NV-FS100, Elgato, VHS-C video to capture?

[TomTX]

This is a great place! I have read hours of information and I have a question, finally.
My 30yr old S-VHS-C tapes are already decaying, yup. I still have a working NV-FS100 deck (an a non-working one too!). I've been digitizing the last 3 weekends and pretty much get what the tapes are capable of displaying. I'm using the S-video connector, deck set on 'Edit' and the Elgato capture software. I read and followed Tim Ford's OBS guide for the lossless capture; tried and didn't get any audio for monitoring, but that's not a huge issue. It copied the original audio for the end file.
After reading, bookmarking, reading some more; I'm at the conclusion that unless I invest in some high-dollar post-processing, the Panasonic-to-VideoCapture is going to be about the best I can achieve with 1992 videos. My PC is less than 1yr old Alienware desktop w/plenty of horsepower, good-to-go.
Any suggestions with present playback and capture equipment to eek out a slightly better capture?
Those of you with much experience that have done this are aware, some tapes are Great! Others suck.
Not sure anything I have will improve that. Is there anything else (barring $$$) that may improve the digitizing?
Good forum, great help here.
Thanks,
Tom

[lordsmurf]

- NV-FS100 should be great for S-VHS with line TBC
- You lack frame TBC, issues are likely.
- Elgato is a lousy capture card, in multiple ways.

Do not use OBS. It's not capture software, but streaming/screen recording software. Not the same. It records video from the system preview layers, not by actually connecting to the capture card.

Use VirtualDub 1.9.x -- not others versions.

Age of videos, 1992, really has nothing to do with anything.
It's entirely about the signal, capturing the best signal that actually exists on the tape (ie, not made worse by crappy VCR, capture card, software, lack of TBCs, etc).

Proper gear is more than just a slight % gain in quality. That VCR is a great start. OBS and Elgato are no-go, dead ends, must pivot to something better. And again, lack of TBC.

All hobbies/DIY cost money. Video is actually quite cheap compared to most, just a few $K and you literally have everything you will ever need. Buy it, use it, resell it when done with the project, it holds value. Your Alienware computer easily cost more, not to mentioned all the software/games you'll buy for it.

[Xhumeka]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lordsmurf

- NV-FS100 should be great for S-VHS with line TBC

I didn't think the FS100 had TBC, I thought it was just the FS200 that had TBC. I checked an online manual for the NV-FS100 and it also has no mention of TBC.

Checking pictures online, the FS200 has a physical TBC button on the dropdown faceplate, and looking at the FS100 I don't see a similar button.

The reason I'm looking for clarity is because I'm looking for a Panasonic SVHS unit with TBC also, and if the FS100 has it that will expand my options!

[hodgey]

The FS100 does not have a TBC. It shares the mech with the FS200 but is a year or two older. Should be decent otherwise as long as it's in good condition (think there are some video circuit caps that can go bad at least). So you would ideally want to use it with a panasonic dvd-recorder or something else that provide line-tbc/horizontal jitter correction.

[TomTX]

Thank you all for your contributions. I've read many many lists of VCR's that have TBC. Threads on other forums that get into the board level components of decks listed as having TBC but don't really and use other tricks to (simulate?) TBC. It's all a big rabbit hole that I'll need to figure out soon.
Question: I have a Kenwood Entre' MR-H1 with S-video in and out. How can I find out if this has usable TBC for my digitization of VHS?
And I think my other question is - Is there a definitive list of US VCR's with TBC? I've looked at the updated list here and can't find any used decks of the specific models listed. I can find decks that are 'close' in model # but not exact. Also, I'm trying to find one with S-video in / out so I can get the best feed from my Panasonic NV-FS100.
TomTX

[timtape]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TomTX

...After reading, bookmarking, reading some more; I'm at the conclusion that unless I invest in some high-dollar post-processing, the Panasonic-to-VideoCapture is going to be about the best I can achieve with 1992 videos...

It's not always easy to know how well the signal on the tapes has been captured. It's much easier with films, photos and slides because we can look at the original images directly. Not so video or audio tapes.

Much of post processing is minimising distracting or unwanted aspects, or at best balancing up things that have already been captured. We cant enhance what hasnt been captured. So a good capture is quite important. Much depends on the condition of the VCR.

[Hushpower]

Quote:

unless I invest in some high-dollar post-processing, the Panasonic-to-VideoCapture is going to be about the best I can achieve with 1992 videos...

I agree with Timtape; the most important (and costly for the gear) thing is getting the best capture. Unless you spend money on a commercial enhancement product such as Neat Video and/or a commercial Non-Linear video editing program, post-capture enhancement is very good, completely free and very easy to do (according to some! ).

[cinemaman]

So you are using an Elgato USB capture stick ? Just out of curiosity, which one ? I only ask because my understanding is they are not built equal, with some of the older models reckoned to be pretty good. One seems to be an ATI 600 clone (designed for Mac but apparently works on Windows with a particular Hauppauge driver), and others contain the Micronas chip which member jwillis84 indicated was also good (10 bit processing).

[TomTX]

Cinenaman - I'm using the Elgato DVD capture, listed as Elgato Video Capture - Digitize Video for Mac, PC or iPad (USB 2.0) on Amazon. I know Elgato was aquired by Corsair several years ago and both companies have great reputations.
I still am trying to find out about the Kenwood MR-H1 having TBC.
Today! I also just dug out 4 video capture/TV cards I had in tubs ready for Goodwill. 1 - AverMedia AverTV Go 007 FM Plus; 2- Kworld ATSC 120; 3- AVerMedia M15C; 4-Pinnacle PCTV 800i REV 1.1. Now I need to know if any of these are usable for capturing VHS for digitizing?

[hodgey]

For the Kenwood - from the manual it looks like it at least digitizes the signal so it may or may not do a better job than the capture card, and may help give a stable signal from the capture card. Would test with and without to see if there is any notable difference. Though, unless it's some rare unicorn that happens to use a panasonic video chip or something I doubt it's anything all that special but idk for certain. The service manual I can find only has a few overview diagrams, which shows the main system as "IBM Vesta" which I can't find anything about outside of supercomputers. So, might be worth looking for one of the dvd-recorders with known stabilising ability like the panasonic dmr-es10/15 eh50/eh55 etc.

The Avermedia cards use philips/NXP video chips so might be more robust when handling direct vcr output than the elgato though no idea how they are with drivers and such. The Kworld and pinnacle are not that great unless you are planning to go all out and get into using vhs-decode as they have the chips that work with the raw signal capture linux driver so would be usable for that.

Also, didn't realize there was a US version of the NV-FS100 (I know there is the AG1960 which might share a bit with the FS100.)

[TomTX]

hodgey, You got me to thinking re: Kenwood MR-H1. I also have the DV5900m 400Ah disc dvd changer with Faroujda processor. This dvd changer has an S-video in, and out. I don't know (doubt?) it does any processing with these ports, possibly a pass-through? I'm no good at reading schematics and have the manual somewhere. I will hook up the MR-H1 and try passing the signal through that. But my only capture is still the Elgato. Until I can assemble an old minitower and use one of the PCI cards I only have the Elgato on my Win11 PC. Back in the day I did have a MythTV box :-) I can confirm one Avermedia has the philips chip, the other has a Samsung C722 chip. All the info you and others share here is Great! But you see now why I should've left those tapes in the box another 10yrs?!