What are my best options for VHS capture?
 

This will be NTSC capture. Here is the hardware I currently have:

- 2012 Macbook Pro with thunderbolt and firewire ports, I could use bootcamp for Windows 7 on this
- 2023 Macbook Pro M2 Max, I'm assuming this is useless according to what I've heard about Mac captures
- Self-built PC running Windows 10, I have no PCIe slots available for a capture card, and this is a shared PC that I can't really mess with to install a version of Windows XP because I'm not confident enough to not screw up the data that's on there now.

These are the options I have available now, and I know there has to be a good combination available between what I have and a capture card. I know I'm going to need a VCR with TBC, or at least TBC-ish, but I have to focus on this conundrum first to stay safe and keep from going all the way broke.

I've been tempted to use a DV converter so that I don't have to worry about a TBC as much, but I don't want to sacrifice the color information.

I've heard good and bad things about the Blackmagic Intensity, but I would definitely need a TBC for that which I don't have yet. I've also heard good things about the ATI 600, but I've heard it won't work properly even with Windows 7. I've also heard good things about the IO Data GV-USB2 or a Hauppauge USB-Live2, but then I've had people tell me they are easy cap clones and to stay away. I would ideally like to capture through component as I've heard that's best for archival quality, but is that necessary or even possible without professional broadcast equipment?

What would be the best combo options of hardware, OS, and capture card method?

I recently posted about wanting to start a side business transferring VHS tapes. I'm learning more which is great, though I'm kind of skeptical that I will even be able to get customers, but if I do I want to give them quality service. Thank you in advance for anyone taking the time to read and answer.

-vcr with tbc
-pc with w10p and hd dedicated to captur, (i've hgst 1tb 7200rpm)
-capture: if the vcr is a good device, a usb capture device based on conexant polaris is a good choice (vc500?).
-amarectv 310
-huffyuv 211

i tested a conexant polaris vs io data usb2, and the conexant polaris is better (you can see result in my today post)

Windows 10 can be a pain to capture on. I would think it would be worse on a shared PC. Updates mess with capture cards. The Pinnacle cards capture in Windows XP, Vista, 7, 8 ,10, and 11. Windows XP and Windows 7 are both very stable OSs that are good for capture. XP is chosen if someone wants to use a capture card that requires Windows XP like the ATI AIW cards. The AIW cards aren't very resilient. You wouldn't want to pair an AIW card with an ES-15 that only has a frame sync. If you think you might not get a full frame TBC it would be better to buy a more resilient card like a Pinnacle 510/710 USB. There are versions of the 510 and 710s so you can't just go to eBay for that card.

The Shuttle is really bad.

DV might be a good budget option.

The VC500 has AGC issues. It used to get recommended in old Sanlyn post but not really anymore.

I think my plan then is to swap out the current hard drive in my 2012 Macbook, download Windows 7 via bootcamp, and use it as a dedicated transfer device. I imagine that for now I'm going to go with something like the ES-15 as I don't think I can afford a full on TBC VCR. When you say there are versions of the 510 and 710s and I can't go to eBay for it, how would I go about getting one?

Your Mac won't work for analog capture. https://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/vid...s-windows.html

Line TBCs are in VCRs. Frame TBCs are standalone units. https://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/vid...time-base.html

Dirt cheap for this is a non TBC Svideo VCR https://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/vid...ing-guide.html, Panasonic ES-15, then Capture card. If you want a little better setup it's recommended to add a Datavideo DVK 200 between the ES-15 and the capture card. The Datavideo DVKs bought from LS are preset and modded. Better than that is a VCR with a line TBC and a full frame TBC.

I’ve seen that post about transferring on Mac, but I believe that’s only referring to using Virtual Machine or some other kind of virtual synthesizing of Windows, but with Bootcamp, as far as I know, it runs natively and directly to the hardware, so transferring using Bootcamp would work. It’s totally possible I’m wrong, but that’s how I understand it.

Replying as I read...

Mac just isn't a quality system for consumer analog SD videotapes. It's almost entirely DV-based (1990s tech with blocks and 50%+ color loss), with a few oddball methods that require 15-year-old OS X versions, or semi-screwy workarounds.

Windows is just easier, even Win11. And most Win11-able cards are USB, not internal.

XP is only an option, in order to use the best card (AIW). But there are several quite good cards for Win7-11, all USB, and I use several myself. Namely the same Pinnacle cards that I have in the marketplace.

Good to see you've done research on VCR, TBC, etc. You got it. :congrats:

DV converters have nothing to do with TBCs. DV boxes can, and do, have issues like any other capture card. Some form of TBC is required, whether a minimal TBC(ish) ES10/15 type passthrough, or actual quality TBCs for better quality.

