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  #1  
09-13-2011, 06:58 AM
paulbarl paulbarl is offline
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Hi, Do you have any promotions for web hosting with Eurovps, I have a reseller account with Hostgator and its getting bad.

It was ok but I think they changed me to a different shared server and its now down a lot. Problem is I have my two main sites on there and then some sites for others, the other sites are ok for now but I want to move my two main sites to either Managed VPS or just vps.

Looking at the cpanel for the main site disk space usage 339mb and bandwith transfer 799mb mysql 4.23mb other site is smaller at 46mb but also has a ssl on eccomerce part, both are Joomla sites, main site has an xml live feed and various other mods added like a diary etc, if you want to take a look its ---- and the other site is ----. I'm happy to go through you if you earn a bonus etc.
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  #2  
09-14-2011, 06:20 AM
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Hi, I'll be glad to give you some added information on this topic.

These are honestly pretty tiny sites:
  • 340MB file storage + 800MB monthly bandwidth
  • 5MB file storage + 50MB monthly bandwidth
A VPS would work perfectly, no doubt, but even shared or reseller may work. It really depends on how much CPU and RAM those "various other mods" use.

Assuming that your sites are not causing the problems on the HostGator server (which I doubt they are), then it's pretty safe to assume it's not causing a huge CPU/RAM drain. Unlimited hosts like HostGator will quickly throw your off a server if you're "abusing" it (using more resources than the minimal impact they desire).

The issue is mostly likely caused by imperfect management at HG, with servers not as optimized for Joomla as they could be, and probably more aimed at static sites and WordPress sites. That's really the average HG customer, from my observations: static and WordPress. This isn't the first complaint I've read about less-than-ideal performance from alternative CMS use.

Quote:
I want to move my two main sites to either Managed VPS or just vps.
The main benefit of a VPS is not the increased space, bandwidth and dedicated RAM, but rather the control you get over the server. If you run Joomla sites, then you can tweak the server's PHP and MySQL to optimum Joomla settings. You can install opcode caching and mem caching, to speed up the function and delivery of the sites. You can do quite a few things that are simply not possible on shared or reseller accounts.

Quote:
but also has a ssl on eccomerce part
SSL is usually done with a dedicated IP address, which is sometimes available as an add-on for shared or reseller accounts. It definitely works for most VPS, as most VPS plans come with 1-2 included IPs. If you don't see an IP add-on option, you can always ask the host (EuroVPS, in this case) to see if that's available. I would assume so, since it's relatively easy to do on their end (in WHM).

Quote:
Looking at the cpanel
Panels make it easier to manage a server. On a VPS, you get WHM + cPanel, not just cPanel. (WHM = Web Hosting Manager, the panel that controls what cPanel and its users have permission to do.)

cPanel is easily the best Linux end-user control panel right now, followed closely by the free Kloxo and ISPConfig 3 panels. (Side note: I'd briefly written about the various web hosting control panels in the forum, in a post earlier this year.)

When used on a VPS, cPanel is most commonly found in use by premium hosts, and not budget hosts. Most budget hosts give you nothing, or charge a pretty hefty fee of $15+ monthly and still offer no support. At that price point, you might as well just opt for the managed VPS host that's known for quality.

Quote:
Managed VPS or just vps
Managed plans are good to have, even if you don't need help very often, because nobody knows everything. It's good to have a troubleshooting partner at the host itself. (Many hosts offer unmanaged hosting with per-ticket fees of $50+ each, but long-term it's cheaper to just pad the bill monthly with managed support costs. The price difference is usually just $5-10 monthly.)

"Managed" vs "unmanaged" is really a lousy way to describe VPS plans. Consider this instead:
  • Self-Managed (i.e., "unmanaged") -- You, the customer, have to take care of your own server. The host only fixes broken hardware. And then the host will work with the datacenter, assuming they don't own it, when there are network problems. All software and site content is for you to handle, and that includes the server OS, services and panels.
  • Self-Managed with Host Assistance (i.e. "managed") -- You, the customer, need to try and take care of your own server. However, if you have trouble, and have exhausted other options (Tip: GOOGLE SEARCHES!), then they're there to help. Note the word "help" and not "hand-holding". You need to run your own site, and not expect the host to do it. If the host had wanted to spend time making WidgetStore.com, then they'd be doing that instead of selling hosting services. In other words, don't take the host for granted, as that's what sours a host/client relationship. Pretend you're back in school, and the host is the teacher or the tutor. They'll help, maybe even do it for you the first time. But they're not your slave.
Some hosts are more lenient than others. In fact, some of them will "bend over backwards" (as the cliche goes) in order to make their clients happy. EuroVPS is most definitely one of these hosts.

