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  #1  
06-24-2020, 09:11 AM
Squash22 Squash22 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lordsmurf View Post
Follow this quickie guide: How to Properly Crop the Overscan in VirtualDub [GUIDE]
The example is 352x480 resolution, change to match the source (assumed 720x480 lossless capture).
Then resize it again for a 4x3, either 720x540 or 640x480.
Hi lordsmurf

I followed this clip/mask guide and kept everything at 720x480. The file size jumped from 16 gb to 140 gb. Is that expected or am I doing something wrong?


Quote:
Originally Posted by lordsmurf View Post
However, since this is VHS, meaning interlaced, and seeing as how H.264 does not like interlace (though it's often done, especially for HD broadcasts), then MPEG-2 is suggested, and at broadcast/Blu-ray levels of 15mbps. The files are not overly large, quality is maintained, it's somewhat future proof, and can still stream on most devices.
Also, I thought if you were going to use your capture VHS (I have DV, lossy, at 720x480) you had to deinterlace to stream?
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  #2  
06-24-2020, 10:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squash22 View Post
I followed this clip/mask guide and kept everything at 720x480. The file size jumped from 16 gb to 140 gb. Is that expected or am I doing something wrong?
How long is the file? Based off that, we can surmise the codec used (or not used).
Uncompressed YUY2 720x480 video, for example, is 75gb/hour. Needlessly huge.

Quote:
Also, I thought if you were going to use your capture VHS (I have DV, lossy, at 720x480) you had to deinterlace to stream?
Not necessarily. Stream how? From what to where?
You can easily stream interlaced MPEG (DVD spec SD) on a LAN. I do it quite a bit. Quality is thus maintained.

BTW, since post was moved, click this link: http://www.digitalFAQ.com/forum/subs...iption&t=10752

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  #3  
06-24-2020, 07:04 PM
Squash22 Squash22 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lordsmurf View Post
How long is the file? Based off that, we can surmise the codec used (or not used).
Uncompressed YUY2 720x480 video, for example, is 75gb/hour. Needlessly huge.
Yes you are correct.

This is the original file
From MediaInfo:
Code:
Video
ID: 0
Format: DV
Codec ID: dvsd
Codec ID/Hint: Sony
Duration: 1 h 20 min
Bit rate mode: Constant
Bit rate: 24.4 Mb/s
Encoded bit rate: 28.8 Mb/s
Width: 720 pixels
Height: 480 pixels
Display aspect ratio: 4:3
Frame rate mode: Constant
Frame rate:  29.970 (30000/1001) FPS
Original frame rate: 29.970 (29970/1000) FPS
Standard: NTSC
Color space: YUV
Chroma subsampling: 4:1:1
Bit depth: 8 bits
Scan type: Interlaced
Scan order: Bottom Field First
Compression mode: Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame): 2.357
Time code of first frame: 03:32:59;12
Time code source: Subcode time code
Stream size: 15.3 GiB (92%)
I used the (seemingly hated on this forum) Canopus ADVC-300 to capture from a Sony VCR.

I use Plex mostly or play from my computer using VLC/MPC-HC. But I figure it's all some form of streaming because all the files are stored on my local NAS.

So after doing the crop/mask with VirtualDub the new file jumped to this:
Code:
Video
ID: 0
Format: RGB
Codec ID: 0x00000000
Codec ID/Info: Basic Windows bitmap format. 1, 4 and 8 bpp versions are palettised. 16, 24 and 32bpp contain raw RGB samples
Duration: 1 h 20 min
Bit rate: 249 Mb/s
Width: 720 pixels
Height: 480 pixels
Display aspect ratio: 3:2
Frame rate: 29.970 (30000/1001) FPS
Standard: NTSC
Bit depth: 8 bits
Bits/(Pixel*Frame): 24.000
Stream size: 140 GiB (99%)
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  #4  
06-24-2020, 10:01 PM
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You're not using any codec. You have uncompressed RGB video, and that's bad (not just due to size).

Install Lagarith, use it.
Video > Compression, and select Lagarith.
Then it will be about 25gb/hour.

