Video8/Hi8 transfer with Digital8?

Denicio · #1 03-01-2021, 11:27 AM

Greetings!

I am a new member and have a super nerdy question.

I have boxes of Video8 and Hi8 tapes that i need to transfer. I typically use Sony Vegas for editing and capture. Once upon a time i had a Canopus box but that was Pre Windows 10 days. The canopus box is long long gone (lost in a move).

I have seen lists of many Sony Dig8 cameras that can playback analog tapes. What i need to know is that are there any Sony Digital cameras that not only play the tape (on the unit its self) but also convert it and allow the analog signal to pass through to a digital output so i can import it into my computer?

If what i am looking for in a sony Dig8 camcorder does not exist, what are the semi pro options out there? I see a sea of USB devices that break out to RCA cables. They look cheap and almost all the reviews are terrible. I am looking for a semi pro option so i dont mind spending 500 or less on a solution.

Any help is greatly appreciated!

Thanks
Denicio

lordsmurf · #2 03-01-2021, 11:37 AM

It does exist, but quality is reduced. It's DV conversion, 1990s tech.

Better is a quality capture card to get lossless files. Quality cards are discussed here, some folks also have some available in the marketplace subforum. Don't buy Easycraps or Elgatos, or HD cards or gamer cards.

Some form of TBC is required.

Denicio · #3 03-01-2021, 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lordsmurf

It does exist, but quality is reduced. It's DV conversion, 1990s tech.

Better is a quality capture card to get lossless files. Quality cards are discussed here, some folks also have some available in the marketplace subforum. Don't buy Easycraps or Elgatos, or HD cards or gamer cards.

Some form of TBC is required.

LordSmurf,

Thanks for the reply. Yeah, the Elgato's and other Flashdrive looking devices all look like utter garbage!

I dont mind spending some money on a good device. Just need one that transfers well and plays nice with Sony Vegas.

Do you have a greatest hits list you could share?

lordsmurf · #4 03-01-2021, 11:45 AM

It depends on OS.
Win10? If so, options are limited, but not gone.

Denicio · #5 03-01-2021, 11:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lordsmurf

It depends on OS.
Win10? If so, options are limited, but not gone.

Yes, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit.

I have seen some people mention the Blackmagic Intensity 4K. Price is right but some folks complain about audio sync and other say its fan sounds like a Cessna single prop plane! Its price is right. But i truly want something that i can install and then not worry about.

My old Canopus ADVC-100 use to be this reliable. Its long gone. Seems the market for such boxes is totally gone. Sigh

latreche34 · #6 03-01-2021, 12:13 PM

Intensity shuttle cannot work alone, you need an external frame TBC to go with it. DV boxes worked fine in the hay day with no audio sync or dropped frames I still have my old captures but DV quality is not for permanent archiving.

The only thing worked as DV capture flow in terms of stability but produced lossless AVI are pro SDI capture devices, Just install a SDI interface on your computer like you would with a firewire card and connect the VCR to the capture device like you do to the Canopus (Some like to call them converters) and start capturing, Such devices are hard to find and they are no longer cheap like they use to when no one knew how they work back then.

lordsmurf · #7 03-01-2021, 12:13 PM

Blackmagic is an HD cards made for HD sources, and does poorly with SD. Non-reported dropped frames, leading to sync issues, black frames, and more.

dpalomaki · #8 03-01-2021, 09:15 PM

Many D8 devices that can read Hi8/Video8 tapes can output the signal; either as DV or as S-VIDEO.

The DV signal is not preferred due to 4:2:0 or 4:1:1 sampling compared to the preferred 4:2:2 sampling. However, the DV chroma bandwidth still exceeds what is produced by consumer analog tape. It just is not great for complex processing of the signal as in restoration.

The BM Intensity Pro 4K has issues with black levels especially component signals, and expects a good, solid signal with proper sync pulses. The IP4K fan issue was with early production. It was corrected with later production. I have one, the PC case fans are louder. I've mainly used it for HDMI capture. For analog SD capture the original Intensity Pro was better if you have a good input signal. I do not recall any audio sync problems with it, but bad signals or a slow PC storage may well result in some.