Since we're on the topic: Most of the negative feedback you see related to EuroVPS is for one of two reasons:
  1. EuroVPS was pushed too far by unreasonable clients, so the client was told to find another host, and then the person got mouthy online. Or as the British would say, gobbing off. Customer = bloody wanker. (I'm rather fond of British slang.)
  2. Prices are "too high" as compared to dirt cheap unreliable hosting. Sorry, but you get what you pay for. In 5+ years, I've never been disappointed. I've never felt as if I'm not getting my money's worth. And I'm not a pushover, easy to please and willing to just deal with lousy service. I have a business, not a silly little hobby site, and it needs to be online and working properly. If it costs a few extra dollars, so be it. Money well spent, I say.
Quote:
Do you have any promotions for web hosting with Eurovps
If you mean "promotions" as in sales, specials, coupons, etc -- no I don't. However, I've been with EuroVPS long enough to have gotten to know a few people there pretty well. They're really quite pleasant and have a very knowledgeable staff. I've forwarded your email to a specific person at the sales desk. Their answer may be the same -- nothing currently available -- but then I don't work there, so I don't know. I could be completely oblivious to an ongoing promotion.

Quote:
I'm happy to go through you if you earn a bonus etc.
I truly appreciate your desire to support this site. Thanks very much for that -- it's the thought that counts.

However, EuroVPS is one of the hosts we suggest that has no affiliate program. But since we refer hosts based on quality, and not based on affiliate commissions (like all those scammy/spammy "hosting reviews" sites), this isn't a problem. Good is good, and EuroVPS is excellent.

In fact, we do have an affiliate relationship with HostGator (via this link). Most affiliate-driven site owners would have been trying to convince you to stay with HostGator -- or more likely to use another high-payout affiliate host, like the terrible IXWebHosting or iPower. You'd be trading problems, or more likely even downgrading. But that doesn't happen here. EuroVPS is an excellent choice, even if we don't get a kickback.

You probably already saw our full list: List of Best Web Hosts - Shared, reseller, VPS, cloud, dedicated

There are other ways to show support for this site: Support digitalFAQ.com, what you can do to help this site!
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Thanks.


-------------------------------

Edit/Update:

HostGator is now owned by EIG, and is one of the worst unlimited-resource style hosts that exists. They trick you with big flashy "CHEAP AND UNLIMITED" type advertising, and then pack the fine print (Terms of Service aka ToS, Acceptable Use Policy aka AUP) with dozens of limitations that basically screw the customer and make the hosting package weak and useless.

JaguarPC is also not suggested, given this ridiculous demand.

Most "unlimited" hosts promise buffet-style all-you-can-eat hosting, but fail to deliver.

The intention of "no limits" hosting is to use a server to its maximum income potential, by filling it to a reasonable size (50-75% of capacity) with small mostly-static websites (or well-cached WordPress sites). It's not meant for customers who could fill the server, or a significant part of it, on their own. And that refers not just to file space, but bandwidth, CPU and RAM. We do passively suggest some unlimited hosts, but sometimes they're just not a good fit with specific client needs.

