AG-5710 connectors stuck, removal method?

[FishonDavid]

This is my 1st full teardown of one of these VCRs, I was struggling, to remove and seperate the boards on the AG-5710, seemed like the connectors may be glued in, not sure, but found the easier solution to be
just desolder the connectors from the main board,

i just felt i didnt want to take the risk of breaking anything, and this seemed like the practical method to deal with this problem

[latreche34]

The easiest way is to stick two tiny flat screw drivers on both latches to release the catches and pull up the board, de-soldering is too much wok.

[FishonDavid]

Thanks,latreche34, as i said, these connectors are not going to seperate, in fact, after desoldering this board, and getting a better access to those catches your referring to , i still cant get them apart, as i said, i think they are glued in, they do not want to be seperated, and at the risk of breakage, desoldering turned out to be the best solution for this board, but im sure, that is not always the case,

[latreche34]

I think due to age, plastics tend to shrink and adhere to each other over time, Another way is to spry a harmless to plastics chemical into the connector's mating surfaces such as Detoxit or WD-40 to try to separate them, Make sure you clean them afterwards.

[FishonDavid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by latreche34

I think due to age, plastics tend to shrink and adhere to each other over time, Another way is to spry a harmless to plastics chemical into the connector's mating surfaces such as Detoxit or WD-40 to try to separate them, Make sure you clean them afterwards.

i remember, someone suggesting, if i ever do get them apart, to put some soap or something back into the connector before reattaching the board, so the next time, it will come out easier,
thanks
David

[latreche34]

Not sure about soap, I would use dielectric grease.

[RobustReviews]

Quote:

Originally Posted by latreche34

Not sure about soap, I would use dielectric grease.

Neither soap, nor WD40 are in any way acceptable here.

Think back to basic chemistry. It's downright wrong and I'm quite saddened to hear of somebody I imaged was a bit more 'clued up' in these matters suggesting that I must admit.

Dexoit as a light volatile or similar is perfectly acceptable, WD40 is no better nor worse than 'soap' in this application.

WD40 is for water displacement, that's it. It has crude fundamental lubricating properties for crude devices in a pinch: that's it job in actual practice. Trust me, trying to get rid of WD40 from controlled impedance boards is a nightmare. I know this from bitter experience and having to wash a set of boards many years ago having nearly been snapped in half and thrown across a workshop by the lead engineer who'd been slaving over a test rig for a week trying to get consistent signals from an inst' amp' circuit. Electrically that's far from dissimilar from a video stage.

Don't ever recommend it for use on sensitive signal chains. Leave it for drying out the ignition system on your prehistoric truck or as an emergency (tempoary) lubricant in crude machines.

[latreche34]

I don't think you understand the conversation, We were discussing two things, One is how to loosen the connector so it can be removed which WD-40 and Detoxit both work great for such purpose and are safe for plastics as long as you clean them afterwards which I suggested and just because you sprayed half a bottle and didn't know how to clean it doesn't mean it is a bad product, we are talking about a drop or two that's all. Second, after the repair is done and everything is clean, how to prevent this from happening again by keeping the connectors clean and lubricated which I suggested dielectric grease instead of soap. Why you are quoting dielectric grease and talking about WD-40? Read and understand the conversation before start swinging the knife.

[RobustReviews]

Quote:

Originally Posted by latreche34

I don't think you understand the conversation, We were discussing two things, One is how to loosen the connector so it can be removed which WD-40 and Detoxit both work great for such purpose and are safe for plastics as long as you clean them afterwards which I suggested and just because you sprayed half a bottle and didn't know how to clean it doesn't mean it is a bad product, we are talking about a drop or two that's all. Second, after the repair is done and everything is clean, how to prevent this from happening again by keeping the connectors clean and lubricated which I suggested dielectric grease instead of soap. Why you are quoting dielectric grease and talking about WD-40? Read and understand the conversation before start swinging the knife.

Nope, you suggested using it on a PCB, the answer is no, that's a surefire way to create damage.

I'm not apologising for that, and it needs pointing out for anybody who follows this thread in the future.

[lordsmurf]

Quote:

Originally Posted by FishonDavid

seemed like the connectors may be glued in,

There's no telling. Not only were the deck made badly, but idiots have tinkered with them in the past decade or so. I think you made a good call. These are not easy to work with, so whatever needs to be done to fix is probably okay. Try not try break anything, which is also not easy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by latreche34

I think due to age, plastics tend to shrink and adhere to each other over time,

Or put it in a warehouse in Texas or Arizona, leave it for years, and see what melts together.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FishonDavid

i remember, someone suggesting, if i ever do get them apart, to put some soap or something back into the connector before reattaching the board, so the next time, it will come out easier,

While Youtube advice can really be bad at times, there are some good video for restoring old Apples, and stuff of that nature. They have tricks to clean boards, pull boards apart, etc. You may need to watch multiple videos, to get a consensus on what is a good and idea, and what is not. I've had to use some of those methods on TBCs before, full teardowns.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RobustReviews

Neither soap, ... are in any way acceptable here.

I don't know about that. Some of the above restore methods have to involve soap, alcohol, etc, and the board is later cleansed in distilled water (like in this video https://youtu.be/nnUEkqXT1ak?t=297 starting around 5 minutes).

