Thanks for the detailed answer :-)
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By the way, I found the "Cleaner" I was speaking about in eBay: https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/VHS-VCR-...-/372086323835 Is that a real thing? or have no impact on quality? Thank you lordsmurf! |
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In this instance, deinterlacing is like this: You: "Doctor, my foot hurts, what should I do?" Doctor: "Chop it off." (deinterlace) Quote:
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Clean a VCR only when troubleshooted to definitively be a case of dirty VCR heads. Too many people knee-jerk react to VHS problems, and needlessly "clean" (usually ruin) VCR heads. It's not something that will cure whatever ails the VCR. In fact, dirty heads is rarely the issue, although damaged heads is sadly common due to all the horrible cleaning advice found online (using Q-tips aka cotton swabs, using head cleaners, etc). |
Great, so I will posting examples later on. Thanks everyone who helped!
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The quality of ld-decode already exceeds the best PAL LaserDisc player, if you factor out the effect of dropouts.
The vhs-decode fork has only been worked on by one author (hodgey) with Zcooger offering a few tweaks, I believe. Quote:
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Some other demos: http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/vide...s-showing.html https://youtu.be/tMA5aH_olAQ https://youtu.be/japFCgCVd00 https://youtu.be/qzF5dllTn-I https://youtu.be/4ei4CQxUgPA https://youtu.be/9_xue8-gGLM https://youtu.be/ZPE8cOvgZFE And a more subtle example showing correction of horizontal jitter: https://youtu.be/1_Y1VvazOlk |
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vhs-decode is also quite amazing as a proof-of-concept, but still hurdles to overcome for quality. In time, perhaps it will overcome those as well. At the moment, as mentioned in my VH response, it's about what you could expect from an Easycap card, via composite, connected to a consumer VHS VCR. But it has potential. Quote:
And all of this is getting off-topic to this VirtualDub guide thread. :wink2: |
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Hi i did notice a problem with Matrox MXO2 LE MAX it does not have any proc amp in the input only on the output sort of
it does capture perfect if i use matrox own codecs then i does not crush the blacks or whites it captures always full range but i can afterwards when i have already capture the avi file expand it or not like in this photo but if i use Virtual Dub and use Huffyuv or lagarith i have to enable "Extend luma black point" and "Extend luma white point" then it capture full range so does are good to enable if somone have bad card that crush the blacks or whites or not but it did work very good for me anyway im sure itīs old news but i did not know it :) |
But are there real benefits? The standard is yuv 16-235 expanded to rgb 0-255, capturing yuv 0-255 should not add anything.
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However, after further researching complaints of USB cards clipping blacks, I was able to find underexposede dark scenes where some data was in the 0-15 range. So if you're seeking to restore video, you may need the full 0-255. However, you must be careful to output 16-235 values. However, in general, most footage has 99%+ of the image data within the 16-235 range. My testing is still not done... One of my hypothesis is that VirtualDub expansion settings should suffice for capture. Another is that Huffyuv may somehow be involved in clipping, and that Matrox statement from jjdd is interesting. Just hypothesis, must run tests to see what happens. @jjdd: Not many people ever delved into this, or discussed it, so actually not entirely old news. |
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i have not yet test many tapes with my new MXO2 i did only have one tape that did crush the blacks if i did not enable the "Extend luma black point" and "Extend luma white point" in virtualDub maybe i only need to enable "Extend luma black point" if i did not do that the backs where crush i did try to pump up the shadows but did not help at all it was gone i put a picture you can see good on the top left corner the rings they are gone
i did remember that the old retail vhs tape of Batman was good tape to test because itīs very dark movie :) it was on that tape i did see the problem i did have to use External TBC to get rid of macrovision maybe that did something to the capture when i capture with matrox codecs the avi file i can later switch between "Standard setting" and "Expanded setting" in the Matrox VFW Codec Config like in the picture i did post it would be good if Huffyuv or lagarith did have that Expanded setting on or off so i can switch between later then i do not need to care if i need to have enable "Extend luma black point" and "Extend luma white point" or not :) here is Matrox VFW Codec Documentation Page 3 and 4 is about the Config setting https://www.matrox.com/video/media/p..._Codecs_10.pdf |
You don't need the Matrox codec to choose those settings. They are the same as standard Rec601 vs PC.601 conversion in Avisynth, and they're the wrong way to correct levels that fall below Y=16.