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Last edited by kpmedia; 07-10-2014 at 07:15 AM. Reason: Updated
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  #3  
09-14-2011, 07:11 AM
paulbarl paulbarl is offline
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Hi and thanks, it was me who emailed you. I have to agree about Hostgator, I have a reseller account with them and until a few months ago it all seemed fine, then suddenly they announced they were moving the account to a different server. We hadn't done anything wrong, the only thing I can think of is that we did a smallish website for a client who signed up with a traffic program that through lots of crap traffic at his site, but it shouldn't have been a problem as the limit in WHM control cut him off until he rectified it. But I think this may be what they do, like you said, if you are someone who runs a one page static site you are ok, but I think they group all the larger sites that they think are going to be a load problem together. The support is always prompt in answering but it really is pointless because all they do is tell you they are aware of it and working on it. Trouble is when you are spending good money on addwords and nothing is coming back ... this is the only way I found out, had to look. As you said my own sites are slow to say the least. So I have had several conversations with Eurovps and to say I am impressed is an understatement, not only did I get 50% off the first months 39 euros but they are also transfering over 3 websites for me, awesome ... this is what was holding me up. I have been with Hostgator for over 4 years and gave them every chance today to rectify the situation but to be honest I think with all these bigger Hosts you are just a number, I move off and another will replace me. Thanks again for your help
Paul
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  #4  
09-14-2011, 08:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paulbarl View Post
until a few months ago it all seemed fine, then suddenly they announced they were moving the account to a different server. We hadn't done anything wrong, the only thing I can think of is that we did a smallish website for a client who signed up with a traffic program that through lots of crap traffic at his site, but it shouldn't have been a problem as the limit in WHM control cut him off until he rectified it.
I would look into creating a "Chinese Wall" for yourself. That's a term borrowed from the legal profession, where the firm will break contact in order to dual handle an opposing case load in-house. You may want to look into having an account that is purely for your own interests (your business sites, maybe your personal and hobby, maybe even that of friends/family), and then another account entirely for clients. That way, if the clients screws something up, it's mitigated completely to the client server. Not that it's good for one client to mess up all the clients, but it's better than one client messing up the whole enchilada.

I don't just have a single plan with EuroVPS -- I have several. And for this kind of reason. Each account is used for a specific purpose. If one tanks for some reason, the others are not affected. If one receives a traffic spike, the others are not slowed.

Hosts themselves often obey this rule. The main website is separate from a billing server which is separate from all customers.

Some of the more slimy hosts will use another host entirely for their own site! Semoweb comes to mind. At one point earlier this year, almost all of their servers were down. I had reserved a whole day to develop a site, and couldn't do it, become their systems were either unusably slow or entirely offline for most of that specific week. But their main site was up, fast, and accepting orders!

(Note that I use many hosts, often for various tests and dev work. Curiosity, mostly. Plus it's the only ethical way we can create a list of best web hosts, and worst web hosts, as published on this site. Again -- not going on affiliate dollars as the basis of rankings, but actual observed quality. In the case of Semoweb, I wanted to know if a $9.50/year shared host was any good. Clearly the answer was "NO!")

In my opinion, when a host doesn't even use their own services to run their site, they're not somebody that can be taken seriously. EuroVPS is an example of a host that uses their own servers. If they go down, we all go down. In the past 5 years, I can only think of maybe 2-3 incidents where the datacenter was unreachable in this way. Datacenters are buildings, too -- I recall one of the major outages being catastrophic failure of the air conditioning system. Another was loss of network by a backbone carrier (cable was cut, I believe).

Quote:
But I think this may be what they do, like you said, if you are someone who runs a one page static site you are ok, but I think they group all the larger sites that they think are going to be a load problem together.
Yes, indeed it is. Accounts that seem to need more are put together on lower-density servers (lower density of accounts, that is). But even that isn't a helpful solution when one account is being abusive to the allocated resources. I would bet that somebody will be discovered as an abuser on that server at some point in time, and forced to upgrade to a VPS, or to find another host. In the meantime, that doesn't help you or anybody else on the server. I would suggest the reason it's taking so long is due to lack of staff. In the meantime, you get those worthless "We're working on it." type support ticket replies that never seem to receive follow-ups.

Sometimes on weekends, during off hours (night), you'll get a quick reply from EuroVPS to a support ticket, stating they'll look into it, and asking that you kindly wait. For example, "We are checking the reported issue. Please hold on until we update you. Best regards, Douglas." --- but you'll get a reply eventually (a few hours later, at worst). That was a quote pulled from a ticket I sent in back in July, a medium-priority ticket regarding the DNS cluster. Nothing too urgent, as sites were not down or slow. Compared to the other 10 or so hosts I have current accounts with, they easily have the quickest and most accurate ticket responses. That specific tech, Douglas, is quite good, too!

To provide yet another comparison, as much as I like Stablehost, sometimes their replies are odd, even if fast.

Quote:
not only did I get 50% off the first months 39 euros but they are also transfering over 3 websites for me, awesome
Definitely awesome.

Quote:
to be honest I think with all these bigger Hosts you are just a number, I move off and another will replace me.
Exactly.

