Test .avi file to see if it has RFI problems?

[rocko]

Well, Here we go again. This time I Un-plugged my Mitsubishi HS-HD2000U VCR from the power strip coming from my UPS which other things are plugged into...(XP Capture PC, and 2 Monitors/AVtoolbox)..And ran Directly to UPS, because some recent, previouse captures still showed signs of RFI or something making wiggly/jiggly/ video noise on Video input from VCR..After many hours of trial and error, I narrowed it down to the VCR and/or Cables....Then I Captured a small .AVI file to share here, which played fine on Capture XP PC. But after transferring .avi file to USB stick,and then to Video PC..It looks like Psycodelic Steam Train!!WTF??..Will try Transfer to USB stick again later, but thought I would share with others my typical luck with all this PC/Capture stuff!..

Don't Give Up!!..Keep working at it!!

BTW this is a copy of a Professionally made VHS which closely resembles my home-made footage for analysis porpoises

[Goldwingfahrer]

however, looks terrible

My Huffyuv_MT,Screen 2
view Huffyuv_MT in the new VDub,Screen 3

[premiumcapture]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goldwingfahrer

however, looks terrible

My Huffyuv_MT,Screen 2
view Huffyuv_MT in the new VDub,Screen 3

I agree, looks like a codec issue. I have been recently fond of FFV1 through ffdshow, you might have better luck trying that out. Not sure if there is a guide around here for it, but you may also want to try lagarith.

[sanlyn]

I'd go for Lagarith. More widely compatible, and even VLC Player supports it now. Besides, you can't save YV12 working files with huffyuv except the ffdshow huff version, which changes every time somebody at ffdshow gets bored. Huffyuv is still preferred for YUY2 capture, but the same dll version can look different on every machine. My captures are huffyuv but get archived as Lagarith when transferred off my capture PC.

I'm surprised you hadn't notice that compatibility problem with huff earlier. some people suggest UT video codec. Another great geek idea until you find out how many people don't use it, and many media players won't decode it.

ffv1 is OK I guess for private use, but like many people I'm tired of installing or setting-up every niche codec that comes along, so I don't even look at a lot of forum samples that use them.

To save all or part of HFYU video as Lagarith, open the file in VirtualDub, set Lagarith as compression and desired colorspace output, then save with "fast recompress".

[premiumcapture]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sanlyn

To save all or part of HFYU video as Lagarith, open the file in VirtualDub, set Lagarith as compression and desired colorspace output, then save with "fast recompress".

Does this subsample or is it a true copy?

[sanlyn]

Define subsample. Are you talking about changing the colorspace? That's not being discussed here.

It's a true copy using a different compressor. You use the same colorspace for output that is used for input.

If you open a YUY2 huff video in Avisynth, apply YV12 filters, then try to save it in that same YV12 with huffyuv, you're out of luck. huff will resample and save as another colorspace.

Does ffv1 make a true copy if the original compressor isn't ffv1? How about ZIP? If you take a zip file and unzip it, then save it as RAR or 7z, is the result a true copy? Do you use the same ffv1 compressor/thread/etc.,etc. settings for every file and every PC and CPU you used it with? How much time do you spend getting into your PC's detailed specs and trial runs of ffv1's settings?

[premiumcapture]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sanlyn

Define subsample. Are you talking about changing the colorspace? That's not being discussed here.

It's a true copy using a different compressor. You use the same colorspace for output that is used for input.

If you open a YUY2 huff video in Avisynth, apply YV12 filters, then try to save it in that same YV12 with huffyuv, you're out of luck. huff will resample and save as another colorspace.

Not changing the color space, but as the capture will likely be at 4:2:2, will the conversion sample that capture at 4:2:2 or make an exact copy?

