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-   -   Alternate WDM drivers for AIW X1800XL ?? (http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/video-capture/10245-alternate-wdm-drivers.html)

BW37 01-11-2020 12:24 AM

Alternate WDM drivers for AIW X1800XL ??
 
1 Attachment(s)
Does anyone have any alternative drivers (display and more importantly, WDM) for the AIT X1800XL?

I'm looking for drivers from original CD's or any earlier versions than those I've found on this site (same as on AMD's site I believe). I've seen reference made to original CDs, but I've not seen iso's or rar files made available for download from these. For the PCIe cards (unlike the 7xxx and 9xxx cards), I have only found the ones listed below. Maybe I just need someone to point me in the right direction...

I'm using the drivers from post #48 of the 10 page of the ATI All In Wonder Hacks, Drivers, Codecs and MMC" thread. I think the issue I'm having is with the WDM driver. In VirtualDub when I select "Video Levels" in capture mode I get this message: "No video level controls are available with this capture driver" instead of the normal slider dialogue.

The display driver is: version 8.593.100.0, dated 2/10/2010

The WDM driver (for the ATI T200 Unified AVStreamer) is version 6.14.10.1095, dated 2/3/2009

With some trepidation, I built the system around an AIW X1800XL purchased for a song on eBay. I was able to get a hold of what appear to be the correct cables (the numbers look correct per jwillis84) and they seem to work. It actually all looks quite promising. At least at idle, the card is quiet as a mouse and cool to the touch - which is not what I'd expected based on most of the research I did and the reputation these cards have. If necessary I will use ATI Tray to "cool it down", but maybe the latest display driver does this already based on demand. Overall, it seems to work well with VirtualDub except for the issue above. And working well with VirtualDub is all I need it to do.

I have some other questions, but I'll leave them for a later post. This is the only potential deal killer.

BW

msgohan 01-11-2020 03:50 AM

Quoting the VirtualDub settings guide thread.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sanlyn (Post 45239)
3: Video (top menu - CONTNUED)
Levels...
http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/atta...1&d=1470995687

These are proc amp settings usually linked to the capture device's proc amp controls. Different capture cards have different dialogs and defaults. Some cards don't provide a link that VDUb can use here. Above, typical proc amp for AIW cards.

I don't know about this specific card, but VirtualDub displays that message with some of the capture devices I own. You can access the same controls using Video -> Capture Filter -> Video Proc Amp tab.

On cards where the "link" works, the Levels menu is just a shortcut for the Video Proc Amp tab.

Having access to the Levels menu is nice, but not a dealbreaker. The biggest advantage, IMO, is that opening Capture Filter hides the video preview while opening Levels allows you to see your changes in real-time. But there are workarounds to this (GraphEdit & family).

BW37 01-11-2020 01:39 PM

msgohan,

Thanks for your reply. :salute:
The video filter route works though the lack of immediate feedback will take some getting used to :hmm:

I'll see if I can figure out how to use GraphEdit/GraphStudio.
The learning curve is pretty steep right now but I'm in!

I'd still like to try other WDM drivers to see if they would get around the problem directly.
It would also be interesting to see if older video drivers "wind up" the GPU clock (and fan) needlessly and whether there is a compatible mix of Display and WDM drivers that runs cool but allows direct video processor access.

Hopefully someone will upload an iso or two for me to play with.

Thanks,
BW

sanlyn 01-11-2020 05:16 PM

WDM drivers are Windows system standards. You shouldn't be using WDM anyway with the AIW card. It uses Direct Show.


If you allowed Windows' Hradware Wizard to install its own drivers when you installled that card, you have dysfunctional drivers.

BW37 01-11-2020 06:48 PM

Hi sanlyn,

Thanks for chiming in. I've read lots of you posts on capture and restoration and hope to utilize what I can learn from them as I become more proficient. Currently, I'm at the bottom of the learning curve but looking to work my way up.

However, now I'm a bit confused. It is/was my understanding that it's the WDM drivers which support the Theater 100/200 capture functions of the AIW cards. I will check to confirm, but I believe if I don't install the ATI WDM driver, in this case, "10-2_legacy_xp32-64_wdm.exe" from Post #48, I won't see the "ATI T200 Streaming Device" as a capture device in VirtualDub.

These are the files/drives available in post #48:

1) 6-6_encoder_33678.exe
2) 6-12_xcode_38463.exe
3) 9-14_mmc_enu.exe
4) 9-14_mmc_uci.exe
5) 9-16_mmc_enu.exe
6) 10-2_legacy_xp32-64_dd_ccc.exe
7) 10-2_legacy_xp32-64_wdm.exe

I'm installing only the last 2 and VirtualDub is happy except for the Video Processor dialog issue.

Basically I've been generally following the instructions as stated here (and others):

Quote:

Originally Posted by admin (Post 19811)
Yep, bit of a delay in answering some posts. :)

Also, thanks for your posts, MemphisMike. :thumb:

Install:
1. WDM drivers
2. ATI control panel
5. Catalyst Control Center
6. Mutimedia Center 9

Don't Install:
3. ATI decoder
4. DirectX
7. AuthorsScript
8. ATI Remote Wonder ( I doubt that I will have to use the remote!?)
9. GuidePlus+


Going off memory, ATI decoder is for the DVD player software -- unnecessary.
GuidePlus useless in post-analog era.
Remote Wonder doesn't matter if not using a remote, which most VHS>digital users will not.
AuthorScript is for something -- I forget, not important
DirectX is likely already at version 9 or better on a Windows XP SP1-SP2 computer anyway. So this is redundant.

