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  #1  
03-25-2020, 12:56 AM
Superiorem Superiorem is offline
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Goal
To capture Video8 tapes from the late 1990s and early 2000s. I think I want to use Huffyuv lossless capturing via VirtualDub.
COVID-19 is keeping me stuck at home, so I figure I ought to use the time productively.

Question
I finally have Windows XP SP2 installed on my SSD (wow, in this age of NVME, I never expected SATA to be so challenging!).
Now I would like to replace the existing nVidia 8911 ver 330 (FX5200) with my ATI AIW 8500DV.
I'm confused as to which files I need. Do I need the Catalyst drivers? Do I need the ATI-6168package files? At some point I'll need MMC; do I use 8.x or 9.x? What is in the "hacks" file? Is DirectX 9 the recommended version?

According to ATI All In Wonder Hacks, Drivers, Codecs and MMC, posts 1-5 are supposed to apply to the AGP cards. I'm finding those posts hard to navigate and I'm worried that some of the information is now out-of-date.

Suggestion: editing the original post with some tabular formatting (per-card) might help prevent questions like mine!

Research
I've done my best to lurk, search, and read; hopefully that's obvious based on the hardware list I've pieced together. However, I can't seem to deduce the proper drivers (and accompanying software) to install for the 8500DV. Of course, I want to do it the right way as of 2020 (although I expect not much has changed in a decade! )

- lordsmurf writes that the 8500DV is the 7500 with DV input
- admin (lordsmurf?) writes the same claim/fact again, albeit more verbosely
- kpmedia writes that the "classic" cards can use ATI Multimedia Center (ATI MMC) versions 8-9
- admin (lordsmurf?) writes that the driver installation procedure requires following some carefully ordered steps; I'm eager to exercise my literacy ("Because people don't seem to be able to read")!
- since it was [is] difficult to uninstall and start over, I want to make sure I do everything correctly the first time.
- it seems that the Catalyst driver series was the final package released by ATI; I'm assuming I don't need to mess with the multi-stage installers.
- various other lurking...

What I have
- Dell Dimension 8300 (Pentium 4 @ 3.00 Ghz, 3.5 GB RAM, 1TB SSD, Windows XP SP2)
- ATI All-in-Wonder Radeon 8500DV (I think it works? I didn't get video output on boot, so I assume that I first need drivers)
- Turtle Beach Santa Cruz TB400-2541-01 (in the mail)
- Sony Handycam CCD-FX640 Video 8 Camcorder (this camera produced the tapes)

What I'm still working on obtaining
- TBC (???)
- Video8 Camcorder with S-Video out

My expertise
- GNU/Linux, Python, C++, general tech stuff
- Uh, I once made something with Adobe Premiere

Where I lack knowledge
- I'm too young to really understand tape; forgive me for being digital-born
- Therefore: thank you for this wonderful ark of knowledge (the forum); I've learned quite a bit!

My worries
- shouldn't the card at least show video for BIOS on boot? Maybe it wasn't seated properly...
- hopefully I didn't miss an obvious post somewhere; I tried to conduct due-diligence research!

Dell Dimension 8300, ATI AIW 8500DV, TB-400 | Video8 | Need: TBC, Camcorder w/ S-Video
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  #2  
03-25-2020, 09:59 AM
msgohan msgohan is offline
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Yes, you need the card to at least show BIOS. Disconnect the SSD so hopefully it will halt the boot process and display an error. Also mash the appropriate hotkey repeatedly on bootup (DEL on my boards, and one of the Function keys but I think those differ more).
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  #3  
03-25-2020, 12:46 PM
Superiorem Superiorem is offline
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Thank you for the rapid reply, msgohan.

User error: A gentle blast of canned air and firmly reseating the card worked. Windows XP booted, albeit it is stuck at 640x480 and I think just 30Hz ("Display Control Panel is unable to change the display settings"). I assume that is related to the drivers...?

Control Panel > Appearance and Themes > Display > Settings
Display: Plug and Play Monitor on ALL-IN-WONDER RADEON 8500DV (Microsoft Corporation)
Screen Resolution: 640x480 | Color Quality: Low (8-bit)

... > Advanced > Adapter
Adapter Type
ALL-IN-WONDER RADEON 8500DV (Microsoft Corporation)

Adapter Information
Chip Type: RADEON 8500 AGP (0x4242)
DAC Type: Internal DAC(400Mhz)
Memory Size: 64 MB
Adapter String: ALL-IN-WONDER RADEON 8500DV (Microsoft Corporation)
Bios Information: BK7.4.0 VR000.000.007.004.000.001.001 bcenu

... > Advanced > Monitor > Properties > Driver
Plug and Play Monitor
Driver Provider: Microsoft
Driver Date: 6/6/2001
Driver Version: 5.1.2001.0

Driver Details ... --> "Plug and Play Monitor: No driver files are required or have been loaded for this device."

---

So, it looks like I am right; I only have out-of-the-box XP display functionality. Good news, then: the card works! The seller on eBay didn't lie to me!

Dell Dimension 8300, ATI AIW 8500DV, TB-400 | Video8 | Need: TBC, Camcorder w/ S-Video
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  #4  
03-25-2020, 01:16 PM
msgohan msgohan is offline
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Yeah, it's normal for default drivers to only give you extremely low resolution(s). Hopefully someone who uses this card can answer your other questions.
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  #5  
03-25-2020, 09:02 PM
Superiorem Superiorem is offline
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My original post lacks a clear, singular question, so I thought I should refine my question and express my dilemma.

