Quantcast Mencoder: MencoderME MPEG1 Quality Results. - digitalFAQ.com Forums [Archives]
  #1  
05-05-2004, 11:38 AM
Prodater64 Prodater64 is offline
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I was encode already several movies with MencodeMe and I can see that:

(Avisynth + TMPGEnc + mpeg1 + 1Pass encoding) better than (Avisynth + MencodeMe + mpeg1 + 2Pass encoding)

Despite that, I still prefer MencodeMe, I forget any thing about file size prediction, and it is quicker than TMPGEnc. But for purists in the matter...
I think that suffer same quality loss, in mpeg1, than ffvfw with libavcodec.
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  #2  
05-05-2004, 12:00 PM
kwag kwag is offline
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Hi Prodater64,

If you try (AviSynth + MencodeMe + mpeg-2 + ( 1 or 2 Pass encoding)), you'll find out that mencoder's MPEG-2 is better that TMPEG's MPEG-1
So right now, quality wise, mencoder (libavcodec) is the best, even better than TMPEG's MPEG-1, for low bitrates too.

-kwag
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  #3  
05-05-2004, 01:44 PM
black prince black prince is offline
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Kwag wrote:
Quote:
Hi Prodater64,

If you try (AviSynth + MencodeMe + mpeg-2 + ( 1 or 2 Pass encoding)), you'll find out that mencoder's MPEG-2 is better that TMPEG's MPEG-1
So right now, quality wise, mencoder (libavcodec) is the best, even better than TMPEG's MPEG-1, for low bitrates too.

-kwag
I haven't even gotten MEncoderME to produce a working mpeg-1 with
or without avisynth, 1 or 2 pass, etc. I don't believe it can If we
compare mpeg-1 with MEncoder vs Tmpgenc that couldn't be true
If MEncoder can take mpeg-2 and compress a movie that uses the same
file size as low bitrate mpeg-1, than that is an amazing thing. But no one
has claimed this and even suggested that it can.


Prodater64 wrote:
Quote:
Prodater64 Posted: Wed May 05, 2004 12:38 pm Post subject: MencoderMe mpeg1 quality results.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I was encode already several movies with MencodeMe and I can see that:

(Avisynth + TMPGEnc + mpeg1 + 1Pass encoding) better than (Avisynth + MencodeMe + mpeg1 + 2Pass encoding)

Despite that, I still prefer MencodeMe, I forget any thing about file size prediction, and it is quicker than TMPGEnc. But for purists in the matter...
I think that suffer same quality loss, in mpeg1, than ffvfw with libavcodec.
I agree I you are comparing, mpeg-1, Tmpgenc is still the
winner I've always gotten better picture quality with mpeg-2,
but file size and stand alone player compatibility are issues.

-BP
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  #4  
05-05-2004, 02:03 PM
kwag kwag is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by black prince
If MEncoder can take mpeg-2 and compress a movie that uses the same
file size as low bitrate mpeg-1, than that is an amazing thing. But no one
has claimed this and even suggested that it can.
But I already did

Look:
http://www.kvcd.net/payback.mpeg2.mpg.cut.37.mpg

And yesterday:
http://www.kvcd.net/shell.mpg.cut.18.mpg

Full movie at 704x480 on one CD-R, encoded with MencodeME, MPEG-2, using "DVD" filter combo, muxed and burned as SVCD.

-kwag
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  #5  
05-05-2004, 02:05 PM
Prodater64 Prodater64 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kwag
Hi Prodater64,
If you try (AviSynth + MencodeMe + mpeg-2 + ( 1 or 2 Pass encoding)), you'll find out that mencoder's MPEG-2 is better that TMPEG's MPEG-1
I already know this.



Quote:
Originally Posted by kwag
So right now, quality wise, mencoder (libavcodec) is the best, even better than TMPEG's MPEG-1, for low bitrates too.
I don't knew this.
Does it mean that I must to use (quality wise) "AviSynth + MencodeMe + mpeg2", even for low bitrates?
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  #6  
05-05-2004, 02:35 PM
kwag kwag is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prodater64
Does it mean that I must to use (quality wise) "AviSynth + MencodeMe + mpeg2", even for low bitrates?
Just make a quick test, without any filters.
Try TMPEG MPEG-1 and Mencoder MPEG-2 on low bitrates, targeting same file size.
You'll see mencoder's MPEG-2 is better than TMPEG's MPEG-1.
So when you add filters, either AviSynth or mencoder's internal filters, you'll get even better results.

-kwag
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  #7  
05-05-2004, 03:03 PM
Prodater64 Prodater64 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kwag
Just make a quick test, without any filters.
Try TMPEG MPEG-1 and Mencoder MPEG-2 on low bitrates, targeting same file size.
-kwag
I don't know how make it.
1 - Run a sample with tmpgenc cq 100 mpeg1.

2 - How can I calculate same file size with mencodeme (maybe with calcumatic, I give it a file size and it give me a bitrate, or in mencodeme I can select file size too?)

