Trying to backup my new PAL version DVD
Hi everybody...
I'm currently trying to backup my new PAL version DVD of "Event Horizon", and have come across a few problems. I noticed that on the final encode some scenes just seem to be "Artifact Infected". There are suddenly ugly blocks and strange artifacts. I looked at the movie with Virtual Dub, and found something VERY interesting, for 2 reasons... The following screenshot is not filtered by any kind, and part of this DVD !!! 8O http://www.digitalfaq.com/archives/error.gif Ok, what we see is a VERY ugly blocky, greenish picture with INTERLACE LINES... Now I only own PAL movies, so I really haven't come across an interlaced source yet. Now here comes the frame, that is right before the one you just saw: http://www.digitalfaq.com/archives/error.gif 8O 8O How do I deal with that? Not only that the picture looks a lot better (far from a clean DVD I know), but also the Interlace Lines are gone... Can anyone help please? [/IMG] |
That definitely looks like only one field is displayed :!:
Edit: I assume this is in Vdub via a clean .avs (unfiltered) reading a .d2v :?: If that's the case, could you open the VOB directly with Virtualdub-MPEG-2 and see if that frame looks the same :idea: -kwag |
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Don't get me wrong, it's not only that one little frame, but every other frame seems to be interlaced, although, those bad artifacts are not visible. It even seems to me that only some parts of several frames seem to be interlaced, while others are not... Ok, I checked the same frame with VDub MPEG2, and yes, it looks the same! Blocky, ugly, interlaced. :roll: And there are other frames that look like that one too... Any ideas? |
Maybe Telecide() would do some good?
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hy friend,
don't know if my monitor is showing the exact image problem that i see but i try to explain. it don't seems interlaced problems, seems color problems... in pal systems, the red change between 180 to -180 degree. one line with 180 and another invert from -180 to 180 again, seems that one of this lines is lost... (for this reason is called "pal"..phase alternating line..or some like this) dah. :lol: i see that every line loss one of the two phases of red colors. see that the image don't have "broken lines", the red color is too green and the blue color seems purple. every color loose some red in the recombination. :!: you can see that the color is strange, not the image(luminance) :!: :idea: use tweak in the script, remove the saturation and open in vdub...if the black&white (without color) image is correct, the problem can be in the phases or in dvd, if don't is interlaced. did you understand my horrible english Jellygoose :?: :oops: |
@Boulder:
I already tried Telecide(), and the results were strange. Some frames seemed to be just fine, while others looked very soft. @jorel: Very interesting. Can you post the commands for Tweak? I'd like to check it out! However, I'm sure that the porblem is within the DVD. BtW: I understood everything, you meant to say Jorel, no need to apologize for anything! |
tweak is built in the avisynth252
:wink: from tweak read me: Tweak Syntax Tweak uses named parameters. That means you do not have to worry about the ordering of parameters and can simply refer to them by name and put them in any order in the list of parameters. If you omit a parameter it takes its default value. For example, if you want to increase the saturation of a clip and reduce its brightness, you might simply say: Tweak(sat=2.0,bright=-20) Any combination and order of named parameters is allowed. Specifying Tweak() with no parameters is a null operation and is thus senseless. Following is the syntax for Tweak (replace parameter_list with your comma-separated list of named parameters): Tweak(parameter_list) hue (-180.0 to +180.0, default 0.0) is used to adjust the color hue of the image. Positive values shift the image towards red. Negative values shift it towards green. sat (0.0 to 10.0, default 1.0) is used to adjust the color saturation of the image. Values above 1.0 increase the saturation. Values below 1.0 reduce the saturation. Use sat=0 to convert to grayscale. bright (-255.0 to 255.0, default 0.0) is used to change the brightness of the image. Positive values increase the brightness. Negative values decrease it. cont (0.0 to 10.0, default 1.0) is used to change the contrast of the image. Values above 1.0 increase the contrast. Values below 1.0 decrease the contrast. :) ps: yes,seems that the problem is in dvd ! (when trancodification from ntsc to pal was made) |
Ok thanks again Jorel...
I tried it out, but the vertical lines were also visible in greyscale... :( I guess it's really an Interlacing Problem... Is it some kind of Hybrid source? (part interlaced/part progressive) |
Hi Jellygoose,
If it's a hybrid source, try this: Telecide() Decimate(mode=1,threshold=50) -kwag |
Looks like "broken chroma upsampling".
Use ConverttoYUY2(interlaced=true), to have the chroma converted as it should. Search for "chroma upsampling" at doom9 if you need more info. |
Hi Jellybelly..