It looks like ATI All In Wonder Hacks, Drivers, Codecs and MMC is the main source of driver files. Posts #1 - #5 of that thread apply to the AGP cards.

On one hand, there's the 6168 package from post #1.

On the other, there's the ATI All-In-Wonder installation CD 181-G01116-110 from post #4.

Since
  1. the install CD was tested with an ATI AIW 7500 AGP and "found to work perfectly" and
  2. the ATI AIW Radeon 8500DV is the 7500 with DV input,
it would seem that those are the correct files? Unfortunately post #4 doesn't mention the 8500 / 8500DV at all. I'm also wary to try these because these files "came" with the 7000 series cards (in the form of installation media), and so they pre-date the 8500 cards.

Question: which one? 6168 package or 181-G01116-110?

Of course, I'll firstly need DirectX 9.0c. It looks like the official download from Microsoft is in fact a web installer, and since I will not be connecting my Windows XP SP2 box to the internet, I'll use the files from post #2 and move them via a USB drive.

Last edited by Superiorem; 03-25-2020 at 09:05 PM. Reason: syntax; additional information
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  #6  
03-26-2020, 05:44 PM
Superiorem Superiorem is offline
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Sorry to spam this thread with constant posts; I'm just trying to figure out and document everything I can.

I exchanged private messages with user Prelude, who in an old post, also wrote about setting up an ATI AIW 8500DV.

They claimed to never have needed to use the two installation CDs (180-V01043-100 and 180-G01445-200) that came with their ATI AIW 8500DV, instead having let Windows figure things out on its own. They then provided some screenshots, one of which showed their system using ATI Technologies Inc. driver 6.14.1.6292 from 1/20/2003.

Despite Prelude's unexpectedly rapid and friendly response, I'll admit, I was a bit skeptical of their claim (sorry!).

I thought that I should go ahead and install DirectX 9.0c while mulling over Prelude's message. I proceeded to boot up my Dimension 8300, and, sure enough, this time it was displaying the correct resolution (1600x900). Recall that in post #3, I wrote that maximum display settings were not available, and msgohan confirmed in post #4 that this was normal .

I looked at the Device Manager and dxdiag; both showed that my ALL-IN-WONDER RADEON 8500 DV (Microsoft Corporation) was using:

Driver Provider: ATI Technologies Inc.
Driver Date: 3/23/2004
Driver Version: 6.14.10.6462
Digital Signer: Microsoft Windows Publisher

Huh, that's odd. When I last turned the computer off, it was using whatever generic driver I listed in post #3. Moreover, dxdiag showed me that I already had DirectX 9.0c installed.

Note that I have never connected this computer (well, the current install) to the internet, nor have I inserted any other media.

At this point, I should mention that I did not use standard Windows XP media to install Windows XP SP2; instead, I used the recovery disc which shipped with a Inspiron E1405 laptop. Originally, I had tried to use nLite to slipstream SP2 and SATA drivers into an .iso file, but that proved unsuccessful, so I gave the recovery disc a try and it worked flawlessly.

If anyone is interested, I can check to see if I am able to yank drivers from that recovery disc. I assume that the disc contains whatever was in Dell's consumer ecosystem circa 2004-2006 and is responsible for me having DirectX 9.0c out of the box and the ATI driver.

The lingering question: Is this the "right" ATI driver? Is the box ready for MMC? (which version? 8.x or 9.x?) That would be remarkably simple if so...

TL;DR
- I installed Windows XP using recovery media from ca. 2006.
- DirectX 9.0c was pre-installed
- It found and automatically configured ATI driver 6.14.10.6462
- Question: is this then "good to go"?
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  #7  
03-27-2020, 11:04 AM
Sergei316 Sergei316 is online now
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I have a ATI 8500DV install CD that I can rip and upload later this evening.

I dont use the standard full install that is on the CD. I only install the following:
1) DRIVERS
2) WDM
3) MCM (if I need it)
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  #8  
03-27-2020, 11:50 AM
Superiorem Superiorem is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sergei316 View Post
I have a ATI 8500DV install CD that I can rip and upload later this evening.

I dont use the standard full install that is on the CD. I only install the following:
1) DRIVERS
2) WDM
3) MCM (if I need it)
That would be wonderful; thank you. I would also really appreciate if you could post a screenshot of the driver details, if it isn't inconvenient. I've attached screenshots of mine.


Attached Images
File Type: jpg ati_aiw_8500dv_default_driver_26march2020_crop.jpg (82.8 KB, 3 downloads)
File Type: png dxdiag_display_26march2020_crop.png (29.8 KB, 3 downloads)
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  #9  
03-27-2020, 06:47 PM
Sergei316 Sergei316 is online now
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Here is the ATI 8500DV cd files.


Attached Files
File Type: rar ATI8500DV.part1.rar (90.00 MB, 1 downloads)
File Type: rar ATI8500DV.part2.rar (90.00 MB, 1 downloads)
File Type: rar ATI8500DV.part3.rar (82.50 MB, 1 downloads)
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Tags
8500dv, agp, ati, drivers, version

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