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house141 09-16-2018 12:01 PM
Avidemux MPEG-2 file looks different
 
I decided to use Avidemux today to make a first attempt at downsizing my AVI files from VirtualDub and save them to MPEG-2 for archiving.

I followed the guide on here on how to input the settings and when I play back on VLC Media Player my 720x640 AVI videos look even wider AFTER i save them to MPEG-2. Is this because of the format and the way it plays in VLC? Or maybe I did something wrong? My concern is I would like to archive in MPEG-2 and save on hard drive and delete the VirtualDub AVI files from the original VHS capture.

here is the AVI file:
Code:
General
Complete name                            : H:\King Tee Rap City - Full Lossless.avi
Format                                  : AVI
Format/Info                              : Audio Video Interleave
File size                                : 1.10 GiB
Duration                                : 2 min 21 s
Overall bit rate                        : 67.0 Mb/s
Writing library                          : VirtualDub build 32842/release

Video
ID                                      : 0
Format                                  : HuffYUV
Format version                          : Version 2
Codec ID                                : HFYU
Duration                                : 2 min 21 s
Bit rate                                : 65.5 Mb/s
Width                                    : 720 pixels
Height                                  : 480 pixels
Display aspect ratio                    : 3:2
Frame rate                              : 29.970 (30000/1001) FPS
Standard                                : NTSC
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                      : 4:2:2
Bit depth                                : 8 bits
Scan type                                : Interlaced
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                      : 6.320
Stream size                              : 1.08 GiB (98%)

Audio
ID                                      : 1
Format                                  : PCM
Format settings                          : Little / Signed
Codec ID                                : 1
Duration                                : 2 min 21 s
Bit rate mode                            : Constant
Bit rate                                : 1 536 kb/s
Channel(s)                              : 2 channels
Sampling rate                            : 48.0 kHz
Bit depth                                : 16 bits
Stream size                              : 25.9 MiB (2%)
Alignment                                : Aligned on interleaves
Interleave, duration                    : 33  ms (1.00 video frame)
Interleave, preload duration            : 500  ms
here is the MPEG-2:
Code:
General
Complete name                            : C:\Users\BT\Desktop\King Tee Rap City - Full Lossless.mpg
Format                                  : MPEG-PS
File size                                : 169 MiB
Duration                                : 2 min 21 s
Overall bit rate mode                    : Variable
Overall bit rate                        : 10.1 Mb/s

Video
ID                                      : 224 (0xE0)
Format                                  : MPEG Video
Format version                          : Version 2
Format profile                          : Main@Main
Format settings                          : BVOP
Format settings, BVOP                    : Yes
Format settings, Matrix                  : Default
Format settings, GOP                    : M=3, N=18
Duration                                : 2 min 21 s
Bit rate mode                            : Variable
Bit rate                                : 9 476 kb/s
Width                                    : 720 pixels
Height                                  : 480 pixels
Display aspect ratio                    : 16:9
Frame rate                              : 29.970 (30000/1001) FPS
Standard                                : NTSC
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                      : 4:2:0
Bit depth                                : 8 bits
Scan type                                : Progressive
Compression mode                        : Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                      : 0.915
Time code of first frame                : 00:00:00:00
Time code source                        : Group of pictures header
GOP, Open/Closed                        : Open
GOP, Open/Closed of first frame          : Closed
Stream size                              : 160 MiB (94%)

Audio
ID                                      : 189 (0xBD)-128 (0x80)
Format                                  : AC-3
Format/Info                              : Audio Coding 3
Commercial name                          : Dolby Digital
Muxing mode                              : DVD-Video
Duration                                : 2 min 21 s
Bit rate mode                            : Constant
Bit rate                                : 384 kb/s
Channel(s)                              : 2 channels
Channel layout                          : L R
Sampling rate                            : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate                              : 31.250 FPS (1536 SPF)
Bit depth                                : 16 bits
Compression mode                        : Lossy
Stream size                              : 6.46 MiB (4%)
Service kind                            : Complete Main

Menu
If anyone can let me know what I'm looking at it would be great.
Thanks.

hodgey 09-16-2018 12:47 PM
Quote:
Display aspect ratio: 16:9
The mpeg2 files are set to 16:9 aspect ratio? Is this the intention? Otherwise that is probably the issue. There should be a setting in avidemux somewhere to set the aspect ration of the output, don't remember where.

Quote:
Scan type : Progressive
Also, be wary of this, if the source is interlaced, the mpeg2 should also be saved as interlaced, otherwise it may mess up the image, especially the colour information. I believe you need avidemux 2.5 for this from what LS has said, later ones won't save interlaced MPEG2 for whatever reason.

house141 09-16-2018 01:00 PM
2 Attachment(s)
thanks hodgey, let me go find that version here and try again

-- merged --

ok, I used 2.5 and the output quality is not the same for me as the newest version. I am sure it is because the settings are all different than the version in the digitalfaq guide on this site and I don't what I am doing, some of the choices are worded different, it looks like the newer versions are made a little user friendly on the terminology. Anyway, the size of the video that plays on VLC is still different. Would AVI vs MPEG-2 cause this to play differently on VLC? I am concerned on keeping the files on my hard drive for TV viewing quality. here are the output videos I have:
original file:
Code:
General
Complete name                            : H:\King Tee Rap City - Full Lossless.avi
Format                                  : AVI
Format/Info                              : Audio Video Interleave
File size                                : 1.10 GiB
Duration                                : 2 min 21 s
Overall bit rate                        : 67.0 Mb/s
Writing library                          : VirtualDub build 32842/release