When I have to call up my cell phone provider, or my local ISP, I'm always made to feel as if I'm some a-hole that is inconveniencing their day. I'm a burden. Somebody they're forced to "deal with". I can be cheerful, pleasant, fully understanding, and maybe call once per year at most --- yet I'm treated as if I'm a problem? Ignored. Talked down to. Brushed off. (At that point, I'll admittedly become Captain A-Hole over the phone. I'm not a doormat, I can dish it out with the best of them.)

The key is to find a business where you matter, where you're treated like a person. EuroVPS is one of several hosts that treats you well.

_________

You caught me in the middle of doing site dev work this morning. I needed a break from writing PHP anyway.

After you've been with EuroVPS for a month, you should come back here and leave a review.

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  #5  
09-16-2011, 03:46 PM
paulbarl paulbarl is offline
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It isn't looking good I'm afraid, numerous issues with the transfer of my websites and no repsonse to support tickets. Lets see how it goes in the next couple of days and hopefully I can write a better review, it started to look good but now I'm being left out in the dark over various things, ssl issues and blank pages mail not working

Paul
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  #6  
09-16-2011, 04:23 PM
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kpmedia kpmedia is offline
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Changing hosts always has a bit of growing pains to deal with, as you situate into the new environment. Various aspects of the servers can vary, such as the version of PHP in use (PHP4, PHP5.2, PHP5.3), modules on the server, and any host-specific syntax that may have existed in your scripting or htaccess files. Even moving servers within the same host can trigger some of these problems.

The key here is to isolate what is not working as desired, and then research the requirements of that asset. For example, if a PHP script is not working, verify the PHP version it requires, and then see if the server is setup with that same version. If you have a VPS, then downgrading/upgrading PHP is a rather basic issue, especially if you have managed support to help guide you. Even WHM has the ability to upgrade components, via the EasyApache update/upgrade system.

SSL could be a small issue in DNS records, or even how it's been installed on the server.

Blank pages could be related to the PHP version.

Mail not working may be related to DNS propagation, spam filter presets. Or if related to a mail script, again looking at PHP versioning.

My suggestion is to tackle one issue at a time.

The first time I moved hosts -- which was a long, long, long time ago -- I had all kinds of problems. I don't remember all of the details of that incident, but to take an example from the past decade, when I migrated from Windows IIS5 to IIS6, I had problems with CDONTS vs CDOSYS. That was a simple issue of updating some of the ASP scripts, as well as installing a backwards-compatible CDONTS ASAPI module on the server. That was also nearly 10 years ago, when I knew far less about hosting, so it wasn't a fast process to solve. Thankfully, I had some help from an admin, and from the host, but much of the solution was the fruits of my own labor (reading and trial-and-error until it worked).

Having come this far in 48 hours is, quite honestly, making good time. Put in another 48 hours, and you could possibly be back fully online.

One of the things I credit to EuroVPS (Vasili especially) is how several of them have really advanced my understanding of DNS in the past few years, as I got more into the advanced aspects of hosting. DNS was always a weak point of understanding in the past. There were some DNS related issues that took a few hours or even days to resolve, but I walked away with not only a fixed problem, but with a greater understanding of the topic. And with that, I now have the ability to avoid certain future problems, address problems on my own, and provide them with many details when sending in trouble reports. So keep that in mind while all of this is going on -- learn from it, too!

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  #7  
09-16-2011, 04:39 PM
paulbarl paulbarl is offline
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The mail thing is weird, I was getting mail and sending mail through outlook no problem this afternoon then tonight I can't send mail and looking at webmail I see that some mail got through and others didn't, its still not working even though the settings are correct. The older Joomla 1.0 site is a problem and really should be migrated to 1.5, I have put that off because I have no 1 Google listings for this site and unless I copy exactly the page exts I'm going to loose position. I think I may build a new 1.5 site on a sandbox IP address on the server and when happy about the cross match of urls migrate the domain. Let's see what happens in the next few days.
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  #8  
09-16-2011, 05:03 PM
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Quote:
The mail thing is weird, I was getting mail and sending mail through outlook no problem this afternoon then tonight I can't send mail and looking at webmail I see that some mail got through and others didn't, its still not working even though the settings are correct
That really, really sounds like propagation issues. Remember that propagation can take anywhere from 4-8 hours up to 10 days. A quality DNS service like OpenDNS tends to refresh their cache several times per day, while a large national ISP may only refresh their DNS cache a few times per week. Smaller organizations, or those which are poorly set up, can take more than a week before expiry and re-cache.

