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-   -   Blackmagic Design Intensity Pro capture card for VHS? (http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/video-capture/9229-blackmagic-design-intensity.html)

Mazufa 12-13-2018 12:38 PM

Blackmagic Design Intensity Pro capture card for VHS?
 
Hello! :)

I will buy myself a blackmagic design intensity pro capture card. My purpose is to connect a VHS recorder to it because I need to digitize my VHS cassette.

For me, it is a bit unclear what cables I need to get a video and sound to work.

What kind of cables do I need to get my VHS recorder connected to Blackmagic design intensity pro capture card?

I want to use the video to transfer the S-video cable.

Blackmagic cable: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Blackmagic-...O/140945312060

S-video cable adabter: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Blackmagic-...W/143046520438

What kind of audio cable do I need to get VHS recorder sound connected to capture card?

Thanks a lot for help in advance! :)

I apologize for my poor English language skills.

lordsmurf 12-13-2018 01:29 PM

That's literally the worst cards you could buy for VHS. You will have problems.
Buy an ATI 600 USB. Cheaper, better.

Mazufa 12-13-2018 01:37 PM

What is the problem with the Blackmagic Design Intensity Pro hijacking card?

Roxio DVL Plus 3 VHS capture device I have in the box, but I do not know if it's good ....

What kind of cable Blackmagic Design Intensity Pro can turn on the sound side of the VHS recorder?

I just want to get a good capture card for VHS digitization. I'm about to buy a capture card tomorrow. Please recommend me good quality cards :)

Is this a good capture card for VHS digitization? Will this picture be of good quality?:
http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53...e/183293448990

lordsmurf 12-13-2018 02:09 PM

Please do not post multiple posts, edit your previous one (up to 1 hour) to add more.

You've not done your research on capture cards.

- ATI AIW is excellent, but requires Windows XP, and not all of the AIW are as perfect as others. The 128 Pro AGP is probably one of the least desirable, right after the AIW PCIe.

- Blackmagic has known issues with SD video, especially unreported dropped frames. It's an HD card that poorly works with SD. Even Blackmagic has admitted to this.

- As mentioned, I have an ATI 600 USB available. After my own extra cards ran out, I acquired a lot of them specifically to resell to members here, people who are having trouble finding the best cards, or knowing what to get. These cards were $100+ new, and mine are $75 -- far less than a Blackmagic paper weight. It annoys me to be ignored. Why waste my time helping site members, investing my own money to buy something, if member just ignore the good advice they're being given, and pass on the quality cards. WTF?

- If you want one of the better AIW cards, and have an AIW USB as well. But again, WinXP required. Excellent card, worth the effort of installing XP on an extra capture-only box/system.

Mazufa 12-13-2018 02:10 PM

I live in Finland so the capture card must have PAL support.

I'll take the capture card according to your recommendations.

Thanks! :)

lordsmurf 12-13-2018 02:21 PM

You were posting while I was. :)

I've sent you a PM.

- The 600 USB captures PAL lossless quite nicely in VirtualDub, and uses Windows XP through 10.
- The AIW USB captures PAL both lossless and MPEG, but with Windows XP only. And potentially with Mac, still looking into the details there. My preference is always for AIW when possible. It's worth building XP boxes.

Eric-Jan 12-16-2018 05:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lordsmurf (Post 57809)
- Blackmagic has known issues with SD video, especially unreported dropped frames. It's an HD card that poorly works with SD. Even Blackmagic has admitted to this.

You keep telling this in many posts, did you ever use a Blackmagic Design product, or could you give a link to a to that BlackMagic Design "statement" ? "unreported dropped frames" sounds a bit vague, and fake, to prove something...
or did you have bad service from BlackMagic Design ?

lordsmurf 12-16-2018 06:03 AM

BM support telling folks "not for VHS" has been reported across multiple forums, for several years now. Users have been griping about this problem since at least 2011. Some have called, some have discussed the content of those calls. I know I've seen some on VH and Creative Cow, but there were others. Avid forums and whatnot.

There's no "official statement" printed anywhere that you're looking for. In the video hardware industry, where marketing sometimes usurps technical accuracy, transparent honesty is uncommon.

Yes, I've used so many items that I sometimes forget what all I used. I've been doing this literally for decades now. Some of the more obscure devices start to blur together, as does software, scripts, methods. Ever since my medical issues started some years ago, I've not been as meticulous at keeping notes as I once was. But the BM dropped frames issue is a biggie, something I clearly remember.

