Time base correctors bargains, repair parts units?

[RayNotes]

I'm on the hunt for a bargain (which is part of the fun for me) to add a TBC to my transfer setup. I realize the fan favorite is the Datavideo TBC-1000. These sell for over $2k. I'd like to find something in the $500 or less range.

What are the odds something like this actually works but the seller just has no way to test it?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/165004580719

I.e., were the IVT-7s prone to actual failure? I realize a lot of vintage equipment die due to component failure (like blown caps, etc.) but I'm not familiar enough with these devices to know which ones were likely to fail and which ones are likely to keep running forever like tanks.

I also saw a recent auctions for the green AVT-8710 which was listed as untested, parts only. Again, having no experience with them, do they fail and if so, are they able to be brought back to life by replacing a few capacitors? Perhaps there's already a thread that covers all these questions.

[RobustReviews]

It's not expensive, and doesn't hurt your wallet too much - I'd be inclined to try it.

We use For.A rack mount units with most video tape transfers (most analogue formats) and they perform especially well despite the opinions of some on here. They need carefully setting up, and having read some remarks on here and other places about their shortcomings I would chalk a few of them up to the people testing them not appreciating often they are not 'plug and play' devices. I can not speak for this model though, I have never used one.

If they're designed to straighten out original UMatic, they'll ostensibly be fine with a comparatively very clean VHS or a similar source, as a few of us have pointed out, 'professional' videotapes often contain considerably more timing errors than professional tapes - hence most professional machines needed a rack of equipment to get anything useful out of the player. The player was just a part of a small rack of equipment it was designed to be used alongside.

It has a standard domestic SVideo input so there's clearly a signed intention from the manufacturer at least that it could be used with a domestic source.

I would suggest looking up a manual and checking the specifications, application recommendations and any caveats/setup information available, but if you want a gamble, you may get lucky.

I can not say this will work brilliantly, but at 1/20 the cost of other units, you never know! The main issue with buying ex-pro gear are often very long (as in 24-7) operating times which may need the PSU has now relaxed a bit and may need some work, usual electronics caveats apply as with any other device.

If not, sell it again.

[RobustReviews]

Just to add, the user manual I found explicitly states it can be used with VHS.

It does have a range of critical and theory-laden adjustments though, this is beyond the scope of this quick post.

However, the manual is from 1990 so this is an old device (or model at least) - nothing inherently wrong with that, they're a lot more repairable than a prosumer TBC, but we're getting in the territory where component specification could be wandering.

It can 'freewheel' and use an internal sync' generator which is good, so there's no issues there - another indicator that non-professional video was in-mind at least.

Again, I clarify, I'm throwing out general points - I can't speak as to this model.

[lordsmurf]

Quote:

Originally Posted by RayNotes

I'm on the hunt for a bargain (which is part of the fun for me) to add a TBC to my transfer setup. .... These sell for over $2k. I'd like to find something in the $500 or less range.

For what VCR? For example, I have some that will play nice with specific items, like AG-1980, but not with others. Since those are more limited in use case, I'm open more to pricing.

Quote:

What are the odds something like this actually works but the seller just has no way to test it?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/165004580719
I.e., were the IVT-7s prone to actual failure? I realize a lot of vintage equipment die due to component failure (like blown caps, etc.) but I'm not familiar enough with these devices to know which ones were likely to fail and which ones are likely to keep running forever like tanks.

Odds are extremely high that these units are fubar and irreparable. These come from heavy-use abusive environments. The sellers of the TBCs wouldn't know a TBC from a toaster, no idea what it does, no idea how it should work. They just see $$$ with a quick Google + eBay sold search, and then list it for big bucks.

Some of these things aren't even worth $10. Many are only good for scrapping to recycle for the metal content, it's e-waste. Yes, that is a shame, but given the two opposite options ($$$ vs scrap, the latter wins, not worth $$$ as a not-guaranteed not-working unit). That only happens off-eBay, low costs, shipping only, or even outright gifting. I do this with some others, including some forum members. The on-eBay is just gear whoring, and quality of the gear is about the quality of whore (yucky).

Most rackmount ("pizza box") units are crap, but the IVT-7 can be an exception to the rule. It was a much later unit, and the manual has specific mentions of consumer analog sources and tweaks.

Quote:

I also saw a recent auctions for the green AVT-8710 which was listed as untested, parts only. Again, having no experience with them, do they fail and if so, are they able to be brought back to life by replacing a few capacitors?

You have to be careful with AVT-8710. Only green units are good (almost all of them ... almost), but only if the unit is not damaged. Damage is easy, as these would overheat easily, plastic with no heatsinks. That caused permanent damage. This is a major reason green units no longer exist, all of them over 14 years old now.

The latter black units were just as bad, but made with flawed chipsets. So even a good-condition unit was crap.

eBay has shysters, and in recent years buttholes would put black boards in green cases. Newbies didn't know this, naive.

So anything on eBay is suspect. Avoid the "for parts" auctions on these units, as it's almost guaranteed to be broken or shenanigans. Only buy if cheap. And $500 ain't cheap, not for these, unknown, likely bad. Pure gambling, and odds are heavy against you.

