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  #41  
07-13-2020, 02:17 PM
hodgey hodgey is online now
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The hannover bars may well be on the tape, I suspect the recordings are just not all that great. It looks from the image like the Blaupunkt is on edit mod. There's a switch on the front that can be set to player/recorder/edit (or at least that's the naming on the NV-HS1000). If it's set to edit most noise filtering is disabled, including the AI switch and sharpness adjustment, which may or may not be desirable depending on the tape. I'm not sure if there's any difference between player and recorder playback wise. The one possible issue I do see is that the lines where the VCR compensates for dropouts are quite dark, I had the same issue with the NV-HS1000 we got here. There's a trimpot to adjust it but it's a bit hard to get to. The same (1-line) delay line that's is used for compensating for dropouts is used for luma noise reduction as well so it's possible it has some slight impact on that too.

Hannover bars will be less noticeable if internal noise and comb filters are active, and on the other 2 VCRs there Y/C separation of the composite video signal probably also reduces that effect. The LG is connected internally via composite to the A/D converter that's in it, the output from it goes through the internal digitizer and is converted back to analog on the outputs, unfortunately it doesn't have much effect on horizontal wiggle like the TBC in the Blaupunkt. It looks like there's something wrong with the Sony VCR.
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  #42  
07-13-2020, 02:24 PM
Aerith Aerith is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hodgey View Post
The hannover bars may well be on the tape, I suspect the recordings are just not all that great. It looks from the image like the Blaupunkt is on edit mod. There's a switch on the front that can be set to player/recorder/edit (or at least that's the naming on the NV-HS1000). If it's set to edit most noise filtering is disabled, including the AI switch and sharpness adjustment, which may or may not be desirable depending on the tape. I'm not sure if there's any difference between player and recorder playback wise. The one possible issue I do see is that the lines where the VCR compensates for dropouts are quite dark, I had the same issue with the NV-HS1000 we got here. There's a trimpot to adjust it but it's a bit hard to get to. The same (1-line) delay line that's is used for compensating for dropouts is used for luma noise reduction as well so it's possible it has some slight impact on that too.

Hannover bars will be less noticeable if internal noise and comb filters are active, and on the other 2 VCRs there Y/C separation of the composite video signal probably also reduces that effect. The LG is connected internally via composite to the A/D converter that's in it, the output from it goes through the internal digitizer and is converted back to analog on the outputs, unfortunately it doesn't have much effect on horizontal wiggle like the TBC in the Blaupunkt. It looks like there's something wrong with the Sony VCR.
The EDIT MODE switch on the Blaupunkt is set to PASSIVE. I read somewhere that this was the recommended setting. Would some other setting be better?

The manual says:
Quote:
EDIT MODE

PLAYER: When this VTR is used as the playback VTR during editing operations.

RECORDER: When this VTR is used as the recording VTR during editing operations
* Normally set at this position

PASSIVE: When operating this VTR using another VTR or an editing controller.
* The picture quality best suited for editing is selected.
* When setting at this position, operation will not be possible and the On Screen Display will not appear.
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  #43  
07-13-2020, 02:52 PM
hodgey hodgey is online now
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Yeah PASSIVE, not EDIT, forgot the naming. I usually use that setting as well, at least for SP tapes (need to do some testing for LP, just recently got it to work properly again) unless they're really grainy. Was just pointing out that that may be why the hannover bars may be more visible on the captures from the panasonic, compared to the other VCRs.
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  #44  
07-17-2020, 10:23 AM
Aerith Aerith is offline
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I just noticed that the AVI format MediaInfo is apparently always progressive. Capturing with the "QuickTime Movie" option on the other hand registers that the content is PAL and interlaced. Would have been nice to know sooner. :/

Anyway, I've been playing around with compressing files with FFMPEG and I'm having a bit of trouble with FFV1 2-pass compression. I've tried to follow the instructions in the FFV1 quick start guide. From there I got these commands:

Code:
# 1st pass
ffmpeg -i "cut.mkv" -threads 8 -an -vcodec ffv1 -coder 1 -context 1 -g 1 -level 3 -slices 24 -slicecrc 1 -pass 1 -passlogfile my_passlog pass1.mkv

# 2nd pass
ffmpeg -i "cut.mkv" -threads 8 -an -vcodec ffv1 -coder 1 -context 1 -g 1 -level 3 -slices 24 -slicecrc 1 -pass 2 -passlogfile my_passlog final.mkv
The result is this:

snapshot.jpg
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What am I doing wrong?