[rocko]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goldwingfahrer

however, looks terrible

Thanks all!..This never happened B-4 with any MPEG or AVI files from my capture (XP) PC, In Fact the same file plays fine on Capture PC with ATI File player, this is 1st time it looks horrible on my Win 7 PC, just was wondering if it looks bad, on other PC's.(If you are seeing what I am seeing...(Horrible multi-colered zig-zag noise covering most of screen,with a train barely visible in the middle of it!)...I did recently re-install Huffyuv single/regular version after reading that was better than the multithread version for capturing...so right now both versions are on my Capture PC, But I made sure to select the single/regular version in ATI MMC Codec Huffyuv "configure" dialog box...Maybe I should remove the Multi-threaded versoin? and not have both versions on the same PC?

[sanlyn]

I have both versions on my PC. No problems. But now and then I encounter samples in post where huffyuv doesn't open properly without using tricks like enabling ffdshow's version, or using something like DirectShowSource, and sometimes it just never decodes correctly so I ignore that sample. Your problem might be MMC, which overwrites several YUV registry entries with ATI's own versions of some codecs. You don't need MMC to capture or edit lossless AVI. Most users never install it (drivers, WDM capture, and Control Panel are all you need). You might have some additional codec packs installed somewhere; those all-in-ones create horrible situations, the only one that doesn't create damage is the ffdshow package (and you should disable their version of huffyuv in the configuration panel). That happened to me some years back, solved only by completely removing ATI and reinstalling it without MMC's and its codecs. MMC's player was hot stuff in 2002, but it's pretty old hat by now anyway. But it's your choice, use whatever you want.

A question I asked earlier but didn't get a reply: if you run that huffyuv video in an Avisynth script that requires YV12 filters, how do you save that file in huffyuv? The codec doesn't support YV12, which leaves you with no choice but to re-convert back to YUY2 again or to RGB. Those re-conversions work only up to a point before you start seeing damage....Oh, well, that's a different subject anyway.

It's pretty clear there's a problem with huffyuv. Like I said, I use the older huff version for capture because it's fast on my slowpoke old AGP machines. But it gets copied to hard drives for transfer elsewhere by fast recompress with Lagarith. If I try to open those original huff captures on another PC, I get the same junk you saw in half my media players, and VirtualDub opens them correctly only when opened via Avisynth scripts. Unless your ATI cards are the same or similar ATI+MMC vintage on all your other machines, huff becomes a problem. It pops up now and then on other forums, too.

[rocko]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sanlyn

I have both versions on my PC. No problems. But now and then I encounter samples in post where huffyuv doesn't open properly without using tricks like enabling ffdshow's version, or using something like DirectShowSource, and sometimes it just never decodes correctly so I ignore that sample. Your problem might be MMC, which overwrites several YUV registry entries with ATI's own versions of some codecs. You don't need MMC to capture or edit lossless AVI. Most users never install it (drivers, WDM capture, and Control Panel are all you need). You might have some additional codec packs installed somewhere; those all-in-ones create horrible situations, the only one that doesn't create damage is the ffdshow package (and you should disable their version of huffyuv in the configuration panel). That happened to me some years back, solved only by completely removing ATI and reinstalling it without MMC's and its codecs. MMC's player was hot stuff in 2002, but it's pretty old hat by now anyway. But it's your choice, use whatever you want.

A question I asked earlier but didn't get a reply: if you run that huffyuv video in an Avisynth script that requires YV12 filters, how do you save that file in huffyuv? The codec doesn't support YV12, which leaves you with no choice but to re-convert back to YUY2 again or to RGB. Those re-conversions work only up to a point before you start seeing damage....Oh, well, that's a different subject anyway.

It's pretty clear there's a problem with huffyuv. Like I said, I use the older huff version for capture because it's fast on my slowpoke old AGP machines. But it gets copied to hard drives for transfer elsewhere by fast recompress with Lagarith. If I try to open those original huff captures on another PC, I get the same junk you saw in half my media players, and VirtualDub opens them correctly only when opened via Avisynth scripts. Unless your ATI cards are the same or similar ATI+MMC vintage on all your other machines, huff becomes a problem. It pops up now and then on other forums, too.