AVT-8710 cannot be fixed easily, if at all, not mere caps. Total board teardown and chip replacement, not for novices.

Quote:

Perhaps there's already a thread that covers all these questions.

Some yes, including some that are 10+ years old now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RobustReviews

It's not expensive, and doesn't hurt your wallet too much - I'd be inclined to try it.

That can be a stupid proposition if you don't have high level knowledge of the device. That IVT-7 isn't really cheap at $125 + shipping + tax, given that it likely has major issue, if working at all. I know this gear. Uphill battle there.

Quote:

comparatively very clean VHS

This almost exclusively means SP mode camcorder masters, and played by in Panasonic gear with field TBCs before the frame TBC. Not VCR-made tapes, not copies of copies, not EP tapes, etc. Very narrow in scope. If that's all you get, then I'm sure it does work decent for you. Also noting that PAL VHS is way more stable than NTSC, in general.

Quote:

I would suggest looking up a manual

A lot of manuals are not available. I need to scan my IVT-7 manual, because it's not online anywhere. That's just the user manual, too. No service manual, and one may not exist (NDA, common for TBCs).

Quote:

If not, sell it again.

But you may be the only person on the entire internet dumb enough to buy it. That's a problem, especially with bargain-seeking newbies (even ones with extensive backgrounds in electronics and related). I've seen that so many times in the past 10 years especially. "Good luck with that" is a phrase I've written more than once. And yes, I frequently hear back from the buyer, almost always bad news. Rarely anything good.

I can appreciate bargain hunting, but you can't be a knee-jerk FOMO goober. That's simply a fool being parted with his money, not even smart gambling.

[RobustReviews]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lordsmurf

That can be a stupid proposition if you don't have high-level knowledge of the device. That IVT-7 isn't really cheap at $125 + shipping + tax, given that it likely has a major issue if working at all. I know this gear. Uphill battle there.

Ah, I forgot tax, that's not how the rest of the world do things, and that confuses many of us non-US people when we visit! I still can't grasp buying an item from a shop and the price on the shelf being different from that at the counter when I visit the States, which has always been a pleasure.

Put that down to perspective.

Quote:

This almost exclusively means SP mode camcorder masters, and played by in Panasonic gear with field TBCs before the frame TBC. Not VCR-made tapes, not copies of copies, not EP tapes, etc. Very narrow in scope. If that's all you get, then I'm sure it does work decent for you. Also noting that PAL VHS is way more stable than NTSC, in general.

I agree and disagree here, but that's not worth getting in to.

Quote:

A lot of manuals are not available. I need to scan my IVT-7 manual, because it's not online anywhere. That's just the user manual, too. No service manual, and one may not exist (NDA, common for TBCs).

It's the first Google hit for me (just searching the model number) it's on archive.org


I can only state my opinion but you've raised some more-than-fair points.

[RayNotes]

I appreciate all the perspective being shared here. And yes, I might be the only person on the internet dumb enough to buy a stupid piece of gear like this. When I say hunt - I truly mean I will patiently search for a month or more before I pull the trigger.

Key takeaways for me: These professional devices are not capable of straightening out a garbage tape. They're expecting a clean SP mode original. I might risk it on a piece with a warranty ( which some do have believe it or not).

I also don't have a VCR. I'm 0 and 3 for bargain players. One DOA, another died when powered on during a power outage, and a third started eating tapes after less than a hour of play time. The search goes on. I really don't have a lot of tape to transfer (select clips from maybe 20 tapes), but maybe I'll do some for other people once I get mine transferred.

[latreche34]

There are some nice pro TBC's that work very good for consumer tape video formats, Some are expensive and some are hard to find. Grass Valley, Snell & Wilcox, Ensemble Designs, Aja and others made some of those devices, They are called converters but today the term refers to capturing. They can be used as TBC's but their main function is converting analog video to digital and in that process they apply the time base correction. You just need to keep an eye as those are not your average easycap that you would go to Amazon or AliExpress and place the order.

I've done a quick review on one of them here.

[lordsmurf]

Quote:

Originally Posted by RobustReviews

Ah, I forgot tax, that's not how the rest of the world do things, and that confuses many of us non-US people when we visit! I still can't grasp buying an item from a shop and the price on the shelf being different from that at the counter

Yep, add about 10% to the price, except for Oregon and I think 1 other state. (Those citizens pay higher taxes in other areas, not sales. Income, higher property, etc.) And then shipping on a unit of this size, if packed well, will be high unless in-region (usually 2-3 state radius distance). So I'd expect this "$125" unit to be double to some places, more like $250.

BTW, notice the location of the item. Houston. There's a bunch of video gear scammers/shysters in Houston. Because we've not been able to differentiate good sellers from bad sellers there (as each has multiple aliases, and multiple eBay accounts), the whole place is best avoided.

Quote:

It's the first Google hit for me (just searching the model number) it's on archive.org

Nice. Recent upload from June 2021. Downloading the PDF, adding it to the forum.