I'm my specific case I am having the most luck with the X1800XL with only the display driver and WDM driver in part because it's a PAL unit. Adding CCC would probably be fine, but adding the TV component of MCC 9.14 or 9.16 (as provided on post #48 of the ATI drivers thread) tends to mess things up even in VirtualDub (I think. It gets a bit confusing...). It definitely messes thing up in MMC TV itself whereby even if I change the Preset Map to NTSC parameters in the capture settings, it displays an S-video input incorrectly and captures incorrectly. I'm guessing that the region I choose during TV set-up becomes the default display mode - and - capture mode => PAL. The MMC TV Initialization Wizard seems to only include PAL and SECAM regions so I can't seem to make NTSC the default.

Anyway, since I'm only trying to make this system work for VirtualDub and not for MMC/TV mpeg-2 captures, as long as I don't install any MMC stuff it's happy thinking in NTSC. :D

BW

sanlyn 01-11-2020 09:24 PM

You don't need MMC to capture with VirtualDub or other capture software like AmarecTV or GraphEdit. You don't even need the Catalyst Control Center but it does install (or used to) a useful uninstall app. What version of Windows are you using?


[EDIT] But I believe you need the ati "encoder" install file. It's possible that MMC does install capture drivers, but that would be unusual. In your video sources list you should see a DirectShow device for input, not just WDM.

msgohan 01-11-2020 10:47 PM

WDM is a subset of DirectShow. All WDM drivers are DirectShow. I believe you're thinking of VFW.

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/win...apture-devices

sanlyn 01-12-2020 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by msgohan (Post 65759)
WDM is a subset of DirectShow. All WDM drivers are DirectShow. I believe you're thinking of VFW.

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/win...apture-devices

Yep, you're correct and thanks for spotting that. It's been 6 years since I installed an AIW card, and you tend to forget the sequence after that long.

The X1800XL should show up in the input sources as a DirectShow device. So something with those drivers is amiss.

BW37 01-12-2020 04:58 PM

3 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by sanlyn (Post 65768)
Yep, you're correct and thanks for spotting that. It's been 6 years since I installed an AIW card, and you tend to forget the sequence after that long.

The X1800XL should show up in the input sources as a DirectShow device. So something with those drivers is amiss.

@ sanlyn:

For VirtualDub, I think all is well with just the WDM and display driver. No MMC, no CCC, no encoder, nothing else and VirtualDub seems to be working fine. The "encoder" included with the files from post #48 seems to have to do with TV "Parental" access control, not actual video encoding, quite different than the "DVD-Decoder" ??? from the earlier MMC versions. With just the display and WDM drivers installed, the capture devices available show up in VirtualDub like this:

http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/atta...1&d=1578866165

The "ATI T200..." device is the DirectShow option that becomes available when the ATI WDM driver is installed. Sorry if that was not clear.

Device Manager looks like this so far. I was using the on-board sound just to get going (easier to disable in the bios vs physically removing a card...)

http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/atta...9&d=1578866165http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/atta...1&d=1578867052

The OS I'm using is XP-SP2, Media Center 2002. It's something I had lying around from a dead Media Center built from that era so I'm giving it a go. I'm adding Net Framework 2.0 and MS Installer 4.5 and then "killing" as much of Media Center as possible by choosing "Non-Microsoft" via "Set Program Access and Defaults" and also turning off "ehtray" in the "Startup" tab by "running" msconfig.exe. Then I install all of the hardware drivers, etc. It looks promising so far since none of the Media Center processes and services show up anywhere and VirtualDub seems to be working fine. But I'm just getting started so there may be other MC related problems I have yet to encounter. We'll see.

Media Center can't really be removed, but it can be at least "stunted" as described here:

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/...f-c093d19fbada

The Non-Microsoft choice is the more "nuclear" option but seems to be working since I'm losing nothing MS I seem to need. "ehtray" still runs until you stop it from starting with msconfig.

Playing, learning, playing so far... some day I hope to start actual capturing :laugh:

BW

PS: As is apparent, I finally figured out a circuitous way to insert images from the files I attached but it seems nothing like the way described here: http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/faq....b3_attachments
I'm not seeing any "arrow next to the 'Attachment Icon' :depressed:

msgohan 01-12-2020 07:20 PM

There's a tutorial with screenshots showing the attachment process here: http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/news...ly-upload.html

sanlyn 01-12-2020 10:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BW37 (Post 65785)

Don't use the ATI YV12 codec. It was installed by MMC.

What happened to Huffyuv and Lagarith? HugffYUV is standrad for capture, Lagarith for post processing intermediates.

BW37 01-12-2020 11:33 PM

@ msgohan: Thanks! Somehow the "attachment icon" = paperclip didn't click and I didn't spend enough time "hovering" over those icons to find the list of attachments. I'll use that next time.

@sanlyn: The codecs list is just what showed up in device manager. Huffyuv is there and was/is also available (and tried) in VirtualDub. I'm not going to use Lagarith for now though on this machine it should run fine. Interesting tidbit about the ATIYUV codec. You are right, it was likely installed by MMC. I first doubted that because at the time I took the screenshot, I'd uninstalled MMC and run AtiCimUn. But that codec was still there. I've just done a clean install, never installing MMC, and now the ATIYUV codec is not there. I'd forgotten how difficult it is to cleanse a PC of ATI files and registry entries.:smack: I haven't dealt with it for 20 odd years. :wink2: VirtualDub is working "fine" (as much as this beginner can tell) with only the display driver and WDM drivers, no MMC, no AVIVO, no CCC (for now).

One last comment in case anyone is following my attempt to neuter Media Center. I forgot that I also had to stop and disable two MC services, Media Center Scheduler and Media Center Receiver. They were still starting automatically even after selecting "Non-Microsoft" in Program Access and Defaults.

BW


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