Yes I put together my XP/ATI 9600XT capture system about 2010 following the DFAQ guides, But kept it "clean" on purpouse, not having anything but ATI/Creative sounblaster software on it, but just added virtual Dub 1.9.11+filters to it,so I can capture using it, instead of MMC..Plus I Just added Avidmux 2.6.10/V-Dub 1.9.11+filters/Audacity/and G-spot to my Win 7 PC, after-which I all that, is when the problem started. No added Codec packs, exept maybe any that may have come with recently added programs?

[sanlyn]

Hmm. AviDemux has no version of huffyuv of its own, nor does VirtualDub. But let's go back a bit. Other users already know that all versions of huffyuv install differently on different machines and different operating systems. Sometimes it works in a universal manner, sometimes it doesn't. No one knows exactly why, and no one has an answer. In my own work I have two old slowpoke XP AGC machines for capture with huffyuv. Those huffs play OK on a couple of newer non-ATI PCs but won't behave on two others. And as I said, I've downloaded huffyuv samples from various forums, some made with ATI WDM capture and some made with other setups. Most work, some don't. Forum members report they can read the video, others report that the same video won't decode. Huff is known to be inconsistent with Win7 and Win8. Using 32-bit versions of Avisynth/VirtualDub and filters on one system and 64-bit on another is another problem.

One thing you can try on your non-ATI PC: go into VirtualDub -> "Options" -> "Preference" and the "Display" category in the left-hand list. Disable DirectX playback, then restart VirtualDub. If DirectX is already disabled, enable it, then restart VDub. If that doesn't solve the problem, then it's more complicated.

Another trick that sometimes makes a difference: Go into the huffyuv configuration window. If "always suggest RGB" is enabled, disable it. It should be disabled anyway.

Better yet, it's easy enough to make an experiment. Install Lagarith on both PCs. You can download it here: http://lags.leetcode.net/LagarithSetup_1327.exe. The Lagarith installer puts 32-bit LAG into XP, and automatically puts 32-bit and 64-bit in different locations in Win7/64. On your capture PC, open a huff sample and do this in VirtualDub:
- set "Video" -> "color depth" to YUY2
- set "Video" -> "compression" to Lagarith lossless codec.
- You will see the small Lagarith configuration menu. In the window are 4 checkboxes. The only box that should be checked is "Use Multithreading". Uncheck all the others.
- On the right-hand side, set the "Mode" window to YUY2.
- Click "OK" and exit from those menus.
- In the VDub top "Video" menu, enable "fast recompress".
- Save the new AVI.

The AVI should play normally on both PCs in VLC (if it's a newer edition), VirtualDub, MPC-BE, and WMP.

[rocko]

Thanks for the info! (BTW my win 7 PC is 64bit)... actually good to know how huffyuv behaves on different systems, and from different sources...(Affects both capture and playback of captured files?)...And I can tend to really get things mixed-up sometimes, but eventually get it!..All the test .avi/huffyuv files I have captured in past have had no problems on playback (Like the UP844 one I recently uploaded for analysis). So there is obviously something I have changed on both XP/Win7-64 PC's by removing, then re-installing huffyuv on XP Capture PC..(Based on confusion whether to use the single or multithread versions on Cap PC, which I currently have Both versions installed in Programs)...I was successfully using the multithread (2 core) version before on Cap PC, But then stumbled on an older thread with a comment by kpmedia to never(?) use the multithread vers. to capture....But I Shouldn't have tried to fix something that wasn't broke!! I will try your suggestions, Also will check on my PC for those original huff files that were working b-4.

[lordsmurf]

Plain Huffyuv non-MT/non-64 is my choice.
KISS (keep it simple, stupid).

That video sample plays all garbled for me. Is that your problem?

