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  #1  
03-13-2019, 12:14 AM
jwillis84 jwillis84 is offline
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Thanks are due to Lordsmurf for 'guiding' the selection of which DVD recorders to try next.

This is going a lot faster than anticipated, and I didn't want to flood the forum with too many separate topics. So.. now, A Late Delivery from Avalon.

This Software can read a Hard Drive removed from the DVD recorder and connected to a PC and copy its recordings over to the PC... multiple versions have been released.

These are pre-Beta, Alpha quality releases. They work and have had some testing, but may still have quirks or bugs. Commentary and bug reports are being invited to improve and refine the functionality.

The latest version includes support for all of the recorders included in the last Alpha, whether it was released to the public or not. The version number is displayed in the About box.

Alpha 1 included (Toshiba support) was version 4.3.1.00 (4.4 alpha)
Alpha 2 included (Philips / Mag support) : 4.3.2.00
Alpha 3 includes (RCA 8030 support) : 4.3.2.01

i.e. The Latest Alpha version of 4.3.2.01 contains support for the following:

Toshiba RD-XS32, 50, 52, 34, 54, 35, 55, 34SB, 34SJ extractions are working.
Philips 3575 and 3576 extractions are working.
Magnavox 2160 and 513 extractions are working.
RCA DRC8030 extractions are working.

The Alpha 4.3.2.01 is available for download from (here)
I've posted a video of the process with the 3575 (here)

If you are adverse to running the software on Windows, the software is also known to work under WINE on Linux, and there are several options for running on the Mac.

Details are available on this page (How to run on Linux and Mac)

Have a great evening.

Last edited by jwillis84; 03-13-2019 at 01:02 AM.
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  #2  
03-13-2019, 04:51 PM
jwillis84 jwillis84 is offline
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addendum (correction):

"Details are available on this page (How to run on Linux and Mac)"

should have had a different link:

How to run on Linux and Mac
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  #3  
12-13-2019, 10:49 PM
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Can you give a quick step-by-step?

My RCA 8030 DVD drive has failed. So I need to extract the recordings. I have a Windows XP system that can be used.

Is it as easy as:
- remove HDD
- insert HDD to turned-off XP system
- boot XP
- do not do anything when it asks about the new HDD, just cancel the prompt
- start ISOBuster

In ISO Buster, where to?

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  #4  
12-14-2019, 01:07 AM
jwillis84 jwillis84 is offline
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Quite a bit has changed, but its only gotten easier.

1. remove the HDD
2. attach the drive to an IDE to USB adapter, do not adjust any of the jumpers on the drive
3. install Isobuster 4.4 or above, DVR support started being added with 4.4 more brands have been added since
4. connect the adapter to the PC and power up the adapter, you do not have to restart the PC
5. dismiss the popup window which says you need to initialize the drive (do not allow it to initialize the drive)
6. run Isobuster
7. Isobuster usually selects the correct most recently attached drive by itself, but if it does not use the Upper Left box to select it
8. Isobuster will (very) quickly scan the drive and create a folder called "Recordings"
9. Focus on the files in the "Recordings" folder, any other folders are different ways to look at the same thing

A. Before License Activation, Isobuster will show, but not allow Extracting the Recordings from HDD
B. Show means it will Show the Title (if they have titles), Date of Recording and Approximate Size
C. After License Activation, Isobuster will allow selecting a single recording by right clicking and choosing Run or Extract
D. After License Activation, Isobuster will allow selecting multiple or (all) recordings and right clicking and choosing Run or Extract

"Run" means the recording will be "temporarily" extracted and then submitted to whatever Playback program Windows thinks can handle playing the video file. These are MPEG2 video files so your XP will need a licensed MPEG2 decoder, or a third party application with its own codec cache, like VLC

"Extract" means the recording will be "copy" extracted and placed wherever it is told to place the copy.

I've used a raw Parallel IDE cable to a motherboard.

I've used a Startech HDD USB Dock with Parallel IDE cable to USB port, UNIDOCK2U

I currently use this IDE to USB 3.0 adapter, Ugreen USB Adapter

You don't really have to remove the drive if you can attach a Parallel IDE ribbon cable from the drive to an adapter or dock while its still sitting in the DVR chassis, but I've found it easy to remove the drive and its metal support carrier as a unit. The drive screws are sometimes sealed to the metal carrier with blue plastic Locktite.. but this usually only happens with very expensive DVRs, like those from JVC.

As for "even easier".. Peter continues to make it "smarter" and more intuitive. He is releasing a newer version in a few days which will also have more brand models supported.

