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  #21  
01-14-2022, 02:03 PM
leinrac leinrac is offline
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Unluckily Traal’s way did not work. I have tried with Mkvtoolnix just following the indicated procedure. I was full of expectations. I have generated the mkv container setting 16:9 aspect ratio but when II tried to Watch it in the tv it still appears ad 4:3 . In the pc Wmp shows the file as full widescreen (and vlc too ) but Samsung Smart tv still shows 4:3. I have other files mpeg2, mkv etc that appears in 16:9 and also the e files that Ihave posted look fine widescreen but only after re-encoding . If there is no way out, I will have to surrender…
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  #22  
01-14-2022, 03:26 PM
traal traal is online now
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I think your TV ignores the container's aspect ratio flag on the .mkv file and uses the bitstream flag which is set to 4:3 on your "NO WIDESCREEN" file.

I managed to change it in FFMpeg using the following line:

Code:
ffmpeg.exe -i "MPEG2 FROM DV CAMCORDER_UNFORT.  NO WIDESCREEN.mpg" -bsf:v mpeg2_metadata=display_aspect_ratio=16/9 -c copy "fixed.mpg"
Unfortunately, FFMpeg complains that there's something wrong with the audio and so the output file doesn't have any audio. You could use MKVToolNix to add it back in, just drag both .mpg files into the window and uncheck the old video stream but keep the audio.

Another thing I noticed, there's some panning blur in the video and so I'm wondering if the miniDV video is really 25fps. Also, miniDV is interlaced, so it would be good to start fresh with WinDV to get the raw .avi file, then deinterlace to 50fps to make the panning motion even smoother.
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  #23  
01-14-2022, 04:57 PM
BW37 BW37 is offline
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As Lordsmurf has implied above, just capture as analog via the s-video and analog audio out of the DV camcorder (assuming that is your playback device). That would fit your normal process. Of course you'll need the correct analog out cable(s) for the camcorder. Going analog is not the perfectionist approach, but appears to be in scope for your workflow and customer's needs.

As has also been stated, going firewire out is just a bit accurate streamed file transfer from the tape to an AVI file (or files) on a PC. It's never going to do anything else so a secondary encoding process is always going to be required.

BW
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  #24  
01-14-2022, 10:25 PM
timtape timtape is offline
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Many digital TV's and video player remotes give the user the option to "zoom in" on the film or video at the press of a button, not just on their own home videos but on any film, video or TV show watched. Does the owner of the tapes know about that "zoom in" function on their remote and do they already use it?
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  #25  
01-15-2022, 03:30 AM
leinrac leinrac is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BW37 View Post
As Lordsmurf has implied above, just capture as analog via the s-video and analog audio out of the DV camcorder (assuming that is your playback device). That would fit your normal process. Of course you'll need the correct analog out cable(s) for the camcorder. Going analog is not the perfectionist approach, but appears to be in scope for your workflow and customer's needs.

As has also been stated, going firewire out is just a bit accurate streamed file transfer from the tape to an AVI file (or files) on a PC. It's never going to do anything else so a secondary encoding process is always going to be required.

BW
Too bad, the DV Camcorder only has got composite out and firewire , no svhs and in any case I agree that going analog would not be the best even though I understand this would be the quickest way without encoding again. I also understand the "Firewire to Avi, only" issue. I have just learned this from this Forum/topic. What got me confused is the fact that when I "TRANSFER" the footage from Camcorder to Pc via Firewire, the software (Cyberlink Power Director) gives me a wide selection of adjustments which in theory would help me but they do not work (for my specific purpose).Popups appear whenever an option in terms of final format, resolution etc is technically not accepted by the software (For instance, H264 as final format). Do not get me wrong , I am talking about when "getting video transferred" not when "later encoding" . This led me to understand that selectiing any of the proper and allowed adjustments, would have allowed me to achieve my goal. Unfortunately it does not seem to be the case but "one learns as he goes"

Quote:
Originally Posted by timtape View Post
Many digital TV's and video player remotes give the user the option to "zoom in" on the film or video at the press of a button, not just on their own home videos but on any film, video or TV show watched. Does the owner of the tapes know about that "zoom in" function on their remote and do they already use it?
When playbacking the videos, it seems that only 4:3 and 16:9 options are available. Actually There are other options for adjusting diemsnions of diplay but they are not highlighted and therefore cannot be chosen for file playback. In any case, zooming would make the view much worse as it would blur the images and reduce furthermore the (already poor) sharpness.