DV is overly compressed, and is 13gb/hour. About 50% of the color data is missing, hence about 50% size compared to Lagarith. The ADVC-300 further ruins it with weird NR that is messy, and can't be turned off (truly off, not just "off").

Also, in VirtualDub 1.9.x, goto Video > Color Depth, make both input/output YUY2
Or if VirtualDub2 or VirtualDub 1.10.x, goto Video > Decode Format, and again YUY2 for both in/out.
Otherwise you'll screw up your captured colors.

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  #5  
06-25-2020, 04:39 PM
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well that's great (about the ADVC) cus I already converted 188 tapes that way,
so now I'm looking to do post processing.

So on the DV captures I already have run Lagarith? And then do the VirtualDub crop/mask?
Is that right?

My only concern is I was going to use Handbrake to deinterlace (for streaming) and compress using HEVC x265, because the file size and quality looked great. But if I compress first with Lagarith won't that be running the file through 2 levels of compression? I see that Lagarith is lossless, so maybe not so bad... I dunno?

Also I saw what you said about MPEG streaming, so does this apply to my type of video? Should I not deinterlace?

But I'm still curious as to why the file size ballooned from just adding a mask?
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  #6  
06-28-2020, 11:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lordsmurf View Post
You're not using any codec. You have uncompressed RGB video, and that's bad (not just due to size).

Install Lagarith, use it.
Video > Compression, and select Lagarith.
Then it will be about 25gb/hour.

DV is overly compressed, and is 13gb/hour. About 50% of the color data is missing, hence about 50% size compared to Lagarith. The ADVC-300 further ruins it with weird NR that is messy, and can't be turned off (truly off, not just "off").

Also, in VirtualDub 1.9.x, goto Video > Color Depth, make both input/output YUY2
Or if VirtualDub2 or VirtualDub 1.10.x, goto Video > Decode Format, and again YUY2 for both in/out.
Otherwise you'll screw up your captured colors.
Ok that was better. Files size went from 16 gb to 34 gb. That's more manageable.
But the bitrate ballooned again from 24.4 to 58.9 Mb/s.

Code:
ID : 0 
Format : Lagarith 
Codec ID : LAGS 
Duration : 1 h 20 min 
Bit rate : 58.9 Mb/s 
Width : 720 pixels 
Height : 480 pixels 
Display aspect ratio : 3:2 
Frame rate : 29.970 (30000/1001) FPS 
Standard : NTSC 
Color space : YUV 
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:2 
Bit depth : 8 bits 
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 5.683 
Stream size : 33.2 GiB (97%)
Why does the bitrate keep going up?
Is there anyway to prevent this?

The interlacing became way worse though. So I have to deinterlace, not sure if I should use VirtualDub or Handbrake. Any suggestions would be welcome.

I wanted to use HEVC compression, because of final size and quality. I don't know if VDub does that? So maybe I should use Handbrake and apply deinterlacing in there?
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  #7  
06-28-2020, 12:05 PM
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The reason = the 24mbps DV bitrate is crap, and DV 4:1:1 loses color data. You can recompress to DV again, but risk yet more quality loss. Bitrate of H264/265 and MPEG isn't the same concept as bitrate with DV/lossless AVI.

Interlace became worse? That makes no sense. Samples needed, attach small snippet to a post here. Crop timeline segment ni VirtualDub, Video > Direct Stream Copy output.

What is the reason for deinterlace.
- If home TV viewing, not ideal.
- If online/interwebs, you have no choice.

However, H264 (and likely 265) doesn't always play nice with interlace, like MPEG does. You have to test on device. The devices are the real problem, it's not actually the interlacing, which is supported. Most devices assume progressive, even when the same device understand interlace (or interlaced MPEG over LAN), like some Samsung Blu-ray players.

Hybrid, using QTGMC. VirtualDub and Handbrake's best deinterlacers are Yadif (minimally passable, often not great, by modern 2020+ standards).

Always keep the interlaced source on archive, don't discard for compressed versions. You will regret it later, in 5-10 years.

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