .d2v, and that will automatically calculate the aspect, resizing, etc.

-kwag

[mpierce]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwag

Let's try one thing first
Have you tried to encode at 23.976, and run your .m1v video file through pulldown.exe, and burn to CD and see if that works in your Mintel?

-kwag

Hi Kwag,

Well, I used FitCd and AVIsynth to load a script into TMPGEnc. Used the 704x480 1cd template MPEG-1 @ 23.97fps. I then attempted to use PullDown.exe. Located the m1v file and selected the output destination. PullDown quickly opened a window and closed it before I could read anything. A new file in 29fps was never created. I then tried using every combination of inverse telecine and 3:2 pulldown in the advanced section of TMPGEnc, but to no avail. The image is now grainier than it was when originally encoding in 29 fps and the audio now skips when played back on my DVDstand alone.

Also, I was unable to encode using the MPEG-2 format in TMPGEnc.

Appreciate your help on the above.

Regards,
100571

[slab]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 100571

[edited quote]

I then attempted to use PullDown.exe. Located the m1v file and selected the output destination. PullDown quickly opened a window and closed it before I could read anything. 100571

Hi 100571,

Check the folder you created for pulldown... or search and find the file PulldownGUI.exe... Use this .exe instead, and enter your source and target files. This should work...Pulldown.exe is a command line executeable....

[mpierce]

Quote:

Originally Posted by slab

Quote:

Hi 100571,

Check the folder you created for pulldown... or search and find the file PulldownGUI.exe... Use this .exe instead, and enter your source and destination files. This should work...Pulldown.exe is a command line executeable....

Thanks, Slab.

I was using what appears to be a program similar to PDGUI called PullDownFE. This was not working. I found a beta version of PullDownGUI designed by Por_Que2k. Is this what you are using? If so, is there an updated version I should be aware of?

[slab]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 100571

Thanks, Slab.

I was using what appears to be a program similar to PDGUI called PullDownFE. This was not working. I found a beta version of PullDownGUI designed by Por_Que2k. Is this what you are using? If so, is there an updated version I should be aware of?

Hi 100571,

Yep...that's the one...I been testing with PulldownGUI-v1.0 beta 1 by Por_Que2k. I do not know if there is an updated version..A quick google search might prove me wrong...Unfortunately though, I have not had much success fixing my players unique problems with this utility...Better luck to you!

[mpierce]

Quote:

Originally Posted by slab

Quote:

Hi 100571,

Yep...that's the one...I been testing with PulldownGUI-v1.0 beta 1 by Por_Que2k. I do not know if there is an updated version..A quick google search might prove me wrong...Unfortunately though, I have not had much success fixing my players unique problems with this utility...Better luck to you!

Thanks for the replies; however, neither pulldown app wants to handle my mpeg file. They seem to want an m2v. Going back to my original post above, how can I eliminate the jerkiness I see during panning/fast movement scenes? Other than this, overall quality is superb.

Thanks.
100571

[slab]

Hi 100571

Quote:

Originally Posted by 100571

Thanks for the replies; however, neither pulldown app wants to handle my mpeg file. They seem to want an m2v. Going back to my original post above, how can I eliminate the jerkiness I see during panning/fast movement scenes? Other than this, overall quality is superb.

Thanks.
100571

I tested pulldown using the below method, this may not be the correct steps..but maybe others can shed more light on this topic.

1. TMPGEnc==>File=>MPEG Tools=>De-Mux
2. Double-click Video file.
3. Change .m1v ext to .m2v ext
4. Save destination file as .m2v.
5. PulldownGUI==>Open .m2v as source file
6. Set Target file=>Perform pulldown.
7. Remux Video/Audio files in bbMPEG.

I am not familar with your player, but you can also try encoding some tests using Pal resolutions within the NTSC template...ie (352x576, 704x576). Or, try encoding in MPEG-2, or @ 29.97fps, or demux/remux as mpeg-2, vbr or Min/Max adjustments...Finding your machines comfort zone requires time and testing. Lots of ways to try, search the board for other methods that may work for your player...Good Luck!

[mpierce]

Quote:

Originally Posted by slab

Hi 100571

Quote:

I tested pulldown using the below method, this may not be the correct steps..but maybe others can shed more light on this topic.

1. TMPGEnc==>File=>MPEG Tools=>De-Mux
2. Double-click Video file.
3. Change .m1v ext to .m2v ext
4. Save destination file as .m2v.
5. PulldownGUI==>Open .m2v as source file
6. Set Target file=>Perform pulldown.
7. Remux Video/Audio files in bbMPEG.

I am not familar with your player, but you can also try encoding some tests using Pal resolutions within the NTSC template...ie (352x576, 704x576). Or, try encoding in MPEG-2, or @ 29.97fps, or demux/remux as mpeg-2, vbr or Min/Max adjustments...Finding your machines comfort zone requires time and testing. Lots of ways to try, search the board for other methods that may work for your player...Good Luck!

Thanks, Slab.

Actually, I did finally get PullDownGUI to work. I used TMPGEnc Demux as you described, but did not need to rename the .m1v file, just locate it using the "all files *.*" feature when browsing for the input file. I then Remuxed using TMPGEnc (MPEG-1). I was elated to accomplish this much, but then the euphoria ended abruptly upon learning that my audio was now out of sych.

Questions:

1) Is it necessary to Remux in MPEG-2, then burn as a non-compliant VCD?

2) Or/and will using bbMPG address any audio synch issues that occur during Remux?

Thanks again for any further input you and other can provide.

Regards,
100571

[srsstvs]

The jittery movements that you mentioned earlier, is it like the fuzzy "lines" around the moving characters and/or objects? I got that (if we are talking about the same effects), using the same programs you are using, as well. You can even see it around Dream Works title when it moving across the screen. I've tried increasing the max. bitrate and CQ but still getting them, althouth the movies are NOT blocky at all, just fuzzy whenever movements and/or camera movements occure. Again, I'm talking about directly ripping and converting from DVDs. There must be some settings under Advanced tab that we should check that will get rid of the fuzziness(jittery). I hope somebody could show us how. By the way, I'm using Mintek 1600, too.

As for aspect ratio question, I had problem getting them what I wanted at the beginning, but finally figure it out how to get what I want. It all depends on three settings: one under VIDEO tab, two under ADVANCED tab. For 16:9 from DVD rip, if you want to keep the output to 16:9 then under VIDEO aspect set to 4:3, under ADVANCED set to source to 16:9 (either display or 525line), and select FULL SCREEN (keep aspect ratio). If your source is downloaded and in widescreen display that doesn't mean the SOURCE aspect ratio is 16:9, it'll not work.

The best way to check what you'll get before you encode it is go to ADVANCED, double click on CLICK FRAME that will bring up another window, then click on ARRANGE SETTING and use the mouse to click, hold and slide the slider to the right to show the movie, what you see now is what you'll get!!! Now you can go back to play the combination game under those three settings that I mentioned above and come back to check the output. With practice you'll get it, once you get it just hit cancel and go back to encode it. I still wish someone could help solve the jittery/fuzziness issue.