Blackmagic cards are horrible at SD, an afterthought feature for the quality HD capture. Even with DataVideo/Cypress TBCs, it can still have problems.

ATI 600 USB is fine up to Win7. The issue is 8/10/11, because of how Windows changes the AV operations, and new drivers don't exist post-Vista (and Vista works fine in 7). The Vidbox drivers are a problem for it, as ATI is not 100% generic eMPIA bridge.

Hauppauge Live2 is a bad card, very sensitive like Blackmagic. And other issues. It's not an Easycap clone, but it sucks all the same.

GV-USB2 can be an Easycap clone, lots of scams on eBay/Amazon/etc. But even the actual Japanese card poses it's own set of problems, such as forcing you to use then analong-streaming software AmaRecTV. That can work, but mostly for PAL (not NTSC), and it comes with it's own set of challenges involving default values and histograms. You save ~$25 or so, but you buy that back in time spent.

Component is not good. To extract the separate luma/chroma from the tape (sent via s-video), you have to process the video. That processing is never good, even from broadcast appliances. The final file, capture s-video, and internally saved YUV (YCrCb) will look better.

Standard workflow applies: VCR > some for of TBC > capture card
Ideally actual TBCs, to save time and sanity/frustration.
So JVC/Panasonic VCR with line/field TBC > actual frame TBC >quality capture card.

The capture card is the easiest and cheapest piece to get. I ever have a full workflow available, right now, one the best TBCs made (early BV10), one of the best JVC models, and capture card of your choice. I built this for a hobbyist that had to back out at the last minute. I wasn't supposed to have workflows this year, but I do.

If you plan to have a side business, quality of gear matters. Not just for visual reason, but in terms of having gear that plays/cooperates with the tapes you'll get. People often make the mistake of thinking their limited VHS tape collection represents the wider VHS tape world. That's when TBCs, tape transports, etc, really come into focus.

eBay isn't good for those Pinnacle cards. There are versions, and odds of the bad/wrong version is greater than 50%. That's why you see mixed reviews on those cards, because it's never "the same" card version.

"Buy cheap, buy twice" is a real problem in video.
Or, for some, "buy cheap, make crap" and then refer to it as "VHS quality" as an excuse.

I can actually make budget setups, which still has TBCs, for about $1k. I just don't do it often, as I have to modify some firmware each time. But it looks good for the price. It's not ideal to use for service to others, or at least not as primary. However, I can build out a sort of 50/50 setup, similar to DVK setup, but still better priced.

Essentially, you have several options here. :)

If you want any of my gear, PM me a budget, I'll get you setup. I work with small businesses, large orgs, archivists, etc. Get them the gear, give some quick one-on-one training via forum (sometimes email/PM), and you'll be off to capture videos with quality and ease.

If you want to go it alone, that's fine. Just be aware some of this isn't easy to acquire, nor cobble together randomly. There's some art to building out workflows without problems.

Regular VHS, or VHS-C?

S-VHS-C camcorders with a built-in TBC are much easier and cheaper to find than a full-size S-VHS VCR with a TBC.

And no, the "Video Stabilizer" found on consumer-grade S-VHS VCRs is not a TBC. In fact, turning it on usually makes captures worse, rather than better.

Have you ever actually used a S-VHS-C camera?

Those are awful for playback, and were not much better at recording. If I had to pick a single mistake, that I'd ever made in video, it's be using S-VHS-C format.

- For recording, we should have gone Hi8.
- For playback, I should have never played S-VHS-C tapes in those cameras. I'd have less eaten tapes in our family collection.

My experience are also not from using just a single camera, but multiples. And many, many others have this same experience online.

VHS-C is infamous for being a flimsy format, essentially taking the worst aspects of VHS (constructionally speaking). S-VHS-C was identical in construction.

JVC was the only maker of S-VHS-C cameras, and both their S-VHS-C and VHS-C camcorders were not much better than 99% of their VHS VCRs. And JVC made excellent S-VHS VCRs, but awful VHS VCRs, with few exceptions. (Though noting post-1995 S-VHS is what you want, nothing before that.)

I honestly don't care if an S-VHS-C camcorder was given to me for free. It's not worth the risk of losing tapes. It will happen, guaranteed, as the squashed form factor VHS transports are garbage.

Yep.

Yes, and its TBC allowed me to get an acceptable result from a TBC-less USB capture device that was a wobble-fest when capturing from a plain VHS VCR:
$15 TVBox USB video capture device - Junk or gem?