3 - Run a sample with mencodeme and compare.
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  #8  
05-05-2004, 03:25 PM
sertinell sertinell is offline
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hello
Quote:
2 - How can I calculate same file size with mencodeme (maybe with calcumatic, I give it a file size and it give me a bitrate, or in mencodeme I can select file size too?)
You only have to calculate the average bitrate for mencoder. If you don't know:

Quote:
FILESIZE*1024*8/seconds
Filesize in MB
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  #9  
05-05-2004, 06:52 PM
bigggt bigggt is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kwag
Full movie at 704x480 on one CD-R, encoded with MencodeME, MPEG-2, using "DVD" filter combo, muxed and burned as SVCD
Sorry to be a dumb a*s but If i want to put a movie on 1 cdr but use your method what do i have to chage,can i use 528x480.

What do i do

1.Use ma script through makeavis
2.Select dvd filtering combo
3.1 cd KSVCD
4.What bitrate -the average from cq matic
5.Do i need to change max bitrate

I also haven't had the best luck using mpeg1 with mencoder and tmpge has been far better for me so i would like to try this method but don't know where to start.

Thanx
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  #10  
05-05-2004, 06:58 PM
vmesquita vmesquita is offline
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@bigggt

When using a fake avi generated by Avisynth, use only the "no filtering" combo and the MakeAVIIS profile, any other will resize the video and you already done that in the script.
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  #11  
05-05-2004, 06:58 PM
kwag kwag is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigggt

Sorry to be a dumb a*s
Only if you didn't ask
Quote:
but If i want to put a movie on 1 cdr but use your method what do i have to chage,can i use 528x480.
yes
Quote:

What do i do

1.Use ma script through makeavis
You can do that.
Quote:
2.Select dvd filtering combo
Yes. If you selected some filters in AviSynth, then select "No Filter" as filter combo.
Quote:
3.1 cd KSVCD
Yep.
Quote:
4.What bitrate -the average from cq matic
Exactly
Quote:
5.Do i need to change max bitrate
It's already set to 2,500 by MencoderME
Quote:

I also haven't had the best luck using mpeg1 with mencoder and tmpge has been far better for me so i would like to try this method but don't know where to start.

Thanx
If your player supports SVCD, you'll be fine when you encode with the KSVCD setting in MencoderME

-kwag
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  #12  
05-05-2004, 07:00 PM
kwag kwag is offline
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  #13  
05-05-2004, 07:13 PM
bigggt bigggt is offline
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Thanx guys

Quote:
Originally Posted by VM
When using a fake avi generated by Avisynth, use only the "no filtering" combo and the MakeAVIIS profile, any other will resize the video and you already done that in the script.
AFter reading your post all i can do is shake my head at myself I need a good once in a while,i don't know how many times i have read this in the past

Anyway i guess that brings up my next question if using mpeg2 to fit on 1 cd are you getting better results with the dvd filter combo(mencoders filters) or through using the ma script with fake avi
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  #14  
05-05-2004, 07:17 PM
kwag kwag is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigggt
Anyway i guess that brings up my next question if using mpeg2 to fit on 1 cd are you getting better results with the dvd filter combo(mencoders filters) or through using the ma script with fake avi
If your movie is an action movie, you'll get better results using the MA script, making a .avs script, and using MakeAVIs.
It it's a low action movie, or a movie that doesn't contain many fast action scenes, then use Mencoder's internal filters, because encoding speed will be FAR faster than using any AviSYnth script combination.

-kwag
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  #15  
05-05-2004, 07:32 PM
bigggt bigggt is offline
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Thanx Karl
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  #16  
05-05-2004, 11:59 PM
black prince black prince is offline
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@Kwag,

Wow kwag I didn't know that. I have several movies I'll try
right now. Most KSVCD's work great on my stand-alone-player.
This is getting exciting I 've got to think more outside the box

-BP
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  #17  
05-06-2004, 06:20 AM
Jellygoose Jellygoose is offline
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So if you encode at an Ultra-Low-Bitrate in MPEG-2 with 352x288 VCD resolution... Would you mux the file as VCD or SVCD?
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  #18  
05-06-2004, 07:35 PM
bigggt bigggt is offline
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I tried making a test with SKVCD and have a few more questions.

Do i need to use pulldown

2.I loaded the mpv file into avicodec and it says its mpeg1 ,shouldn't it be mpeg2

Thanx
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  #19  
05-07-2004, 07:12 PM
bigggt bigggt is offline
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Ok thought i would post my first results

avi filter 1 cd kscvd ,i had a lot of errors in the log something like duplicate frames or something(frogot to copy it) but when i muxed it seems to be pretty good.

Anyway the video is quite good but not as good as tmpge(at least so far)

I am going to try a dvd now and see

BTW i did a 2 pass which took about 5 hours which in tmpge this movie took me 10 hours.
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  #20  
05-08-2004, 12:28 PM
digitall.doc digitall.doc is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigggt
...avi filter 1 cd kscvd ,i had a lot of errors in the log something like duplicate frames or something(frogot to copy it)...
I don't remember having an error like this... does it also say something about DCT coefficient?, I guess no, this is another kind of error.
Remember, if DCT coefficients error, that you can try raising VBV value.
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