I would wait a full 7 days before panicking. (I know, that's tough, you don't want to miss emails.) If you still have the HostGator account, set all emails accounts to forward to a personal account -- Gmail, Yahoo, Hotmail, etc. Because if the new server isn't catching the mail, the old one is. As another option, you could setup Outlook to retrieve email by IP address instead of mail.mydomain.com. I do that every time I move the server. I setup a new Outlook account for the new server, and access both new and old by their respective IP addresses.

Quote:
The older Joomla 1.0 site is a problem and really should be migrated to 1.5, I have put that off because I have no 1 Google listings for this site and unless I copy exactly the page exts I'm going to loose position. I think I may build a new 1.5 site on a sandbox IP address on the server and when happy about the cross match of urls migrate the domain.
The older Joomla site may require an older PHP, so yes that could be a problem. Changing URL is never fun, and even with a proper 301, you can temporarily lose rank -- but it does come back. At least it usually does. I would suggest there is some degree of urgency is getting the site updated if Joomla is years out of date. That's a liability not only in hackability, but in terms of how you can grow the site. You don't have to be cutting edge, but you also don't want to be 5 years out of date.

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  #9  
09-16-2011, 05:13 PM
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I just sent two test emails to one addy and not only did they not arrive in Outlook they didn't even hit webmail. Your IP suggestion sounds good, in pop 3 settings do you just use mail.(ip addy instead of domain)
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  #10  
09-16-2011, 05:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paulbarl View Post
in pop 3 settings do you just use mail.(ip addy instead of domain)
Yep.

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  #11  
09-24-2011, 03:18 AM
paulbarl paulbarl is offline
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Well I'm fed up to say the least, I have given them time but it just isn't right. Even trying to ftp a new joomla site has failed misserably this morning and it isn't my connection because I just did one on Hostgator no problem. Also no awstats and when they did load it, it doesn't work correctly. On one of my sites they claimed there was no ssl listed or installed on the old server, twice I told them it was there (more support tickets) and finally they got it.

Also my numbers have dropped so far the revenue has almost halfed and its never been this bad - so to sum up far this is not worth the extra expense. I think support is no where near as good as Hostgator but I do think I need VPS .... I may have to look elsewhere, but like everything I suppose some will have no problems and some (me) will ... luck of the draw I guess. Any other suggestions for VPS welcome

Paul
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  #12  
09-25-2011, 03:59 AM
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The thing to remember is that a VPS is essentially a dedicated server.
(VPS = virtual private server, VDS = virtual dedicated server, both VPS and VDS are identical, both ways to express server virtualization.)

At a good host, a VPS a very powerful hardware setup that's been split into isolated pieces. A VPS today can outperform a dedicated box from just a few years ago. If done right (and EuroVPS does it right), you'll have redundant high-grade RAM, fast I/O on a SAS RAID array, a multi-core server-grade CPU, and be on a high-speed redundant network on a premium bandwidth carrier. You'll get a piece of this. A good VPS can outperform a budget dedicated server.

However, that carries the need to understand how servers work, and how they're used for hosting. That's the downside of having your own server (be it a virtual one, or a dedicated server).

Shared hosting packages are made for people that don't understand anything about servers, and many of them don't want to. (In my opinion, anything worth using is worth trying to understand, but that's a conversation for another time.)

What hosting services refer to as a "reseller" account is honestly nothing more than shared hosting with an added ability to support multiple domains and (optionally) handle billing and support for whomever you resell to. In the old days, a "reseller" account was "multiple domain hosting", at a time when most hosting packages only supported a single domain ($99/year at many hosts from 2000-2005). Aside from the ability to bill/support, little has changed in the past decade. This is why reseller hosting is often slow, and lacks the ability to handle complicated CMS scripts.

It takes some willpower and a desire to "get your hands dirty" with server technology. In order to succeed as a VPS user you'll need:
  • an advanced understanding of the virtualization/hypervisor panel you're using (Virtuozzo, SolusVM, others)
  • an advanced understanding of the administrative/user panels you're using (cPanel/WHM, Plesk, ISPConfig, Kloxo, VirtualMin, others)
  • a basic familiarity with secure shell (SSH) for Linux
  • a basic familiarity with remote desktop (RDP) for Windows
  • an understanding of firewalls and basic security (like disabling root logins for SSH)
  • an understanding of the webserver you're using (Apache, Apache2, LiteSpeed, nginx, IIS, Cherokee, etc)
  • an understanding of the server OS you're using (Windows 2003, Windows 2008, CentOS, Debian, Ubuntu, others)