[sanlyn]

Right. I should mention stick to 32-bit wherever you can. Supposedly, caps made with huff-MT and huff-nonMT should be readable by any version of huffyuv. It usually is, but no one can explain those odd birds that show up and ain't decodable on another machine.

The capture isn't affected. It's transferring to another system that brings up the playback problem. The original itself isn't changed -- except in the case of the saved sample you posted, but that's not the original capture, it's just an edited and recompressed copy as "interpreted" by VirtualDub on another PC.

Legend has it that's it's really Windows registry's fault. I don't doubt it. If you ever look inside that beast, it's enough to make you cringe.

[rocko]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lordsmurf

Plain Huffyuv non-MT/non-64 is my choice.
KISS (keep it simple, stupid).

That video sample plays all garbled for me. Is that your problem?

Yes,all garbled/Psycodelic...Train barely visible in center...didn't have this problem untill I recently monkeyed around with huffyuv codec on XP Cap PC!...It was working OK last few years with Multithread(?) version, and ATI MMC..I am now thinking I had my PC guy install huffyuv along with MMC install, back in 2010, when I wasn't very computer literate....Now I have mixed everything up by Un-installing original huffyuv,then Re-installing both single and multi versions I will also try another test Cap and see if it's OK.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sanlyn

Right. I should mention stick to 32-bit wherever you can. Supposedly, caps made with huff-MT and huff-nonMT should be readable by any version of huffyuv. It usually is, but no one can explain those odd birds that show up and ain't decodable on another machine.

The capture isn't affected. It's transferring to another system that brings up the playback problem. The original itself isn't changed -- except in the case of the saved sample you posted, but that's not the original capture, it's just an edited and recompressed copy as "interpreted" by VirtualDub on another PC.

Legend has it that's it's really Windows registry's fault. I don't doubt it. If you ever look inside that beast, it's enough to make you cringe.

Wow Man! Think I'll go ride my bike/have some dinner, then come back to this later,but won't give up!..Thanks again

[sanlyn]

Huffyuv is uninstalled in the Control Panel, which I hope is the way you're removing it.

This same problem drove me nuts a few years back, I even screamed and moaned in a couple of forums. Then I saw it happen to others. I figure I should have bought faster CPU's than the skinny 2GHz AMD's I used for my capture PCs, but...well, you know how it goes on a tight budget and you're just not patient enough at the time to invest another $50. But the huff/Lagarith routine is working OK so far. Eventually you'd need Lagarith anyway to work with YV12.

[rocko]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sanlyn

Huffyuv is uninstalled in the Control Panel, which I hope is the way you're removing it.

This same problem drove me nuts a few years back, I even screamed and moaned in a couple of forums. Then I saw it happen to others. I figure I should have bought faster CPU's than the skinny 2GHz AMD's I used for my capture PCs, but...well, you know how it goes on a tight budget and you're just not patient enough at the time to invest another $50. But the huff/Lagarith routine is working OK so far. Eventually you'd need Lagarith anyway to work with YV12.

Yes: Control panel>Programs>"Huffyuv (Remove Only)"

[lordsmurf]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sanlyn

I figure I should have bought faster CPU's than the skinny 2GHz AMD's I used for my capture PCs

That CPU are fine for Huffyuv. No bottlenecks on the CPU.

[sanlyn]

Yep, it's pretty nifty for a dual-core. I even had After Effects CS3 running with it and a BluRay player. But maybe just a tad pokey during capture for Lagarith back in 2007. But huff is so predictable and reliable with those AIW's, I just can't let go of it.

[Goldwingfahrer]

Quote:

Yes: Control panel>Programs>"Huffyuv (Remove Only)"

Why remove, is a matter deactivating with VCSwap.
Period put.

My Huffyuv_MT version from 2007,see screen

and here a short cutting with Huffyuv_MT
Pal, VHS Capture, ancient tape.Ca 240 MB

www.ww-consulting.ch/DL/Huff_MT.rar