Quote:
Originally Posted by traal View Post
I think your TV ignores the container's aspect ratio flag on the .mkv file and uses the bitstream flag which is set to 4:3 on your "NO WIDESCREEN" file.

I managed to change it in FFMpeg using the following line:

Code:
ffmpeg.exe -i "MPEG2 FROM DV CAMCORDER_UNFORT.  NO WIDESCREEN.mpg" -bsf:v mpeg2_metadata=display_aspect_ratio=16/9 -c copy "fixed.mpg"
Unfortunately, FFMpeg complains that there's something wrong with the audio and so the output file doesn't have any audio. You could use MKVToolNix to add it back in, just drag both .mpg files into the window and uncheck the old video stream but keep the audio.

Another thing I noticed, there's some panning blur in the video and so I'm wondering if the miniDV video is really 25fps. Also, miniDV is interlaced, so it would be good to start fresh with WinDV to get the raw .avi file, then deinterlace to 50fps to make the panning motion even smoother.
Appreciate your remarks, thank you , will try and make other attempts , but I am wondering whether it would make more sense for me to give up...
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  #26  
01-15-2022, 05:55 PM
dpalomaki dpalomaki is offline
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Quote:
...the DV Camcorder only has got composite out and firewire , no svhs...
FWIW: SVHS is an analog tape format. The signal connection is S-VIDEO as in separate video, two wires (typically in the same cable/connector) one for luma, one for chroma information).

AVI is a file type developed by Microsoft (Audio/Video Interleave) and is a container for video/audio data, not the actual video which is encoded in the file using a CODEC. It is a bit like a book case that contains books, but you need to know the language of each book before you can read it. Similarly your viewing device must have the appropriate CODEC before it can display an AVI file. AVI files can be large or small depending on the CODEC used.

What individual devices support (e.g., TVs, DVD/BD players. cable STBs) is up to the manufacturer and may be driven by a variety if factors not the least of which include potential copyright use royalties (often listed in the back of the user manuals).
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  #27  
01-16-2022, 03:35 AM
leinrac leinrac is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dpalomaki View Post
FWIW: SVHS is an analog tape format. The signal connection is S-VIDEO as in separate video, two wires (typically in the same cable/connector) one for luma, one for chroma information).
You are right, should have written S-Video , although I understand the principle of separating the 2 signals is a Svhs and Hi8 feature, that is why I by oversight have indicated Svhs in my previous post.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dpalomaki View Post
FWIW:
AVI is a file type developed by Microsoft (Audio/Video Interleave) and is a container for video/audio data, not the actual video which is encoded in the file using a CODEC. It is a bit like a book case that contains books, but you need to know the language of each book before you can read it. Similarly your viewing device must have the appropriate CODEC before it can display an AVI file. AVI files can be large or small depending on the CODEC used.
That individual devices support (e.g., TVs, DVD/BD players. cable STBs) is up to the manufacturer and may be driven by a variety if factors not the least of which include potential copyright use royalties (often listed in the back of the user manuals).
I am not sure, but if you refer to my previous claim about Samsung Smart Tvs do not accept Avi, well, both myself and my Client do have Samsung Smart Tvs and although in their manuals both .Avi Container and .Avi files are in the list of compatible formats, they are not. In Samsung forums (at least in my country, Italy) there are plenty of complaints to Samsung about this. Personally I am not to much bothered about this because I am not used to work with thois container and files, but It might be the case now should I end up generating Avi for my specific issue of avoiding encoding (but I do not think I will) .
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  #28  
01-16-2022, 08:28 AM
dpalomaki dpalomaki is offline
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FWIW: The following link is to a site that claims to list the supported containers and codec and related limitations for Samsung smart TV going back a number of years. You may need to brows it a bit to find the models of interest to you.

https://developer.samsung.com/smartt...fications.html
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  #29  
01-16-2022, 10:00 AM
leinrac leinrac is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dpalomaki View Post
FWIW: The following link is to a site that claims to list the supported containers and codec and related limitations for Samsung smart TV going back a number of years. You may need to brows it a bit to find the models of interest to you.

https://developer.samsung.com/smartt...fications.html
In fact many Samsung tv owners (like me) do complain that Avi containers and avi files are supposed to be supported , whereas in reality the are not in particular the tv models released during the last 2-3 years .
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  #30  
01-16-2022, 11:18 AM
dpalomaki dpalomaki is offline
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FWIW: I have a 2013 vintage Samsung Smart TV. Attached is a page from the User Manual that details the file format & codec support, including supported resolutions. Different models may offer different support. For the model I have it is rather limited. (However, I did not buy it with video on USB media in mind.)