I just did a quick rip of some chptrs.. as it turns out, chapter 5 had that scene you were describing. I verified the above scene and found no Interlace. I used my NTSC DVD disk version. I counldn't find any artifacts. However, this Movie is similar to "Red Planet"'s quaity in those dark scenes.. poor, poor blocky. Should I say, Hatchy. Anyways.. These type movies have to handled w/ gentle care when archiving them to CDR. The encoding of such can be trechereous!! But, these movies are not recommended for script debugging, because of the poor quality. They will only confuse you more. Anyways.. Are you sure that the movie is Interlaced every other frame, cause this makes me wonder about the chroma that Sh0dan mentioned. That would mean that they F** this movie really bad 8O So, have you gone through more than just Chapter 5 ?? Like, some of the more easier less action scenes ?? The opening theme music is awsome though!! Should have ben used in "Planet of the Ape's" ..don't you think ? And, I also prefer to watch that movie during :cry: daylight :cry: cause I scare easy watching those at night .. .. bri.bri.bri.bri zzzzzzz. But, it's a great Movie !! They should do a sequel soon. And, I'll be it's in the writing. Hope Fishborn doesn't turn it down. -vhelp |
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Hakko's IVTC tutorial could be useful in such cases: http://www.doom9.org/ivtc-tut.htm It's just that sometimes you don't get good results no matter what you do, hence "the good, the bad and the ugly" mentioned in the guide. |
Thanks for all your help with this... 8)
Here's another screenie, it seems like this only occurs during High Action scenes. http://www.digitalfaq.com/archives/error.gif @kwag: I tried your approach, but the whole image seems to be VERY soft now... and it takes a long time to do this... :cry: @shOdan: sounds pretty interesting. But when I use ConvertToYUY2(interlaced=true), wouldn't that mess up all the frames that look ok? And would I put that line at the very beginning, because I figure the filters won't work in YUY2... :? As I mentioned before, this only happens during high action scenes. I can see clearly that around people there are artifacts due to ghosting in the source. It seems that for example when an object is moving to the right rapidly, there are thin horizontal lines still left of the object... @vhelp: it is a great movie, but it really gets me that the PAL version is that BAD! :evil: On slow scenes, everything looks just fine, but whenever there's action (not only in that scene), every other frame looks like that... @Boulder: thanks for the link... I read the guide, but I'm not sure whether this movie belongs to "the ugly", because most of the frames in the movie are ok... so hard to deal with this... And yes, it seems to be a real bad transfer unfortunately... |
This might also be of some interest:
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=38351 And regarding conversion to YUY2, most filters do work with both YV12 and YUY2 so give it a shot. |
The frames you are posting are clearly interlaced, with horizontal lines.
Therefore they will have bad chroma upsampling, when you PREVIEW it in vdub. This is however NOT caused by Avisynth - and the video is actually CORRECT. This might sound strange, but the error occurs, when vdub must display YV12 in the preview window. Vdub (or actually the codec decompressing the frames) assumes that the YV12 is non-interlaced - therefore chroma is upsampled wrongly, when the video is converted for preview. Bad chroma upsampling happends, when YV12 is converted to another colorspace, and "interlaced" is not set properly. So INSIDE AviSynth the YV12 material is ok - the preview is wrong. ConvertToYUY2(interlaced=true) will make vdub display interlaced frames correctly. Rules:
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@Boulder: Thanks a lot for THAT link! added it to my bookmarks as a reference... very interesting!!
@shodan: I'm afraid, it doesn't work... :cry: I tried it on a clean AVS, and the horizontal lines are still present when I add this line right after the MPEG2Source line... Strange I know... :? |
@ Jellygoose..
I was wondering.. Could you possibly send us (U/L) a 2 second .AVI of that clip ?? Use winRAR to compress to smallest size. And, don't do anything to the source. Leave as is. This way, we all can sample it. I'm only trying ta help you out. But, maybe others can sooner (w/ your sample) ?? Is this at all possible ?? If you need help, let me know. I'll be there :) Thanks jell.. be good. -vhelp |
@ Jellygoose: The interlacing lines will not go away - you need to either do IVTC (using telecide) or Fielddeinterlace. The only thing you get is proper color conversion.
You may need to tweak the telecide options. |
Thanks for your patience all of you!
@shodan: :oops: sure, I should have read more before I ask stupid questions like this! Thanks a lot. What I'm currently trying is this line: Telecide(guide=2,post=true, blend=false) This takes away the interlace lines pretty good. would you recommend converting into YUY2 with interlaced true before this Telecide line? @vhelp: Ok, I'll definetely do that later today. So I produce this sample clip with VDub right? I've never done this before... Would I use HuffyYuv codec for this? |
No need to convert to YUY2! The thing you're experiencing is VDub's problem, when you encode the movie, the colorspace doesn't need to be converted.
To make a sample clip, make a simple AVS script just to load the d2v file, load it in VDub, use HuffYUV compression and save a small, totally unprocessed AVI. |
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