Optionally, you'll probably need/want to understand these concepts:
  • removing unneeded services, to optimize server RAM usages (i.e., disabling email service + spam filters if you're using hosted GMail)
  • installing opcode and memcaching, to improve performance of PHP driven CMS (WordPress, Joomla, Drupal, etc)
  • installing certificates (SSL) for e-commerce application

A VPS is not really plug-and-play like shared/reseller hosting. On a shared account, you may not have to "mess with" any of the more technical aspects of a server, but you're also severely limited on your options. For example, that your previous HostGator account was lousy at loading Joomla sites. They've likely tuned the server to other types of hosted applications, like WordPress of even basic HTML-only sites. Because it's their server, you won't be able to change settings in favor of Joomla hosting.

Read back to one of my earlier quotes:
Quote:
Originally Posted by kpmedia View Post

"Managed" vs "unmanaged" is really a lousy way to describe VPS plans. Consider this instead:
  • Self-Managed (i.e., "unmanaged") -- You, the customer, have to take care of your own server. The host only fixes broken hardware. And then the host will work with the datacenter, assuming they don't own it, when there are network problems. All software and site content is for you to handle, and that includes the server OS, services and panels.
  • Self-Managed with Host Assistance (i.e. "managed") -- You, the customer, need to try and take care of your own server. However, if you have trouble, and have exhausted other options (Tip: GOOGLE SEARCHES!), then they're there to help. Note the word "help" and not "hand-holding". You need to run your own site, and not expect the host to do it. If the host had wanted to spend time making WidgetStore.com, then they'd be doing that instead of selling hosting services. In other words, don't take the host for granted, as that's what sours a host/client relationship. Pretend you're back in school, and the host is the teacher or the tutor. They'll help, maybe even do it for you the first time. But they're not your slave.
Also have a look at today's newest editorial: VPS Hosting is like a Take-and-Bake Pizza

Reading through your issues, I think some of the burden has to fall on you. This isn't me being defensive of EuroVPS (trust me, if they screw up, I'm not going to pretend it didn't happen -- noting that such a problem is unlikely), but rather trying to assist you with as honest a reply as possible.

Let's look at these issues:

"Even trying to ftp a new joomla site has failed misserably"
-- Was the FTP service ever set up? Is it currently active? Does this domain have FTP service enabled?

"Also no awstats and when they did load it, it doesn't work correctly."
-- Have you done any troubleshooting yet? If so, what do the logs show? Was it setup within WHM or cPanel, or from a more manual method inside SSH?

" On one of my sites they claimed there was no ssl listed or installed on the old server"
-- SSL certificates are not sold by hosts, but rather by authority groups such as Thawte or Comodo. HostGator has nothing to do with your old SSL. As with any other host, they resold or directed you a certificate provider. HG uses Comodo. If you need to install your new Comodo certificate on your VPS, then you'll need to provide all the information as available from Comodo. Or as another alternative, follow the instructions provided by either Comodo or the control panel provider (and I'm assuming cPanel/WHM, and those instructions are here).

"Also my numbers have dropped so far the revenue has almost halfed and its never been this bad"
-- This can depend on any number of factors. September itself is a lousy month to begin with, and traffic is always down this time of year. You may have noticed a number of major changes on the non-forum portion of this site in September. At first, I panicked that something was wrong, and had decreased my numbers. So I compared stats, month-by-month, for the past 5 years. Nothing is out of the norm, so I can quit worrying. Do note that this server was up 100% this month.

"I think support is no where near as good as Hostgator"
-- Well, it's hard to say that. You were with HG for a shared(reseller) account. That's an entirely different situation from VPS hosting. If you were to look around online, you'll notice a lot of anti-HostGator comments are related to certain topics: VPS hosting, running something like Joomla, etc. So I'd suggest you're not really able to make a 1:1 comparison. When I made the jump from shared to hosting with EuroVPS (and again to dedicated), even I noticed how support changes a little. It doesn't get bad, but the way tickets are handled can be altered, because shared and VPS are not the same sort of hosting. It's that way with any host, and at any given time, I'm admin for a server or a customer of a server at no less than 10 hosts.