Last edited by jwillis84; 12-14-2019 at 02:02 AM.
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  #5  
12-14-2019, 01:22 AM
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I don't have an IDE to USB adapter. Is direct connection via IDE still fine? (I never liked those IDE>USB adapters anyway, had some issues in years past, could nuke the drive.)

Yep, time to buy yet another ISOBuster license.

Is there a way to extract all recordings in one pass, or select 3-4 or so? Babying the process recording-by-recording sound tedious. Sure, I'll do it, if given no choice. But still tedious.

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12-14-2019, 02:37 AM
jwillis84 jwillis84 is offline
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Two other tips:

A fourth option is to add an IDE to Bay adapter and using external cables, MK-210

The power supply provided with some adapters will not put out enough power to spin up the HDD. I currently use the power supply that came with the UNIDOCK2U with the Ugreen USB Adapter since it provides more amperage.

The fourth option would pull its power direct from the PC power supply, as long as it is not itself underpowered for the PC it should provide enough power to start the HDD.

Symptoms of the HDD not getting enough power are partial spin up, continuous spin up and then spin down (pulsing) but not stabilizing.. or the USB adapter or hard drive are not detected by the PC.. or the drive remains silent.

Usually if the DVR has not damaged the contents of the drive while it was failing, or even if it has.. Isobuster will still be able to see recordings and extract them.

Answer to Question: "extract all recordings in one pass?" absolutely.. it works just like selecting multiple files in Windows Explorer, select them all and then Right-Click the entire selection list and select "Extract" in one go.

Answer to Question: "Is direct connection via IDE still fine?" absolutely.. in a pinch you can use a direct connection to the motherboard, but may have to reset jumpers on the drive.. it totally depends on how your BIOS handles Secondary and Second ATA attached drives.. this makes it very hard to provide precise directions for an individual situation.. which is why I personally turned towards using USB to IDE adapters. In the end it was worth the pain.

Newer USB to IDE adapters come with smaller weaker power supplies compared to older USB to IDE adapters and docks. This is most likely because today's hard drives actually need less power, and its more likely they expect the adapter will be used with smaller laptop hard drives.

Last edited by jwillis84; 12-14-2019 at 02:56 AM.
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  #7  
12-14-2019, 04:13 AM
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Which version is ISOBuster do I need for this? Personal or Professional?

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12-14-2019, 09:43 AM
jwillis84 jwillis84 is offline
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I've sent you a PM about the License type.

By the way, the version of Windows does not matter when using Isobuster.

I use to test with XP all of the time when this feature was being developed, but now regularly use WIndows 7 x64 bit, and I have tested occasionally with Windows 10.

It works with Windows 10.

I do not recommend using Windows 10.
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  #9  
12-15-2019, 01:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jwillis84 View Post
the License type.
I just went ahead and bought the Pro license, to support the project.

Since I'd previously held a license, updating to Pro 4.x was only $45 total. The feature that looked most interesting, beyond DVD recorders, was the ability to create an image by trying in multiple drives, resuming construction of the image. I've needed that feature in the past, and may yet again.

When looking up my previous license, I learned that this is the 4th time I've bought ISOBuster. I'd bought 1, 2, 3 and now 4. I didn't remember that. (If he's able to conquer the LSI recorders, I may buy a few more!)

Extracting everything off the 8030 went smoothly, and not too slow. I didn't see any option to batch, and I extracted the MPEG frames only from the VRO recorded to the drive.

After Christmas I hope to have more time for myself again, will try the 3575 next. My 3575 failed recently, no longer powers up, data is trapped on the drive. Our old Panasonic needs to be looked at as well, some recordings may still be on it. If only Peter could tackle that Polaroid file system, this would be a perfect program. Lots of recordings still on mine.

Quote:
It works with Windows 10.
I do not recommend using Windows 10.

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  #10  
12-15-2019, 12:56 PM
jwillis84 jwillis84 is offline
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That's happy news.

We specifically focused on that model after you mentioned it earlier this year. I got lucky and found one to test with. It is a nice recorder and produces very nice video files.

It sounds to me like your a Power user and explore using a lot of the more advanced options regularly.

I wish I had that time. My interests drag me from task to task.. next shiney object.. grabbing my short attention.

The LSI recorders (Polaroid and JVC) are never far from my mind. I've spent a lot of time looking into their storage format. The meta data can be recovered fairly easily, but we've never made that last leap to connect the metadata to the video stream. They are all descendants from the same LSI Hobby kit they sold to those manufacturers to build their own DVRs.

