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  #21  
08-16-2021, 11:47 AM
dpalomaki dpalomaki is offline
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The attached uploaded file is a second, very quick and dirty, demo of setting the mask to (roughly) follow the outline of the date/time stamp rather than using a rectangle. More of the underlying video can show through.

More patience building the mask, and careful selection of the new text font and size would improve the effect. I used Photoshop to create the mask, and my NLE (Edius) to do the overlays.

Note that you can see some of the AGC effect in the slight variation on brightness to the right of the text.


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File Type: mp4 Masked.mp4 (3.30 MB, 13 downloads)
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  #22  
08-16-2021, 05:21 PM
NewToCapturing44 NewToCapturing44 is offline
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It's pretty good, though I can still see the faint outline of the blinking words.

Though that does give me an idea to possibly box off the blinking words and put what I want on top of it; that would look better than cropping.
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  #23  
08-16-2021, 05:55 PM
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lordsmurf lordsmurf is offline
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Ugh, that quality.

The idea to partially remove (masking in AE/whatever), and/or adding your own logo/info over it, is sound. But with this footage, that conversion, it won't work well at all.

You need to convert this video with a line TBC, at minimum the ES10/15 recorder in passthrough. All of the wiggle needs to be straightened out.

That capture card is likely also blowing our your highlights/whites, and at a glance it looks like really ugly oversharpen halos.

Right now, the flashing clock is the least worry.

What is your capture workflow? What VCR, TBC, capture card?

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  #24  
08-16-2021, 07:51 PM
latreche34 latreche34 is offline
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I think youtube is adding a layer of crappiness to the video but yah the wiggle, the chroma rainbow, the white edges are not youtube's fault. If editing intended the capture has to be done right in the first place.
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  #25  
08-17-2021, 02:41 AM
RobustReviews RobustReviews is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lordsmurf View Post
Ugh, that quality.

Right now, the flashing clock is the least worry.
Definitely the case, I did rip from YouTube the sample and try and do some fiddling in After Effects but to be honest, it's tricky with footage of that quality.

Although blowing highlights might help with the technique I propose, (and the first thing I would do to create a matte) - it's hardly helpful for the other 95% of the image area! When I had a test it would need several layers to try and build the matte and for footage of that quality, I'm afraid I haven't the time to investigate further.

Might be worth having 'another bite at the cherry' before further testing.
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  #26  
08-17-2021, 05:11 PM
NewToCapturing44 NewToCapturing44 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lordsmurf View Post

What is your capture workflow? What VCR, TBC, capture card?
GE VG4275 (VCR), Canopus ADVC 110 (Capture Box), Syba SY-PEX30016 (Firewire Card), Pasow FireWire 800 to 400 9 to 6 pin (Firewire Cable), Adobe Premiere Pro (Editing).

Right now I'm doing minimal editing in Adobe; it's more adding effects than "cleaning up" (I can, but have no idea how I would "clean up" video)
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  #27  
08-18-2021, 02:04 PM
latreche34 latreche34 is offline
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That's all what you can get out of a low end VCR using composite and ADV110, It's okay for generating quick videos for watching but not adequate for a proper archival project, Keep the tapes in case someone comes after you and wants to do it right.
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  #28  
08-18-2021, 05:05 PM
NewToCapturing44 NewToCapturing44 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by latreche34 View Post
...Keep the tapes in case someone comes after you and wants to do it right.
Ok, lets get a few things straight.

This is a HOBBY for me. I'm TRYING to digitize old VHS tapes before they are no longer playable. Not everyone has $200+ to put down on a VCR that they're going to use to transfer ~20 VHS tapes.

I get it that my equipment isn't "professional grade". I'm full well aware of that fact. But this is because I don't have the time, talent, or FUNDS to have equipment so I can "do it right" according to you.

There's a right way and a wrong way to tell someone that they equipment could be better and you absolutely chose the wrong way to do so.