"but I do think I need VPS .... I may have to look elsewhere,"
-- I'm really afraid that you're trying to use a VPS with a shared hosting mindset. And as such, you're going to be disappointed no matter where you go. EuroVPS is truly one of the best hosts online, especially when it comes to uptime and speed/helpfulness of the support desk. Others are not nearly as effective, and none reply quicker to tickets (counting ONLY tickets with information, not the "thanks for writing" crap you find at most places).

Again, read that editorial: VPS Hosting is like a Take-and-Bake Pizza

"Any other suggestions for VPS welcome"
I'm disappointed that you've had problems at EuroVPS. If you're really convinced that you have to move, then I can suggest some other alternatives, sure. The list of suggested hosts is here: List of Best Web Hosts - Shared, reseller, VPS, cloud, dedicated

I currently admin a VPS for a client at JaguarPC (and have for years, off and on, for various clients). It's a great host, too!

The main reason I stick with EuroVPS is that uptime is nearly 100%, and for those few bits of downtime that are seen (a few times per year, max), it's resolved quickly. Not just the "slap a Band-Aid on it method", but a true investigation into issue cause with a deep-level fix being provided so that it doesn't happen again. That's ALWAYS impressed me. No other host does that.

Whether you keep at it with EuroVPS, or try another host, let me know how you're fairing.

I'd volunteer to be a temporary admin (for a modest fee), but I'm overbooked at the moment, and it just would not be fair to you.

Take care.

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  #13  
09-25-2011, 10:03 AM
paulbarl paulbarl is offline
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Thanks for all that I will certainly take it on board. But I have Managed VPS, this is directly from their website,

Quote:
Our support staff work are awake around the clock so that you don't have to be. Even if you are just starting out with managing your own Linux server, yourhosting should not have to be a stressful experience. We know that you have enough to worry about managing your business and website.

Patching your server's security updates should NOT be taking up your mind's finite CPU time. From proactive service monitoring, OS upgrades and patches, to technical advices, our technical engineers are there to assist you throughout your entire experience with EuroVPS.
When I called them I asked them directly, what is the difference between Managed VPS and non Managed, their answer seemed to indicate that the Managed VPS was for people who basically don't have the technical abilitiy or time to administer the server themselves. I told them exactly what I wanted, a copy of the setup I have with the old hosting company, not a problem they replied we will copy the settings for you with the new server and as you have WHM/Cpanel it will be straight forward. So naturally I would expect something as simple as AWSTATS to be setup. So first ticket response to this issue was, "we have now enabled it and it should be fine". Yesterday I complained again that it still isn't working correctly as the numbers shouldn't be that low. Second response was "have you cross checked the stats with something like google analyitics" my response was that I shouldn't need to if Awstats is working right and that I have never had a problem in the past. Last response from them was "We have disabled some mod_security rules in the VPS which may be attributing to the loss of hits being recorded in awstats" So my point here is that it took 3 replies to get to the solution that actually should have been setup in the first place (if you go back to my initial conversation with them) Granted some of this may be due to three different people dealing with the ticket with different levels of abilitiy
So it seems to me and correct me if I am mistaken that I am actually paying for Managed VPS and yet they are really assuming I can do it myself (a package that costs less with them) If I wanted to do all the technical stuff myself I wouldn't have opted for Managed.
I do however take on board what you have said above but it isn't as clear from their website that "Managed" is really hand holding as you put it - we shall see going foward but I am certainly going to be learning a lot more from here on in
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  #14  
09-26-2011, 01:38 AM
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lordsmurf lordsmurf is offline
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I told them exactly what I wanted, a copy of the setup I have with the old hosting company, not a problem they replied we will copy the settings for you with the new server and as you have WHM/Cpanel it will be straight forward
What most hosts do is use the login data for your previous host, grab a cPanel or Plesk backup, and then deploy it on the new host. There may have been something hinky about the way HostGator had set up the stats; I've seen that with shared hosts before. A lot of shared hosts don't like stats, because it really eats into a machine's CPU and I/O.

Quote:
So naturally I would expect something as simple as AWSTATS to be setup. So first ticket response to this issue was, "we have now enabled it and it should be fine". Yesterday I complained again that it still isn't working correctly as the numbers shouldn't be that low. Second response was "have you cross checked the stats with something like google analyitics" my response was that I shouldn't need to if Awstats is working right and that I have never had a problem in the past.
When the problem isn't based on technical means, but rather by outside forces that need to be substantiated, this isn't really an unreasonable request. I use multiple statistical tracking platforms for my sites, and there are times when a certain tracker is misbehaving. Woopra, for example, may be on the fritz one day. If that were the only tracker in use, I would have falsely assumed it to be a dip in traffic. As it stands, I can compare it against other trackers for a more complete and more accurate picture of what's going on traffic-wise.