http://avisynth.nl/index.php/Convert#Matrix Instead of fooling with the non-standard RGB conversions, you should adjust the levels of your captures so that darks you want to retain never fall below Y=16 (and brights don't exceed 235). It's the only way to guarantee they won't be clipped if you later view the video on a device that does standard conversion. If you buy a proper, professionally authored movie DVD, it doesn't come with instructions to change to Expanded (PC) levels. It's authored with all important information between 16-235. |
if i do not enable "Extend luma black point" and "Extend luma white point" in Virtual Dub then i have to use my External PA-200 proc amp to correct that if i use Huffyuv or lagarith codecs
my other capture cards have internal proc amp so does do not have this problem |
From VirtualDub help file.
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* This is me correcting a typo in the Help file. The original text incorrectly states 0-15. The author clearly copy-pasted his description for Black point to White point and forgot to change the numbers. |
msgohan ok have to read more :)
i did get my Aja IO HD today testing it here right now it looks like Aja IO HD donīt care about macrovision on retail vhs tape it plays them fine have to test more :) but on the Aja io hd i get the same problem as with mxo2 blacks gets crushed on the Batman VHS i think not sure yet and i donīt find any internal proc amp on the Aja io HD on the stand alone program maybe needs Final Cut maybe the retail vhs Batman is a special :) other tapes i have test itīs ok no crushed blacks :) |
msgohan thanks :) this did do the same thing as matrox VFW Codec config on does Huffyuv or lagarith avi files that was crushed blacks
when i did that then i can see the rings on the crushed black clip where i did not enable the "Extend luma black point" and "Extend luma white point" not sure if that was corect done or not but it works i did convert to RGB and then back to YUY2 Code:
AviSource("D:\movie.avi").ConvertToRGB32(matrix="PC.601",interlaced=true).ConvertToYUY2(matrix="Rec601",interlaced=true) have to test if that works on does Aja io HD .mov clips i have done it did work on Aja IO HD .mov files i have to use LSMASHVideoSource :) i did first use QTInput and that did not work Code:
LSMASHVideoSource("D:\movie.mov",format="YUY2").ConvertToRGB32(matrix="PC.601",interlaced=true).ConvertToYUY2(matrix="Rec601",interlaced=true) |
Please let me know if this is not the place to post (new here). In VirtualDub2, when I select Compression>Huffuv, I see on the right that I can "configure" the codec settings. Should it be YUYV > YUYV422 or YUYV > RGB?
Also, is there a way to reset all settings for VirtualDub2? I deleted it, but the settings must have been saved elsewhere. I'm trying to capture home movies that were filmed in the U.S. (I assume NTSC) and have used 29.97 as the frame rate. I started with less than 5% dropped frames and synced audio, but now the frames seem to drop in larger chunks (20 at a time instead of 1 at a time) even though the drop rate is still below 5% and audio comes in and out of sync. I used the settings suggested in this video (with the exception that I use Huffyuv) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sn_TDa9zY1c. For reference, using the below: 1. Sony RDR - VX515 via composite and RCA audio to I-O Data Capture Device Using Huffuv to Capture 3. Deinterlace and compress using FFMPEG x265 Thanks for the help. |
lordsmurf and sanlyn recommend against VirtualDub2.
I suppose "YUYV > YUYV422" should be a lossless pixel format conversion. Settings are saved in the Windows Registry. Sony RDR-VX515 supports VHS output over S-Video. Use it instead of composite. This VHS/DVDR combo no doubt uses a composite VHS signal path internally, but if you're lucky the S-Video output path will include some signal stabilization to help with your dropped frame problem (caused by lack of TBC). Your workflow will still produce inferior results and isn't recommended: http://www.digitalfaq.com/editorials...g-workflow.htm |
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Thanks for the tip on the S-Video! |
If I understand the options correctly, YUYV > RGB is converting the incoming data before compressing it. You definitely don't want that. Quality will be worse while file sizes will be larger.