On a Win10 box I am trying the BM Analog-to-SDI mini Converter with an SDI Mini Recorder. But it does not like super whites (over 100 IRE) or ultra blacks (below 7.5 IRE for NTSC).

latreche34 · #9 03-01-2021, 10:07 PM

Dpalomaki, Do you remember if the original UltraStudio analog to SDI (I think that was the name, not intensity) ever made in USB3? or just thunderbolt? I don't have thunderbolt and I was told that they do great captures despite the lack of TBC, I don't even think that any of Black Magic capture devices have built in TBC that's why I prefer Ensemble Designs.

Denicio · #10 03-02-2021, 08:27 AM

Thanks to all who have contributed with answers to this thread. I have discovered that my Sony TRV38 Mini DV allows passthrough of analog signal. So i am now tasked with the quest to find an OEM Sony 1394 cable as mine has flown the coop.

The TRV38 is paid for as are my Video8 machines. So all told this will cost me the price of a new PCIe Firewire card (20.00) and OEM Cables. For transferring family videos, this will do fine (i hope)

bookemdano · #11 03-02-2021, 08:54 AM

Totally up to you, but you don't need a Sony-branded firewire cable. 1394 is an international standard so any functional 4-pin to 6-pin (or 9-pin if the PCIe card you're buying has Firewire 800 connectors) will work fine.

So something like this:

4-pin to 6-pin: https://www.amazon.com/axGear-IEEE-F.../dp/B019GQMYTS

or this:

4-pin to 9-pin: https://www.amazon.com/Pasow-FireWir.../dp/B087RH9JX8

Not endorsing either one--you can find many others on amazon, ebay, etc.

Denicio · #12 03-02-2021, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bookemdano

Totally up to you, but you don't need a Sony-branded firewire cable. 1394 is an international standard so any functional 4-pin to 6-pin (or 9-pin if the PCIe card you're buying has Firewire 800 connectors) will work fine.

So something like this:

4-pin to 6-pin: https://www.amazon.com/axGear-IEEE-F.../dp/B019GQMYTS

or this:

4-pin to 9-pin: https://www.amazon.com/Pasow-FireWir.../dp/B087RH9JX8

Not endorsing either one--you can find many others on amazon, ebay, etc.

WHY was i under the impression that Sony pulled 'an apple' and made their cables proprietary?

Doesnt the A/V analog cable have some odd config?

So ANY 1394 cable will work with sony?

bookemdano · #13 03-02-2021, 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denicio

WHY was i under the impression that Sony pulled 'an apple' and made their cables proprietary?

Haha--for good reason! Sony and Apple both have long had a love affair with proprietary cables/connectors. Interestingly, Sony and Apple were the two biggest contributors of patents to the 1394 standard. But since it's a standard, everyone uses the same connectors.

Quote:

Doesnt the A/V analog cable have some odd config?

If it's a breakout cable then it very well could have a non-standard pinout. My Handycam has full-size S-Video, Composite and Audio connectors but I know as camcorders got smaller manufacturers had to resort to dongles to squeeze everything in.

Quote:

So ANY 1394 cable will work with sony?

Yep.

Denicio · #14 03-02-2021, 09:17 AM

Many thanks for your detailed reply and ALL the valuable information.

I happen to have a 'mystery' 4 to 6 pin firewire cable this very moment. No idea where it came from. Sounds like it just got a new lease on life!!!

latreche34 · #15 03-02-2021, 03:09 PM

Sony called their version of video data transfer over firewire iLink but it actually uses exactly a 4pin firewire cable a non powered version of the usual 6pin that carries power.

dpalomaki · #16 03-08-2021, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Do you remember if the original UltraStudio analog to SDI (I think that was the name, not intensity) ever made in USB3?

No, not familiar with the device.

On A/V cables: many camcorders used a special A/V cable that had 3 RCA connectors at one end (composite video, L & R audio) at one end and a four-conductor mini phone plug at the other end (tip, 2 rings, sleeve). In some cables I've see the tip was connected to yellow RCA (video) on others the ring next to the tip was connected to the yellow RCA. Typically it is the left audio (white) and composite video (yellow) that are mixed. You need to know you gear, and maybe swap the white/yellow connection to get it right if you cable does not match your gear.

Firewire, i.Link, and Lynx are Apple, Sony, and TI names for IEEE1394. IEEE1394 came in several variants over time, Firewire 400 being the one commonly supported by camcorders.