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  #45  
07-17-2020, 05:58 PM
jjdd jjdd is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerith View Post
I just noticed that the AVI format MediaInfo is apparently always progressive. Capturing with the "QuickTime Movie" option on the other hand registers that the content is PAL and interlaced. Would have been nice to know sooner. :/

Anyway, I've been playing around with compressing files with FFMPEG and I'm having a bit of trouble with FFV1 2-pass compression. I've tried to follow the instructions in the FFV1 quick start guide. From there I got these commands:

Code:
# 1st pass
ffmpeg -i "cut.mkv" -threads 8 -an -vcodec ffv1 -coder 1 -context 1 -g 1 -level 3 -slices 24 -slicecrc 1 -pass 1 -passlogfile my_passlog pass1.mkv

# 2nd pass
ffmpeg -i "cut.mkv" -threads 8 -an -vcodec ffv1 -coder 1 -context 1 -g 1 -level 3 -slices 24 -slicecrc 1 -pass 2 -passlogfile my_passlog final.mkv
The result is this:

Attachment 12202
Attachment 12203

What am I doing wrong?

i use .avi container not .mkv

my .bat file look like this for FFV1 encoding but i do only one pass

Code:
ffmpeg -i "D:\input.avi" -acodec copy -vcodec ffv1 -level 3 -threads 8 -coder 1 -context 1 -g 1 -slices 4 -slicecrc 1 "D:\output.avi"
pause

Last edited by jjdd; 07-17-2020 at 06:13 PM.
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  #46  
07-18-2020, 03:51 AM
Aerith Aerith is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjdd View Post
i use .avi container not .mkv

my .bat file look like this for FFV1 encoding but i do only one pass

Code:
ffmpeg -i "D:\input.avi" -acodec copy -vcodec ffv1 -level 3 -threads 8 -coder 1 -context 1 -g 1 -slices 4 -slicecrc 1 "D:\output.avi"
pause
I also used AVI in the beginning because I thought that it was a simpler container and therefore more likely to be future proof.

One pass works fine for me too and I've verified it by checking and comparing the checksums of individual frames of the original v210.mov uncompressed video and the ffv1.mkv compressed video using the command:

Code:
ffmpeg -i input.mov -f framemd5 input.md5
Be aware that the command can give different values if you compress the audio stream. The reason is apparently that it converts audio to signed 16-bit before computing checksums and it is this conversion which can lead to the discrepancy.
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  #47  
07-18-2020, 07:45 AM
jjdd jjdd is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerith View Post
I also used AVI in the beginning because I thought that it was a simpler container and therefore more likely to be future proof.

One pass works fine for me too and I've verified it by checking and comparing the checksums of individual frames of the original v210.mov uncompressed video and the ffv1.mkv compressed video using the command:

Code:
ffmpeg -i input.mov -f framemd5 input.md5
Be aware that the command can give different values if you compress the audio stream. The reason is apparently that it converts audio to signed 16-bit before computing checksums and it is this conversion which can lead to the discrepancy.
ok i have never test to comparing the checksums
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  #48  
07-18-2020, 10:05 AM
hodgey hodgey is online now
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A nice thing with using mkv is that you can compress the audio with flac (lossless) as well and save a bit more space.
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  #49  
07-22-2020, 09:50 PM
Formica Formica is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hodgey View Post
Going by the pictures, it looks like the Kona LSe has some TBC functionality, it seems to be correcting horizontal wiggle like the VCR TBC does, otherwise no-TBC one would look less straight.
According to Kona lit, the LSe offers "broadcast quality TBC with VHS support."
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  #50  
07-23-2020, 12:52 AM
latreche34 latreche34 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Formica View Post
According to Kona lit, the LSe offers "broadcast quality TBC with VHS support."
That's why I kept telling him to leave the AVT out, Stacking TBC's in most cases serves no purpose other than degrading the picture quality due to multiple A/D/A conversions.
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  #51  
07-23-2020, 02:41 AM
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TBCs are stackable, but must be complementary.

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  #52  
08-13-2020, 08:15 AM
Aerith Aerith is offline
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I've been steadily working my way through the tapes and I've run into a new problem.

1.jpg
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2.jpg

Why does this happen? Is it the tape? Or the VCR? Can it be fixed? I'm using the VCR's built-in TBC only.


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  #53  
08-13-2020, 10:22 AM
Aerith Aerith is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hodgey View Post
The hannover bars may well be on the tape, I suspect the recordings are just not all that great. It looks from the image like the Blaupunkt is on edit mod. There's a switch on the front that can be set to player/recorder/edit (or at least that's the naming on the NV-HS1000). If it's set to edit most noise filtering is disabled, including the AI switch and sharpness adjustment, which may or may not be desirable depending on the tape. I'm not sure if there's any difference between player and recorder playback wise. The one possible issue I do see is that the lines where the VCR compensates for dropouts are quite dark, I had the same issue with the NV-HS1000 we got here. There's a trimpot to adjust it but it's a bit hard to get to. The same (1-line) delay line that's is used for compensating for dropouts is used for luma noise reduction as well so it's possible it has some slight impact on that too.