So either put up (and send me the equipment you feel I should be using) or shut up (and let someone else explain in a manner that isn't condescending)
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  #29  
08-18-2021, 09:28 PM
dpalomaki dpalomaki is offline
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Many of the people here are what some might describe as obsessive about quality in the capture and restore of consumer analog video tape content. The concept of "good enough" is a sacrilege. As you browse the forums and information resources you will discover that there are rather specific recommendation for (and against) specific equipment, software, and work flows that the main contributors feel will give the best results. Please don't take the terse assessment of your system personal; its not about you, its about the gear..

Except for physical damage due to malfunctioning gear, improper storage, or the use of very poor tape stock initially, VHS degrades very slowly. While digital works or it doesn't (no middle ground), the analog formats degrade very gradually over decades. I have VHS tapes from 40 years ago that still play OK with decent (for the era's gear) color. If the content is important to you than as suggested keep the original tapes in proper storage should you, or someone else, want to revisit them.

Quality gear is not easy to find; VHS, Video8, Beta, etc. have been out of production for years, and most is beyond factory support, parts are hard to find, as are technicians with the skills and special equipment needed to repair it. Working quality gear not cheap, but can be bought, used, and resold usually at minimal net cost. Auction site gear is a crap-shoot at best. Sellers are often clueless about the actual condition of the gear.

While working this as a hobby you may find that as you progress your standards become more demanding and you decide you would like to revisit and redo some of your earlier efforts. That is OK, it is a learning experience.

It boils down to how good is good enough for you and the people with whom you will shared the results, and how much time, effort, and money are you willing to devote to the project..
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  #30  
08-19-2021, 12:58 AM
latreche34 latreche34 is offline
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No one is forcing to do it in any other way than the way you did it, all what I said is keep the tapes for someone else, This is true because my Uncle left the family tapes to me since he wasn't tech savvy enough to handle such job nor he has the right gear, Good Lord.
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  #31  
08-19-2021, 06:50 AM
NewToCapturing44 NewToCapturing44 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dpalomaki View Post
Many of the people here are what some might describe as obsessive about quality in the capture and restore of consumer analog video tape content...

It boils down to how good is good enough for you and the people with whom you will shared the results, and how much time, effort, and money are you willing to devote to the project..
And a big THANK YOU for explaining things in a way that doesn't make it sound like I'm drooling on myself while using a "My Fisher Price First Tape Transfer" kit to digitize these tapes.

I did not have any plans on getting rid of the tapes themselves, but now I have a logical reason (beyond "they're sentimental") to keep them.

If I ever do come into better funding, is there somewhere on this site I should be looking to see what the better equipment is for tape transfer?

The way I see it, personally, having some sort of transfer is better than no transfer at all. I'm sure that there's plenty of people on this forum who would disagree with me, but I also know that there's plenty of people on this forum whom I would disagree with over they way they do things that relate to my profession.

Thank you again for your explanation.

Edit: Found the link to recommended hardware: http://www.digitalfaq.com/guides/vid...k-hardware.htm
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  #32  
08-19-2021, 03:18 PM
dpalomaki dpalomaki is offline
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Quote:
The way I see it, personally, having some sort of transfer is better than no transfer at all.

Read more: How to remove flashing date/time from VHS capture?
Having a transfer to usable media, even if of mediocre quality, is a plus in that it saves wear and play risk on the original tapes, and it can be shared with others. After all, content is king, and most people can see past the image flaws if the story is compelling. That doesn't mean getting a better transfer would be wasted effort, it is a personal call, and has to be weighted against what else you would do with the time and other resources that would be devoted to getting better transfers. Warning: The process can also be addictive as a hobby.

The consumer analog video formats were limited by the technology of the time and designed to provide what most people would consider an acceptable image in the TV sets of the time at the lowest price point. The systems are complex electronic/mechanical/magnetic marvels and as with all such systems there are differences, some times major, in performance of individual machines, brands, tapes, and of course the environmental conditions and aging of components. Tapes that play well on one machine may not play well on another, which is why the people seriously into transfer typically have several different makes model VCRs. (BTW: Its not unusual for an old VCR to eat a tape - gear should be tested before trying an important tape.)