Note that the DV codec is not listed, nor are the usual SD formats (720x480 and 720x486). Thus an AVI coded in them is unlikely to play. However I was able to play an AVI in the AVC (aka MPEG4) codec which is listed. So no surprises there.

Maybe consult the manual for the model(s) you have and try AVI files with listed codecs and resolutions.

Of course that can means recoding the DV material to a supported codec and resolution


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  #31  
01-16-2022, 11:40 AM
leinrac leinrac is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dpalomaki View Post
FWIW: I have a 2013 vintage Samsung Smart TV. Attached is a page from the User Manual that details the file format & codec support, including supported resolutions. Different models may offer different support. For the model I have it is rather limited. (However, I did not buy it with video on USB media in mind.)

Note that the DV codec is not listed, nor are the usual SD formats (720x480 and 720x486). Thus an AVI coded in them is unlikely to play. However I was able to play an AVI in the AVC (aka MPEG4) codec which is listed. So no surprises there.

Maybe consult the manual for the model(s) you have and try AVI files with listed codecs and resolutions.

Of course that can means recoding the DV material to a supported codec and resolution
FWIW: I usef to have a similar vintage Samsung Tv and it use to work fine and support Avi ad well. I understand that most recents Samsung Smart tvs do not support Avi any more and many buyers complain about this. In any case I do not have any problem with that as I woould not encode to Avi , my purpose is to avoid encoding.
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  #32  
01-16-2022, 12:59 PM
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lordsmurf lordsmurf is offline
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In 10 years, you're going to realize that encoding video to appease a TV was really stupid to do. People constantly regret all the BS that was done to appease DVD players with DivX in the 2000s into the 2010s.

Encoding a copy to the limited devices/need is fine.
Encoding the master is dumb.

So:
yes = DV tapes > master transferred DV files (or lossless capture) > copy to make dumb "smart" TV happy
yes = DV tapes > transfer/capture, encode to quality file like high bitrate 4:2:2 MPEG > copy to make dumb "smart" TV happy
no = DV tape > master encode to make dumb "smart" TV happy

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  #33  
01-16-2022, 01:17 PM
leinrac leinrac is offline
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FWIW: interesting enough, I have an HDD recorder with FireWire IN. I can transfer 4:3 DAR footages from Dv Camcorder and selecting 16:9 option in the HDD RECORDER I can obtain 720 x 576 (I am in Europe) footages with anamorphic 16:9 DAR. This is the good part of it. the bad part is that , once recorded the trasfered video, I can only record on dvd. No other way out from the hard disk of the HDD Recorder. In other words, I have to trasfer footage to HDD , then put it on dvd and then to pc for finally store it into usb pendrive (after merging the vob files) . Way too long… Maybe (not sure) I might record steaight to dvd instead of hdd but I do not like that idea as if something goes wrong with the dvd I would have to start all over again. At the end of the day, I wonder if really there is no software out there that can simply allow me to transfer and obtain the footage in anamorphic 16:9 DAR at one go same as my LG HDD recorder.

This said, if there is no further suggestion or idea, I will not pursue this thread and Wish to thank all who have tried to support me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lordsmurf View Post
In 10 years, you're going to realize that encoding video to appease a TV was really stupid to do. People constantly regret all the BS that was done to appease DVD players with DivX in the 2000s into the 2010s.

Encoding a copy to the limited devices/need is fine.
Encoding the master is dumb.

So:
yes = DV tapes > master transferred DV files (or lossless capture) > copy to make dumb "smart" TV happy
yes = DV tapes > transfer/capture, encode to quality file like high bitrate 4:2:2 MPEG > copy to make dumb "smart" TV happy
no = DV tape > master encode to make dumb "smart" TV happy
I agree but my problem is the Lack of time that is the reason why. I had hoped it would be d’implementazione to find a solution but if there is not then of course I will have to do nothing else Than encoding…

-- merged --

Sorry the automatic typing messed up:
“I had hoped it would have been easy to find a solution…”
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  #34  
01-16-2022, 02:25 PM
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Try to edit your recent posts, or use the multi-quote button to the right of the QUOTE button. Making multiple posts in a row means I have to take the time to merge.

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  #35  
01-16-2022, 02:49 PM
leinrac leinrac is offline
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Sorry, I apologize, will follow the suggested procedure from now on
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