Digital8 camcorder playback problems?

[SFtheGreat]

Hello.

I have a problem with my DCR-TRV828E camcorder. For some time now when playing Video8/Hi8 tapes it can and it does at random point stop outputting video. Like it was unable to read anything off the tape, but when fastforwarding or rewinding with picture the actual footage is visible in ff and rew, but when the button is released and normal playback is resumed it looses the video again.

This happens both in SP and LP, I've tried cleaning tape, manual cleaning with isopropanol.

Might it be a problem with wornout heads, or something else entirely?

[dpalomaki]

Do you still get audio or does that stop as well?
Does it fail with all tapes or only some tapes or some places on a tape?
Of only some tapes/places, is it the same place on the tape every time?

[SFtheGreat]

There were tapes where it would lose signal randomly, but after repeated playback it would finally play them. So that's one problem.

The second is that right now I have a tape, where it loses video in exactly the same moment, audio plays.

Is it possible that this might be because there is NTSC portion recorded on the otherwise PAL recorded tape? I've never experimented with NTSC, because I do not have a recording equipment to do so. I should probably finally hunt down NTSC D-VHS, DV and D8 equipment...

The camcorder can play back NTSC, but might not be able to output it through fireqire, only on analog, like VHS deck and only outputs via firewire linear audio converted to PCM and blanks the video, but on playback it reconstitutes whatever signal it can read and outputs it as PAL.

Another fun it is that a few frame portion of that recording pops up durnig the good segment on the beginning, just as if the tape was rerecorded.

The camcorder has no problems switching from V8 to Hi8 and D8 in the middle of the tape as well as SP and LP.

I will try to search if ay of people I know has an 8mm camcorder to try to play it there for crossreference.

[hodgey]

The PAL versions of the newer Sony Hi8 and D8 camcorders can play NTSC tapes. On the analog output they output either NTSC 4.43 or PAL-60, depending on a menu setting when doing this. This does disable the TBC/DNR, I've passed it trhough Pioneer DVR-440 as a line-TBC when capturing NTSC tapes as these and related DVRs can handle these formats and output a normal NTSC signal. If it's a NTSC tape you should at least be able to see the playback on the LCD screen or the viewfinder.

Don't know how the react on the firewire out though. I actually have one of this exact model, but it's broken. The PAL Sony miniDV cam we got simply outputs standard NTSC format DV stream when playing DV tapes.

The image only being visible on fast forward/rewind could indicate an alignment issue, either with the tape or the camcorder. The 8mm camcorders seem to be particularly affected by this. If the recording camera had some loose tape guides that could cause alignment to change mid-tape, or between recordings. Granted, if the image goes the audio will typically be affected to, as the 8mm formats records audio together with the video tracks.

Checking it on another device first may be a good idea, though make sure you thoroughly test it before putting any important tape in to make sure it won't eat tapes.

[SFtheGreat]

Well, there is no image on te LCD.

So the only option might be to check the tapes on another machine, or try to get the one responsible for recordings.

[NJRoadfan]

What are the age and brand of the tapes? Symptoms are similar to the problems I was having with older Sony tapes.

http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/vide...ing-tapes.html

[dpalomaki]

Trying another player is a good idea.

That you get audio, even during the video blackouts indicates that the heads are working at some level. I am not familiar with your player, but it sounds like it has video "muting" where in if the image fails to meet certain criteria it blanks the screen. During scrubbing the blanking is disabled. That it changes location on many tapes would indicate that it is more than just a tape problem, although that could be a contributing factor.

I vaguely recall something like you describe happening a number of years ago with a player that had one of the two heads partly clogged.

I trust the machine is OK with D8 recordings.

[SFtheGreat]

I still have this problem, tape starts playing fine and at random placec the image is blanked, but portions of it are still visible on rewinding and FF. And the timecode is visible until the recording physically stops on the tape and the rest of the tape is unrecorded.

D8 tapes i recorded are fine and play fine.

I'll clean the heads with alco maybe that will help, I wouldn't want to use a cleaning tape too often...
Perhaps it's time to hunt down a Hi8 VCR...

[msgohan]

Did you read NJRoadfan's previous reply?

Quote:

Originally Posted by NJRoadfan

What are the age and brand of the tapes? Symptoms are similar to the problems I was having with older Sony tapes.

http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/vide...ing-tapes.html

Also: http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/home...ny-hi8-mp.html

[SFtheGreat]

That would explain much, the tapes are indeed Sony, I don't know if both NTShitC and PAL ahd those problems, but apparently that might be the case. Regular V8 tapes, the one currently playing has a 1993 datestamp and switching SP to LP and back to SP at some points...

This is why I used QGD160M for D8 recording, though the camcorder thought of them as regulat V8 and didn't allow LP mode...
And I was beginning to think that the good old DCR-TRV828E was nearing it's EOL.

[latreche34]

If the camcorder displays video during fast forward or reverse and not during playback there is an indication that the camcorder is not locking on V sync pulses, If NTSC portions available it would lock to NTSC and when the PAL comes in it won't switch over or vis versa, But if this happens you should hear chipmunks sound. Whatever the fault is it is highly likely an electronic circuit failure due to possible SDM caps failure, I would trash it and get another camcorder, chasing a fault like this is like chasing the ghost.

[SFtheGreat]

That could be the case.
As the tape playes for some time and then is gone, though on one of the threads someonne recomended a delicate mechanical stimuly (simply slapping the cam), sometimes helps, sometimes not. on the other hand my D8 tapes play fine. And i think there were no NTSC signals, only PAL and it was just loosing video. It's either the EOL of camcorder, or maybe the Sony tapes have not aged well.

[dpalomaki]

Did you try the problem tapes on another machine?

Wonder if the tape path alignment was enough different on the original recording machine to make reading the tape on a different machine problematic? Especially likely if the original recording was in LP mode.

[SFtheGreat]

Some bits were in LP, but I remember I did a guy once he had only BASF tapes, all from the early '90s, all in LP, no prpblem there...
I really should get another machine...
Is there a similar guide finally for Hi8 VCRs like there is for VHS?
Is there a HI8 deck similar to DSR-2000AP, or PCM-70XX series?

[latreche34]

Scroll down to the bottom:
https://www.video99.co.uk/Video8_Hi8...transfers.html

[SFtheGreat]

Thanks, I'll see if I get accepted to the yahoo group.

[latreche34]

You don't have to join the group just look at the list of camcorders at the bottom of the page in the link I posted.

[SFtheGreat]

I already have a nice PDF with comparisons of various different functions, that i posted a link under this nice article:
https://tdb0.wordpress.com/2015/01/3...i8-recordings/
However the link does not work anymore, but i have the pdf, if someone's interested.
I would more likely hunt for a pro Hi8 deck.

[NJRoadfan]

The YouTube video linked in the above thread is the EXACT problem I had with early 90's Sony tapes.

[SFtheGreat]

I can now confirm that the camcorder plays D8 tapes fine, but with analog tapes, the screen is blank, but there is video during FF and REW.