Magewell has the same issue, though no admission to fault that I've seen.

There have also been samples posted in various places. I used to have some, but a large chunk of my data was misplaced in 2013. Hopefully not lost. Hoping to sort it in 2019 finally.

Eric-Jan 12-16-2018 06:56 AM

I mention this, because i have no problems with my Intensity Shuttle, you do need how to setup things, true, but that's the case for most of these things, i also have no legacy probems this way.
and try things myself, and not by rumours, with no trust worthy foundation, or by hear say.
Most of the time only failures are reported, and those are from usb or ati legacy devices ? plus, OS problems.

lordsmurf 12-16-2018 07:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric-Jan (Post 57872)
I mention this, because i have no problems with my Intensity Shuttle, you do need how to setup things, true, but that's the case for most of these things, i also have no legacy probems this way.
and try things myself, and not by rumours, with no trust worthy foundation, or by hear say.

But it's my understanding that you're converting the signal with a DVD recorder, outputting component to the Blackmagic. It's a different workflow than usual. You're at the mercy of the DVD recorder capture quality.

The SD issue mention applies to s-video or composite. It expects clean pro sources, not consumer sources like VHS. The DVD recorder component is acting as buffer, outputting a clean signal. (Don't confuse this with a TBC. You can have terrible image quality, with signal issues, input into a recorder. The output is all that matters here. Most DVD recorders do not have passthrough ability, not even other Panasonic models.)

You're one of the few that claims to have a pleasant experience, though I still wonder how closely you're paying attention to detail. To date, you've only shown the one sample.

ELinder 12-16-2018 09:31 AM

Actually, I've been using my Blackmagic Design Intensity Shuttle Thunderbolt while learning and testing things for my VHS captures, and have had no problems so far. Well, other than finding a bug in how Davinci Resolve handles some interlaced footage which I've reported to BMD. However, I'm just now getting to the point of critical examining the captures, so that opinion may change once I start also looking at captures made with an ATI/Windows setup. Also, my setup is almost as optimal as can be from a Mac standpoint, so that may also be why I've been trouble free so far.

Erich

Eric-Jan 12-16-2018 09:52 AM

I'm using this recorder also as VHS player, so not as pass-through for another VHS player, i'm pleased with it, maybe i have no "pro" eye, i do little to no work in post, also less quality recordings come out quiet good through this way, resolution stays VHS quality though :) filters only make it more worse is my experience, and takes a lot of render time, have good experiences with Shotcut, Avidemux, MacX Video Converter Pro, and Davinci Resolve, (i work on MacBook Pro only)
I found a good tip to find the metadata of a (video) file,(get info doesn't show all) ... from a terminal window > mdls folowed by a space, and drag the file into this window, and press enter.
My output will mostly 720x576p for PAL, and 720x480 for NTSC, Avidemux has a nice "mask" option, so no transform is needed.
I only have dropped frames when the data rate of the capture stream is too high, i only capture to my internal SSD, so i move files from this SSD to external drives to make room again. My SSD is the fastes device in my setup.
The ports for external storage are not so fast on my MacBook is my guess.... that's my dilemma... :(
lossy capturing (Prores422 LT) is good enough for VHS is my experience, you can't compair that with H264MPEG encoding

Eric-Jan 12-16-2018 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELinder (Post 57874)
Actually, I've been using my Blackmagic Design Intensity Shuttle Thunderbolt while learning and testing things for my VHS captures, and have had no problems so far. Well, other than finding a bug in how Davinci Resolve handles some interlaced footage which I've reported to BMD. However, I'm just now getting to the point of critical examining the captures, so that opinion may change once I start also looking at captures made with an ATI/Windows setup. Also, my setup is almost as optimal as can be from a Mac standpoint, so that may also be why I've been trouble free so far.

Erich

Only with the Studio version of Davinci Resolve you can de-interlace i thought.... further ... the bug i noticed, is that settings get changed when using Media Express, so i have to check this when starting that software, :(
further, i experiment with the amount of compression for the final MP4/MKV.

ELinder 12-16-2018 12:36 PM

Blackmagic capture devices of all sorts are notorious for dropped frames from non-digital media. It's a frequent discussion on even the BMD forums. Yes, deinterlacing is a Resolve Studio only feature, but I don't use it. It's not that good and unless there is a specific reason to deinterlace it's better to leave it interlaced.