One last thought, for transferring a small number of tapes it may be easier to "hire it out" to a reputable service provider. The main issue is vetting potential providers to find one that can do a good job at a reasonable price. There are a lot of companies that will do no better than you can do yourself.

Enjoy!
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  #33  
08-20-2021, 07:18 AM
NewToCapturing44 NewToCapturing44 is offline
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Originally Posted by dpalomaki View Post
Tapes that play well on one machine may not play well on another, which is why the people seriously into transfer typically have several different makes model VCRs.

So if I'm reading this right, even if I were to plunk down $200+ on the recommended hardware from this forum the tapes may still not transfer "correctly", (due to incompatibility issues with the tape/tape player) correct?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dpalomaki View Post
One last thought, for transferring a small number of tapes it may be easier to "hire it out" to a reputable service provider. The main issue is vetting potential providers to find one that can do a good job at a reasonable price. There are a lot of companies that will do no better than you can do yourself.
If I were re-doing all of the tapes I have that I care about I'd have about 20-30 tapes (possibly). At that point, I feel like it would be cheaper to buy the equipment (when I can) but that leads me back to my above point.
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  #34  
08-20-2021, 07:32 AM
dpalomaki dpalomaki is offline
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So if I'm reading this right, even if I were to plunk down $200+ on the recommended hardware from this forum the tapes may still not transfer "correctly", (due to incompatibility issues with the tape/tape player) correct?
They may not play as well, as cleanly, as reliably. And there is no real way to predict in advance beyond some general trends. Its generally not an issue of will-not-play-at-all, more like fitting shoes (VCRs) to feet (Tapes), where some size 10s may fit individual feet better than others - Dick likes ASICS, Tom prefers Nikes.
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  #35  
08-20-2021, 09:48 AM
NewToCapturing44 NewToCapturing44 is offline
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Originally Posted by dpalomaki View Post
They may not play as well, as cleanly, as reliably. And there is no real way to predict in advance beyond some general trends. Its generally not an issue of will-not-play-at-all, more like fitting shoes (VCRs) to feet (Tapes), where some size 10s may fit individual feet better than others - Dick likes ASICS, Tom prefers Nikes.
That makes sense.

Is there any service you can recommend that I can get pricing from? For the amount of tapes I have I don't think it makes sense to buy (potentially multiple) VCRs to transfer these tapes.

Plus, honestly, what I have already might just been "good enough". I'd hold on to the original VHS tapes but I'd be shocked if anyone else in my family expresses any interest in trying to transfer these tapes using a higher quality setup.
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  #36  
08-20-2021, 09:59 AM
RobustReviews RobustReviews is offline
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Originally Posted by NewToCapturing44 View Post
That makes sense.

Is there any service you can recommend that I can get pricing from? For the amount of tapes I have I don't think it makes sense to buy (potentially multiple) VCRs to transfer these tapes.

Plus, honestly, what I have already might just been "good enough". I'd hold on to the original VHS tapes but I'd be shocked if anyone else in my family expresses any interest in trying to transfer these tapes using a higher quality setup.
Might help if you let us know where in the world you are, it seems to be mostly a North American forum but there's a few of us dotted about the globe. I can make some suggestions if you're UK based.

It was a good analogy - I agree.
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  #37  
08-20-2021, 12:34 PM
dpalomaki dpalomaki is offline
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The proof of the pudding is in the eating. Some of the participants here do provide transfer service (Personally I do not.) You could contact them, and upon agreement to details including cost and delivery format send them a tape to transfer for you. Compare the results and then decide if the improvement is worth it.
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  #38  
08-20-2021, 01:15 PM
NewToCapturing44 NewToCapturing44 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobustReviews View Post
Might help if you let us know where in the world you are, it seems to be mostly a North American forum but there's a few of us dotted about the globe. I can make some suggestions if you're UK based.

It was a good analogy - I agree.
Yep, North America here.
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