Backtracking I have found pieces to that Hobby kit, but Polaroid and JVC seems to have gone separate ways when it came to actually storing things on disk. Polaroid seems to have stuck with the Hobby kit default example.. where JVC went off and did something else.

Toshiba, Pioneer, Panasonic, Thompson (Magnavox/Funai) were all part of the same group that defined DVD-video and when time came to build their DVRs they stuck pretty close to the specification they agreed upon.. so even though their hardware varies dramatically from company to company and model to model.. they do things conceptually nearly identically once you get over a few details.

Polaroid and JVC entered the same market after the others and trusted the LSI Hobby kit to get them to market the quickest with least development. I wonder what went through their heads when touching the on disk storage.. maybe one day I'll figure it out.. but very few people have ever looked at the disks. You have pointed out one or two guys that did in the past.. but they didn't dig nearly as deep as we've been going.. and getting so close.

One problem with finding and extracting the video is when we look at these we have to keep all that we learned in mind all at once. We can't switch back and forth between brands and models or we forget what we've learned. Its hard documenting how things are laid out. I've been looking at Hexinator to try and help get over that problem.. but its a hard program to learn how to use and takes time.

Another avenue is a year or so ago, I came across a surplus IDE analyzer, which can watch how the drive is used while its being used. I'm not sure if it will help.. but it might.

We will see what progresses after the first of the year.

Now that you (mention) "Batch".. you'll be happy to learn that Isobuster has a very thorough command line interface as well as its GUI.

It can override behaviors, set variables and execute commands.

I'm not sure if it has its own scripting language.. but it might. But you could use any scripting language you like with the command line interface to perform "batching".

Peter showed me the command line syntax one time.. he has a web page for it.. but customers don't always ask him about more advanced features. And I don't think there is a direct link off the main web pages anymore. He's turned towards simplifying and automating many of the basic functions to make it as streamlined and fast as possible.

I don't think he thinks the casual user, or highly stressed user trying to get their video back cares too much about advanced features.

Extracting speed.. is none too shabby.

Its really fast.

The limit is really the hard drive itself and how you attach it to the PC, but even USB 2.0 bumps up against the top speed of most hard drives from that era. So the bottleneck is really the drive.

Early scraping scripts that were available for some few specific DVRs extracted "chunks" or "pieces" of recordings and people had to string it all back together.

I don't think Isobuster gets credit enough for not doing that.

Isobuster in contrast, knows how to read the entire recording from beginning to end (without) scanning the entire drive. It can pluck a single recording off in minimal time, or all recordings, one after the other.

It also covers "vastly" more brands and models leveraging what it knows about common storage patterns and applying it to all drives it comes across. Peter really likes to discover a unique "signature" he's invented for each brand and model and shows its identity when you right click the top level drive folder and select "Properties".

Its telling you what it thinks it sees.. on unsupported model drives it will try to "guess" and this helps to be sure its working properly. We use this to know when we need to examine the hard disk in greater detail.

The Philips 3575 and 3576 have been tested and are supported.

There are other Philips models that have not been tested and are not supported at this time. I've been looking into a 3570/3590 model which has its own flavor of storage.. its European however and that usually puts an extra special spin on things.

I don't know how to characterize Euro models as a group. The UK models are not that different from North American models.. there seems to be some convergence of design, except for their tuner model support.. which we don't look at.

Continental Euro models though, especially those with SECAM support tend to have more LSI and unique storage formats. I'm running on and on here.. but I've acquired a few Euro models and trying to figure out how to get the information to Peter to support them. He's added some on his own.. but they are a large group which needs attention.

Most of the North American models we come across are either LiteOn or DVD-video based and get supported fairily quickly.

Forgive me if I run on a bit.. I don't get to talk about this stuff with anyone much.

Last edited by jwillis84; 12-15-2019 at 01:34 PM.
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  #11  
04-12-2022, 07:00 AM
vsdera vsdera is offline
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This might be a stupid question, but I still have to find out. How does this software deal with RAID hard drives? Is there any difference between using it with a usual hard drive and RAID? I just got my RAID drives out of the HDD RECOVERY, it was a real challenge. The first post said that the software had "some" testing and that there might be bugs. What kind of error are you referring to? Okay, I liked the work done on data recovery, but I wouldn't like to return the disks back to the service. I want to make sure that the use of this software is as safe as possible.
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  #12  
04-12-2022, 08:58 AM
jwillis84 jwillis84 is offline
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Thats a very old thread, and I can't figure out what you mean by RAID.

Isobuster works to recover a lot of data on many drive configurations.. but I am not familiar with that particular use case.

I only ever used/tested it with "single" drives, not RAID.
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