Hannover bars will be less noticeable if internal noise and comb filters are active, and on the other 2 VCRs there Y/C separation of the composite video signal probably also reduces that effect. The LG is connected internally via composite to the A/D converter that's in it, the output from it goes through the internal digitizer and is converted back to analog on the outputs, unfortunately it doesn't have much effect on horizontal wiggle like the TBC in the Blaupunkt. It looks like there's something wrong with the Sony VCR.
Could you describe where this trimpot is? I have the service manual PDF.
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  #54  
08-13-2020, 01:41 PM
latreche34 latreche34 is offline
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Stills are not the best way to show a problem in the video, If those chroma artifacts run for a very short time then it could source related, if the whole video is like that then there might be a problem with the VCR or capture card.
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  #55  
08-13-2020, 03:01 PM
Aerith Aerith is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by latreche34 View Post
Stills are not the best way to show a problem in the video, If those chroma artifacts run for a very short time then it could source related, if the whole video is like that then there might be a problem with the VCR or capture card.
The video is 3 hours long so uploading the whole thing isn't practical. I hope this 5 second clip is good enough.

out.mkv

The entire video isn't like this though. It only happens during the second half (after the ~2 hour mark). Sometimes it happens only occasionally (just a flicker), while other times it goes on for some time (5 second long purple segment, flicker back to normal for a second or two, then another purple segment, and so on for minutes).

This actually started happening during the previous tape, but at the time I thought that maybe it was just that tape. Now I'm wondering...


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  #56  
08-13-2020, 05:12 PM
hodgey hodgey is online now
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Does it happen consistently on the same spot, or is it random? If it's always in the same spot (and also happens in other VCRs) it's likely to be the tape. (Consistent errors could also point tot he capture card, but that's less likely.) If it happens at random points it's more likely the VCR that's having issues. What I do see in the clip is that the pink coloring extends even into the head switch area, which would suggest it's not something that's on the tape itself. I did have some symptoms that were a bit like that that was caused by a bad capacitor on the TBC board, though was looking even worse than your example, so maybe your issue is something similar. If it was earlier in the video decoding chain in the VCR or on the tape, it wouldn't look as consistent down through the overscan area. You can try to turn on/off the TBC if you encounter it again and see if it disappears with the TBC off.

As for the trimpot for the drop-out correction: Panasonic NV-HS1000 noisy image, random spots?
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  #57  
08-13-2020, 05:40 PM
BW37 BW37 is offline
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Something overheating? TBC or something on the AJA card? It looks suspiciously like what happens with a device I use to convert 1080P to 1080i so my old TV can use it. The unit worked well at first but then started to get flaky. I opened it up and ran it with the ends removed and sitting an an angle (more convection???) and it now works for longer periods of time. I need to make a more permanent fix...

Try running the PC with the case open and a fan directed into it at the AJA card. I don't know if you can open up the TBC safely but maybe just give it a rest to cool down.

My

BW
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  #58  
08-13-2020, 11:54 PM
Aerith Aerith is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hodgey View Post
Does it happen consistently on the same spot, or is it random? If it's always in the same spot (and also happens in other VCRs) it's likely to be the tape. (Consistent errors could also point tot he capture card, but that's less likely.) If it happens at random points it's more likely the VCR that's having issues. What I do see in the clip is that the pink coloring extends even into the head switch area, which would suggest it's not something that's on the tape itself. I did have some symptoms that were a bit like that that was caused by a bad capacitor on the TBC board, though was looking even worse than your example, so maybe your issue is something similar. If it was earlier in the video decoding chain in the VCR or on the tape, it wouldn't look as consistent down through the overscan area. You can try to turn on/off the TBC if you encounter it again and see if it disappears with the TBC off.

As for the trimpot for the drop-out correction: Panasonic NV-HS1000 noisy image, random spots?
Thanks!

I'll try to capture the same tape again and see if it happens in the same places.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BW37 View Post
Something overheating? TBC or something on the AJA card? It looks suspiciously like what happens with a device I use to convert 1080P to 1080i so my old TV can use it. The unit worked well at first but then started to get flaky. I opened it up and ran it with the ends removed and sitting an an angle (more convection???) and it now works for longer periods of time. I need to make a more permanent fix...

Try running the PC with the case open and a fan directed into it at the AJA card. I don't know if you can open up the TBC safely but maybe just give it a rest to cool down.

My

BW
It is not impossible. It has been rather hot lately with indoor temperatures reaching up to 28-30 Celsius (82-86 F). I'll crank up the PC fans to max when I try to capture again. The VCR itself is sitting on my desk on a metal grill (kinda looks like this) with plenty of room on all sides including from below.

Last edited by Aerith; 08-14-2020 at 12:34 AM.
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  #59  
08-14-2020, 12:40 AM
Aerith Aerith is offline
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Ok, so I tried some additional 10-minute captures and the purple parts sometimes happen at the same places and sometimes they don't. I did discover that if I turn the VCR TBC switch off it stops happening.
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  #60  
08-14-2020, 06:27 AM
hodgey hodgey is online now
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If it only happens with the TBC on it's likely caused by a bad capacitor on the TBC board in the VCR.
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