What do you mean by Media Express changing setting?

What metadata are you looking for to jump thru that hoop to use Terminal? Quicktime and VLC show lots of media information.

Erich

dpalomaki 12-16-2018 02:52 PM

I have used both BM Intensity Pro and Intensity Pro 4K.

They expect a very good, stable, legal signal and will have issues with signals that have poor/sloppy sync, as is often the case with consumer VCR outputs. A TBC will help. (The Pro 4k is a bit more tolerant of sloppy signal than its predecessor card.)

However, the 4K does a very poor job with component input. In the tests I ran a year or so ago with SMPTE color bar sources with both SD and 1080i input signals the 4k records levels from the YUV input that are significantly off . It looks really ugly on a vector scope. This is a problem that apparently BM cannot (or will not) fix with a pushed firmware update. On the other hand its HDMI, Y/C and composite levels were close to the expected levels.

For my purposes the Intensity Pro cards offer two main benefits, HDMI input and HDMI output (from within my NLE), and they work with WIN 7 and up and in modern PCs.

Eric-Jan 12-17-2018 12:24 PM

I guess i am very lucky to have a very good VHS vcr deck in my ES35V (Panasonic) because i never have any dropped frames, even with fast forward, and i've set the software to stop capture when frames are dropped, an other older Sony vcr, does not work at all with the Intensity Shuttle indeed...
Quote:

Originally Posted by dpalomaki (Post 57886)
However, the 4K does a very poor job with component input. In the tests I ran a year or so ago with SMPTE color bar sources with both SD and 1080i input signals the 4k records levels from the YUV input that are significantly off . It looks really ugly on a vector scope. This is a problem that apparently BM cannot (or will not) fix with a pushed firmware update. On the other hand its HDMI, Y/C and composite levels were close to the expected levels.

that's a shame, i was playing with the thought buying that card if i ever wanted a Windows PC again, MS Windows has some advantages having software available, which isn't on the Mac OS.

Bogilein 12-17-2018 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric-Jan (Post 57899)
I guess i am very lucky to have a very good VHS vcr deck in my ES35V (Panasonic) because i never have any dropped frames, even with fast forward, and i've set the software to stop capture when frames are dropped, an other older Sony vcr, does not work at all with the Intensity Shuttle indeed...

You should think about how the SVHS/DVD combo work.
The vcr isn't better as other vcr's. You use the dvd recorder part which makes a stable signal. If the vcr part would be separately you would have outputs for the vcr part and the dvd recorder part.

Your pathway inside of this combo is vcr - analog to digital conversation for the mpg capture of the dvd recorder part - digital to analog conversation for the scart, Y/C output.

Eric-Jan 12-18-2018 10:59 AM

No. I get analog YUV interlaced/progressive video over the component output, (3x RCA) most combo's only output the DVD player over the component output, not so with the ES35V... and it's just a VHS not a Super-VHS deck.
When set to interlaced, it outputs RGB for a CRT tv, when set to progressive it outputs YUV for a plasma or LED/LCD screen.
I have the EU version, so it has also SCART connectors.
I don't know if a MPEG2 recording would have better quality though....

captainvic 12-18-2018 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dpalomaki (Post 57886)
I have used both BM Intensity Pro and Intensity Pro 4K.

They expect a very good, stable, legal signal and will have issues with signals that have poor/sloppy sync, as is often the case with consumer VCR outputs. A TBC will help. (The Pro 4k is a bit more tolerant of sloppy signal than its predecessor card.)

However, the 4K does a very poor job with component input. In the tests I ran a year or so ago with SMPTE color bar sources with both SD and 1080i input signals the 4k records levels from the YUV input that are significantly off . It looks really ugly on a vector scope. This is a problem that apparently BM cannot (or will not) fix with a pushed firmware update. On the other hand its HDMI, Y/C and composite levels were close to the expected levels.

Does anyone have experience with the Blackmagic UltraStudio 4K? In particular, does the UltraStudio 4K suffer from the same issues described above with dropped frames from VHS and problems with YUV levels? When I search this forum for "UltraStudio" I don't see a lot of hits. Thanks!

ELinder 12-20-2018 11:06 AM

Search the BlackMagic forums, those issues have been mentioned there.


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