Quote:

nor WD40
WD40 is for water displacement,

I'd also avoid WD-40 for this.
But then you have stuff like this: https://www.wd40.com/electrical-cleaner/
Proceed with extreme caution.

Quote:

Don't ever recommend it for use on sensitive signal chains. Leave it for drying out the ignition system on your prehistoric truck or as an emergency (tempoary) lubricant in crude machines.

Or to lube door hinges.

Quote:

Originally Posted by latreche34

just because you sprayed half a bottle and didn't know how to clean it doesn't mean it is a bad product,

I remember a post from several years ago, where you suggested a person use some auto product (silicone, maybe, IIRC?) and the person unloaded the entire tube on his VCR, and probably ruined in. It was the post where the cheap s-video cable pin broke off in the VCR.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RobustReviews

Nope, you suggested using it on a PCB, the answer is no, that's a surefire way to create damage.
I'm not apologising for that, and it needs pointing out for anybody who follows this thread in the future.

While your general advice is good, I think the precision advice from latreche may be fine here. When you're trying to work with and/or clean sensitive areas, you must be gentle and careful.

This sort of conversation reminds me of a true story from decades ago (and I forget details more and more), where a girl (19,20?) wanted to DIY intimate shave/wax (back when such a thing was far less common, and there was no internet to guide her), and she used too much of the wrong thing, and it was a trip to the ER, with permanent scarring burns and cuts.

Standard advice applies: don't be a dumbass.

[hodgey]

On the NV-HS1000 I literally had to pry the boards off with a screwdriver, which was rater iffy tbh. There are tabs on the connectors that hold them in but even with those bend out of the way they sit in pretty hard. If you have a desoldering gun to make desoldering easy that's probably the better option yeah. With just solder wick/vacuum pump it's a lot of work. It's also not unusual for vcrs of this era to have boards that are literally soldered in and can't be removed without desoldering which can be a pain. Especially when they used double-sided pcbs with solder on both sides.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lordsmurf

I'd also avoid WD-40 for this.
But then you have stuff like this: https://www.wd40.com/electrical-cleaner/

Presumably that's just WD-40 branded electronic cleaner similar to other electronic cleaner spray cans with other brands rather than anything related to what's in standard WD40. Modern Syhthetic PTFE-containing lubricant is also found under many brands though I doubt that one would be of much help here (synthetic ptfe grease can be used for lubricating mechanics though).

[RobustReviews]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hodgey

Presumably that's just WD-40 branded electronic cleaner similar to other electronic cleaner spray cans with other brands rather than anything related to what's in standard WD40.

Yeah, they use the wordmark on various overpriced products now. They sell contact cleaner in a WD-40 branded can for a nice tidy sum. I'm sure it's good, but it's probably not worth the money.

[latreche34]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lordsmurf

While your general advice is good, I think the precision advice from latreche may be fine here. When you're trying to work with and/or clean sensitive areas, you must be gentle and careful.

Exactly, People always assume that if this product is suggested it must be poured to death, and then you get the snow flakes screaming "don't ever suggest that" it's like they are the hobby gate keepers. Honestly if someone doesn't know how to put a drop or two of lubricant on a part without making a mess he should not be qualified to do any repair on a piece of gear, Period.

There is the usual maintenance scenario when you use the normal products and there is the unusual circumstances where the general rules of maintenance cannot be applied and that's where you sort to using unusual methods and special products that otherwise are not recommended during normal maintenance, This case is one of them. I've been in such situations and solved them.

[RobustReviews]

Quote:

Originally Posted by latreche34

Exactly, People always assume that if this product is suggested it must be poured to death, and then you get the snow flakes screaming "don't ever suggest that" it's like they are the hobby gate keepers. Honestly if someone doesn't know how to put a drop or two of lubricant on a part without making a mess he should not be qualified to do any repair on a piece of gear, Period.

It's distinctly the wrong product though.

Interestingly, as a mechanical engineer do you ever use it?

[FishonDavid]

i do have deoxit D5, that i use for cleaning the mode switch, i should of bought it in the dropper bottle, not the spray, oh well, ill be resourceful, and spray a little into a peanut butter jar lid (thats clean) and dab a little on the connectors before reinstalling, as far as the work of desoldering this board, it took me all of 60 seconds with some flux and wick, and i should be able to resolder it back on the board, in about 2 minutes, (using my digital microscope), i just could not afford to break the plastic, after tugging, and prying with the screwdriver on those catchs, as im also pulling, ever so gently, that plactic seems to become very brittle after so many years of exposure.

[latreche34]

Whatever you do don't pull from the wires only, always use tweezers to grab the connector's body while gently helping from the wires not excessively (had to add this warning otherwise the snow flakes will be screaming don't suggest pulling from the wires). Deoxit may not work well as a lubricant but you can always try. Even if you decide to de-solder the connectors make sure you take them apart, You may find some corrosion in the pins that should be cleaned off.

[MrPete]

An update: "WD40" needs clarification, just as much as "3 in one" does. Can't assume a moisture-displacer or oil anymore! To make it even more confusing, way back in 1995, WD40 bought out 3-in-one.

"WD40" is now called "WD-40 Multi-Use Product". They also sell a huge number of other "Specialist" lubricants, including an entire line just for bicycles. White Lithium grease, PTFE dry lube, silocone, and more. I've got a few cans of the other products. Handy!


And the same is true for 3-in-one.