Video
ID                                      : 0
Format                                  : HuffYUV
Format version                          : Version 2
Codec ID                                : HFYU
Duration                                : 2 min 21 s
Bit rate                                : 65.5 Mb/s
Width                                    : 720 pixels
Height                                  : 480 pixels
Display aspect ratio                    : 3:2
Frame rate                              : 29.970 (30000/1001) FPS
Standard                                : NTSC
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                      : 4:2:2
Bit depth                                : 8 bits
Scan type                                : Interlaced
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                      : 6.320
Stream size                              : 1.08 GiB (98%)

Audio
ID                                      : 1
Format                                  : PCM
Format settings                          : Little / Signed
Codec ID                                : 1
Duration                                : 2 min 21 s
Bit rate mode                            : Constant
Bit rate                                : 1 536 kb/s
Channel(s)                              : 2 channels
Sampling rate                            : 48.0 kHz
Bit depth                                : 16 bits
Stream size                              : 25.9 MiB (2%)
Alignment                                : Aligned on interleaves
Interleave, duration                    : 33  ms (1.00 video frame)
Interleave, preload duration            : 500  ms
newest mpeg:
Code:
General
Complete name                            : C:\Users\BT\Desktop\test 2222.mpg
Format                                  : MPEG-PS
File size                                : 169 MiB
Duration                                : 2 min 21 s
Overall bit rate mode                    : Variable
Overall bit rate                        : 10.1 Mb/s

Video
ID                                      : 224 (0xE0)
Format                                  : MPEG Video
Format version                          : Version 2
Format profile                          : Main@Main
Format settings                          : BVOP
Format settings, BVOP                    : Yes
Format settings, Matrix                  : Default
Format settings, GOP                    : M=3, N=18
Duration                                : 2 min 21 s
Bit rate mode                            : Variable
Bit rate                                : 9 476 kb/s
Width                                    : 720 pixels
Height                                  : 480 pixels
Display aspect ratio                    : 4:3
Frame rate                              : 29.970 (30000/1001) FPS
Standard                                : NTSC
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                      : 4:2:0
Bit depth                                : 8 bits
Scan type                                : Progressive
Compression mode                        : Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                      : 0.915
Time code of first frame                : 00:00:00:00
Time code source                        : Group of pictures header
GOP, Open/Closed                        : Open
GOP, Open/Closed of first frame          : Closed
Stream size                              : 160 MiB (94%)

Audio
ID                                      : 189 (0xBD)-128 (0x80)
Format                                  : AC-3
Format/Info                              : Audio Coding 3
Commercial name                          : Dolby Digital
Muxing mode                              : DVD-Video
Duration                                : 2 min 21 s
Bit rate mode                            : Constant
Bit rate                                : 384 kb/s
Channel(s)                              : 2 channels
Channel layout                          : L R
Sampling rate                            : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate                              : 31.250 FPS (1536 SPF)
Bit depth                                : 16 bits
Compression mode                        : Lossy
Stream size                              : 6.46 MiB (4%)
Service kind                            : Complete Main

Menu
-- merged --

I sincerely think I have some settings incorrect. The quality is noticeably less and i have 2 pictures here to show what I mean about the pictures appearing a physical different size in VLC. I put physical measurements from the edge my monitor to the edge of the video, as you can see in the attachments. When I used Avidemux to take a 640x480 AVI to MPEG-2, the size came out the same on the resulting MPEG file. So it seems to happen when starting with a 720x480 AVI. Any ideas would be appreciated.

(samples attached)

-- merged --

found this in an old post from Sanlyn:
"You'll notice that the "aspect ratio" entry states an AR of 3:2. Indeed., the physical frame size 720x480 is a 3:2 aspect ratio. This is because lossless AVI has no "display" aspect ratio flags the way lossy encoded video does, such as DVD or BluRay, etc. A PAL lossles huffyuv AVI at 720x576 would show an aspect ratio of 5:4 (or 1.25:1), even if the original tape played on TV at 4:3"

lordsmurf 09-16-2018 10:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by house141 (Post 56220)
ok, I used 2.5 and the output quality is not the same for me as the newest version. I am sure it is because the settings are all different than the version in the digitalfaq guide on this site and I don't what I am doing, some of the choices are worded different, it looks like the newer versions are made a little user friendly on the terminology.
It's vastly different.
While the 2.6/2.7 encoder should be better, it's just not from my findings.

Quote:
Would AVI vs MPEG-2 cause this to play differently on VLC?
Yes.

Quote:
The quality is noticeably less
This is all about bitrate. The default is meager 2.5mbps, and sometimes the max DVD spec of 9mbps isn't good enough for some content. I'd start with at least double 5mbps for 720x480. For my archival from lossless, I'm often not pleased by anything less than 15mbps.

Quote:
appearing a physical different size in VLC.
found this in an old post from Sanlyn:
"You'll notice that the "aspect ratio" entry states an AR of 3:2. Indeed., the physical frame size 720x480 is a 3:2 aspect ratio. This is because lossless AVI has no "display" aspect ratio flags the way lossy encoded video does, such as DVD or BluRay, etc. A PAL lossles huffyuv AVI at 720x576 would show an aspect ratio of 5:4 (or 1.25:1), even if the original tape played on TV at 4:3"
What you see is 3:2 AVI 720x480 AR/SAR (no DAR) vs 4:3 MPEG DAR (not SAR).

AR = aspect ratio, unqualified/generic use of the term
SAR = storage aspect ratio, qualified/specific use of the term
DAR = display aspect ratio, qualified/specific use of the term

"AR" is confusing, but it's the shorthard that usually only refers to DAR (but not always, hence confusing).


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