Quote:
Last response from them was "We have disabled some mod_security rules in the VPS which may be attributing to the loss of hits being recorded in awstats" So my point here is that it took 3 replies to get to the solution that actually should have been setup in the first place (if you go back to my initial conversation with them) Granted some of this may be due to three different people dealing with the ticket with different levels of abilitiy
It's really nothing more than the nature of the beast. Troubleshooting is a process of elimination until something gets solved. The first fix attempt is rarely the correct one, so it can take a few attempts. The better a tech is, the less it takes him/her to fix it -- largely because they've already dealt with this issue. Unfortunately, hosting is a lot like video, where no two client projects are ever truly identical. You can use knowledge from the past, but it's not always a simple matter of repeating what was done last time. That may fail to be the solution, requiring tweaks. In the case of your stats, it took some tweaks to the PHP mod_security setting in the php.ini. Just a few days ago, I was having a hard time with an htaccess file, because things needed to be in precisely the right order to function as desired. It took some experimenting to get there.

Quote:
So it seems to me and correct me if I am mistaken that I am actually paying for Managed VPS and yet they are really assuming I can do it myself (a package that costs less with them) If I wanted to do all the technical stuff myself I wouldn't have opted for Managed.
You're paying for somebody to help you. But there's a fine line between "help" and "doing it for me". Consider the pay scale of a $50 managed VPS host, compared against the pay of a good tech. An L1 know-nothing (the kinds employed by GoDaddy or Hostgator) gets maybe $10-15 per hour. A better tech (L2-L3) makes $25 or more per hour. If your $50 hosting bill is split 50/50 into costs of the hardware/server, and costs of management, you're basically paying for two hours of a crappy tech (at a cheap host), or one hour of a good tech (at a good host). Granted, you're not limited by "one hour" with this host -- although there are quite a few hosts that base management per hour! -- but there does need to be an understanding that you need to be proactive with how the server is run. That's the responsibility that comes with having a VPS.

Management comes in when you're lost. Instead of being up a creek without a paddle, they'll hand you a paddle. Maybe even paddle the boat down river for a while to show you how it's done. What you can't do it kick your feet up and take a nap while the tech takes you on a river safari. That kind of hands-off approach requires an outside full-time tech be employed, and standard hourly rates apply ($50-65 avg/hour).

EuroVPS seems to be willing to work with you so far, so I'd suggest having some patience about it, and just understand it's a growing pain of jumping into a VPS. After it's fully setup, you should be set for quite a while. You'll want to monitor software versions for security (cPanel, PHP, Apache, etc) -- or request the host take a proactive approach, updating things on your behalf.

With hosting comes the moral/ethical need to remember that the people selling the hosting services are just that -- people. Have some patient with them, treat them with respect, work with them as if they're your teammates. Don't treat them like a slave or a pet, as that's not what they are. Abusiveness is a common trend in the hosting industry, and hosts can only tolerate so many demands, threats, impatience, vulgarity, etc -- every day, thousands of customers are terminated for that very reason. Remember that they want your site online just as much as you do! The best advertisement for a host is a happy customer telling others.

Quote:
I do however take on board what you have said above but it isn't as clear from their website that "Managed" is really hand holding as you put it - we shall see going foward but I am certainly going to be learning a lot more from here on in
In more recent years, it's become largely impossible to upgrade a VPS without potentially disturbing the contents and functions of one's site. Updates to Apache, PHP or MySQL can, for example, brick your site. PHP 5.2 isn't the same as PHP 5.3. Updates to Apache may not be appropriate for certain distributions of the OS. Debian 5 isn't the same as Debian 6. Given this progressive complication in the world of Linux hosting, a lot of hosts have resorted to updating on the node OS, and leaving containers as is -- updating ONLY on request (reactive management). It would be a nightmare if all VPS containers were force-updated, as it would likely break a lot of user content.

Shared hosting often does this with or without your consideration. If your sites breaks, that's just too bad. Either update your site scripts, or patch them somehow. What happens when neither can be done? Well, that's one of the scenarios that makes a host tell a customer "You need to move to a VPS."

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