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Hello Team!
I'm absolutely beginner, and spent the last 1-2 month to build my capture station The details of the system: VHS recorder:Panasonic NV-HS 950EE (TBC off, SVHS ON) DVD player, Panasonic DMR-ES15 ATI All-In-Wonder Radeon 9600 PRO 64MB Intel Pentium4, 3066 Mhz I have video8 tapes and VHS tapes, what are copies of the "deleted" video8 tapes. For the capturing of VHS's I use the suggested methode from this site: Virtualdub 1.9.11 and based on the "guide", of course to lossless avi. My problem is, that the all of the tapes captures are ugly for me, there are tonnes of horizontal lines. It seems interlaced for me. As I sad, I'm beginner, I just started my project, and I'm looking for, that that is the max, what I can do for lossless capturing? If yes, than how to "correct" it on the proper way. Deinterlacing with Virtualdub, or it should be something different thing? What is strange for me, that based on the Virtualdub capture screen (preview) seems better the screen I saved some video 8 tape with Sony DCR-TRV 345E, using DV methode. After that I made capture of these video8 trough AIW. With DV the picture seems for me more smoother, sharper, without these ugly horizontal lines. But I know based on your suggestions, that AIW is the proper way. But I really can not see it yet. So please, try to help me to figure out, do i something wrong maybe with the capturing, or it is normal, just I have to know the post-process steps. All the captured video8 tapes has this issue? I put a picture from virtualdub, to show even after deinterlace is a mess. I try to put video as well, but some sec is more than the limit. Thanks in advance! |
You really should have started your own thread rather than replying to the VirtualDub Settings Guide. Hopefully admin will fix this for us.
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Many thanks for your hint to how made a sample from the videos. I exactly need this kind of support on some points :).
I have attached some samples to show you the lossless captured video quality. Video1-2-3-4: Original tape recorded with Kyocera KX-77 video8 camera, after it was transfered to VHS. I captured with AIW system described above Video4_DV:Original tape recorded with Kyocera KX-77 video8 camera. I "saved" with Sony DCR-TRV 345E via DV (from video8 tape) My concern is, that the captured lossless quality is not, what I'm looking for. I would like to be ensured, that the capturing what I did, is OK (I can imagine, that with tapes recorder with this Kyocera camcorder and after transfered to VHS with "how knows what kind of" VHS recorder, that is the max quality, but I do not know really). If it is theoritically OK, than I would like to make some post-process, filtering on it, because from my point of view it is not in good state. What I do not know, how many possibility do I have to filter these. Which kind of filters should I use, ect. I'm beginner. My second concern is the DV "saving". If we compare the Video4 and Video4_DV file, that I can state, that Video4_DV much more better, than Video4. And that is not the conclusion, what I can read from expertised peoples. If I can reach the same quality, with AIW captured file, with filtering as the DV save, I would reach my goal. Concerning de-interlacing, I'm not sure, that it is what I have to do, but that part is concerning to the "necessary post process, filtering question. What is your opinion ? :) |
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Just want to note that discussion is continuing in Matkori's new thread: http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/vide...tured-vhs.html |
I've been testing all manner of settings in VirtualDub timing screen as per this guide but have always had between 30-40 inserted frames on starting capture. Apart from disabling the drop/insert frames options (which I understand just stops reporting on them) the only setting that avoids this initial batch of inserted frame is selecting the "Correct video timing for fewer frame drops inserts".
Can anyone help me understand more about this setting please. Is this really just masking the problem by disabling reporting or does it try to do some job at software-based syncing? I've tested with Philips VR1000/Pana NV-HS860, optionally with ES15 in the loop, all into a Hauppauge USB-Live 2. Regardless of combination I've always had the strange frame inserts on capture start. On my test tape I didn't get any inserts during playback. It sounds good but on my initial tests it seems that audio is still slightly out of sync but nowhere near as bad as it was when 40 frames were inserted every time, skewing audio from the very start. Is this perhaps where the software approach can only do so much with the "Correct video timing for fewer frame drops inserts" option? |
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