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07-27-2019, 01:05 PM
dima dima is offline
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Do you know from experience and your knowledge of some technical problems of these two devices, which they can't overcome when capturing from a VHS cassette onto a digital file to the AVI (HuffYUV) file in the PAL standard (720 x 576) - for conversion using ATI AIW USB as a capturing device, and to save the captured program signal: VirtualDub ?

I mean, for example, that when the VHS tape is in bad condition (or partially destroyed) and snow, the signal is weak or even disappears completely for some time (for example a damaged piece of tape) that one of these devices turns off, does it stop working, record it or it has problems with synchronizing the captured sound with the image later ?

[In my experience, devices such as: EasyCap capturing to MPEG-2(to AVI and some lossless codec probably too - I didn't checked it) in PAL standard (720 x 576) don't have any problems with it, that is, they capture elegantly "how it flies", without sound shifts or stop recording - it simply records what it is - even "nothing" if the signal "breaks" because of the tape.
I hope devices and programs with a better reputation in terms of what image quality can guarantee, such problems also don't have - such as ATI AIW USB and VirtualDub.]
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07-27-2019, 11:34 PM
sanlyn sanlyn is offline
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EasyCrap looks horrible. No talent whatsoever for retaining bright specular data, imbeds oversharpening effects and other noisy defects everywhere, and has the worst color I ever saw. But if you like it and don't trust anyone's experience with ATI, then use EasyCrap and be done with it. My experience and that of others with ATI's USB cards is that they clip blacks at y=16. I have a lot of tapes that require good shadow detail and have many dim interior or night scenes, so anything that clips blacks before the signal enters VirtualDub won't be suitable. The Hauppauge USB Live-2 does the same thing. The three capture cards that I use (AIW 7500 AGP, AIW 9600XT AGP, Diamond VC500 USB) don't have that problem and they all look pretty much alike with most tapes, with the 9600 having the cleanest color (if you look hard and long enough).
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07-28-2019, 02:22 AM
dima dima is offline
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I wouldn't like to work with EasyCap(if it is worse than other devices). I gave EasyCap as an example of what I'm writing about quoting below.

What I would like to know the most about this(ATI AIW USB and VirtualDub) is:
"[...] I mean, for example, that when the VHS tape is in bad condition (or partially destroyed) and snow, the signal is weak or even disappears completely for some time (for example a damaged piece of tape) that one of these devices turns off, does it stop working, record it or it has problems with synchronizing the captured sound with the image later ? [...]"
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  #4  
07-28-2019, 02:25 AM
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lordsmurf lordsmurf is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dima View Post
Do you know from experience and your knowledge of some technical problems of these two devices
Two devices? You only mention one (ATI AIW USB).
VirtualDub isn't a device, but software.
Neither should have problems.

Quote:
I mean, for example, that when the VHS tape is in bad condition (or partially destroyed) and snow, the signal is weak or even disappears completely for some time (for example a damaged piece of tape) that one of these devices turns off, does it stop working, record it or it has problems with synchronizing the captured sound with the image later ?
I think I understand this. These capture cards, at least with TBC in the mix, will record snow, or noise, or signal, or whatever is present. Without a TBC, it really depends, behavior can vary.

Quote:
[In my experience, devices such as: EasyCap capturing to MPEG-2(to AVI and some lossless codec probably too - I didn't checked it) in PAL standard (720 x 576) don't have any problems with it, that is, they capture elegantly "how it flies", without sound shifts or stop recording - it simply records what it is - even "nothing" if the signal "breaks" because of the tape.
Anything that doesn't choke an EZcap shouldn't choke an ATI either.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sanlyn View Post
EasyCrap looks horrible. No talent whatsoever for retaining bright specular data, imbeds oversharpening effects and other noisy defects everywhere, and has the worst color I ever saw. But if you like it and don't trust anyone's experience with ATI, then use EasyCrap and be done with it.
He's already aware of Easycap problems, and is seeking better.

Quote:
I have a lot of tapes that require good shadow detail and have many dim interior or night scenes, so anything that clips blacks before the signal enters VirtualDub won't be suitable.
Diamond VC500 USB) don't have that problem
I find that strange, because for me VC500 was always a dark capture. I think the issue is mid-production changes in the VC500, and you have a good one from early on, and I have a not-great one from later. BTW, there are at least 3 variations of ATI 600 USB, and I've only seen clipping on one version. That one is actually more rare in my experience.

Stuff like this makes video more of a headache, doesn't it.

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07-28-2019, 02:57 AM
dima dima is offline
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Thank you for your response.

Quote:
"Two devices? You only mention one (ATI AIW USB).
VirtualDub isn't a device, but software."
Yes this is my mistake, it should be talking about one device and one software.
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07-28-2019, 12:27 PM
jwillis84 jwillis84 is offline
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I think PAL vs NTSC (IRE) levels may play a role is this discussion.

The OP is performing PAL (I think) which starts at IRE 0.

Sanlyn seems to be warning that the ATI AIW USB favors IRE 16, for the North American version that may be true, even when set for PAL-B/G. I would "guess" its a function of the Tuner output being IRE 16 since the broadcast standard in North America is IRE 16.

I do not have a PAL version of the ATI AIW USB to try this theory out.. but I do have PAL sources.. it would be a long process, and I think I would have to put it on a waveform scope to be sure. But (for certain) there are two different versions of the ATI AIW USB, the 2.0N and I assume its called the 2.0P

I know on hexanator or a website like that in the UK they pre-reviewed a PAL version and it had pictures with the typical PAL country RF connector, very different from the North American threaded F-type Connector.

If the Input filters are similarly optimized for the NTSC or PAL country zones (really only two) then having its IRE dynamic range customized for those zones would make a lot of sense.

This could have been handled with "software" I assume.. but ATI was mostly about optimizing things in hardware.. which to their credit made things somewhat more reliable.. where the software was flexible. That is it would be more flexible in keeping the manufacturing costs down. The later VC500 could well be IRE range selectable when NTSC or PAL are selected. I have not seen similar separate reviews of a VC500 NTSC and VC500 PAL versions. They could be hardware optimized.. or simply software optimized for their IRE range.

I've never seen an actual ATI AIW USB2.0(P) for sale anywhere.. they got good reviews from the UK and Germany, but were probably tossed a long time ago. The 220 volt power supplies would have been more rare and perhaps not as easy to replace as the 110 volt versions.

In fact it wasn't until this last year I surmised these ATI AIW USB boxes were mostly still viable.. it was their external wall/mains adapters that failed and introduced noise into them as they were failing. Other people may have figured this out earlier.. but i may be the last man on earth to get the message.

I'm really curious about [one] report of an ATI AIW USB that had an audio input failure.. which is the (only) report I have ever heard on these.. but I don't have that box to test with. I have one that seems dead but its the only one I've seen in like a dozen.. one day I'll try to troubleshoot it and figure out which component failed.. or if the user tried to modify it.

Last edited by jwillis84; 07-28-2019 at 12:41 PM.
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  #7  
07-28-2019, 04:55 PM
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sanlyn refers to 600, not AIW.
AIW USB is fine for PAL and NTSC, the power supply is universal.

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