Capture desktop specification, hardware suggestions?
Hi everyone,
the digitalization workflow is almost completed. The only missing part is the desktop. I have already ordered some parts:
Yesterday i get an old PC from my friend because she bought a new one and the old one is not needed anymore. She just removed the HDD because of the data. The motherboard has no AGP so it will not fit because ATI AIW 9000 is AGP. There is 1 GB RAM and a CPU. If not else can i use i still have a computer case with power supply. So i need a motherboard, CPU, RAM and HDD. As i read the posts the preferred OS is Windows XP SP2. As far as i remember XP cannot handle more than 4 GB RAM, so i don't need more right? The CPU should be Intel or AMD is also fine and at least 2 Core? But what type? I had Intel Core 2 Duo before, is it good? Or the AMD's dual core processor should i choose? The Quad Core processors are not suggested? I read that the HDD should be separated physically. One for the OS and the capturing and editing programs and the other for the raw materials? What size should they have? The bigger the better? Does RPM counts? SSD will not work in this specification? -- merged -- I made some research yesterday about the motherboards or sometimes written as "mobo". I searched the term "Asrock". The top 5 was like:
All top 5 supports Core 2 Duo processors up to E6700 and X6800. More of them even beyond. All of them have AGP connector and 3-5 PCI connectors. The ConRoe865PE and 775i65G support only DDR (the ConRoe865PE up to 4 GB) and the others DDR and DDR2 maximum 2 GB. All of them have 2 SATA connector, the last one SATAII. There are mentioned an eSata Expansion Kit to get 2 more SATA connector used one PCI. The build should have two SATA HDD - one for OS and one for capture - but we also need an optical drive to burn the materials to DVD. Can it work over IDE ? Or it will be too slow ? I searched them on second hand sites. ConRoe865PE and 775Dual-VSTA didn't find anywhere. 4CoreDual-SATA2 are a lot on eBay. 775i65G i found more of them on eBay, also inland. But i found only one 4CoreDual-VSTA inland. I think i will buy that one. There is a big difference in price between eBay and my local second hand site. On eBay these motherboards costs about $100, but locally i can get the 4CoreDual-VSTA for $20. + shipping. |
Assuming it is "good", the 4CoreDual-VSTA for $20 sounds like a great base to build upon. Pretty much any Core2 Duo or Core2 Quad will provide plenty of power to do the job. My E6700 works fine on my 775Dual-VSTA but then even my 3.06 Ghz P4 works fine too for capture with a 32MB Rage 100 AIW. 2GB ram is the recommended amount and is the max most of these boards can use anyway. Either DDR or DDR2 will work, 2 x 1GB sticks of either, NOT both. You can't mix DDR and DDR2. The 4CoreDual-VSTA has 4 memory slots 2 for DDR and 2 for DDR2. You use one set or the other, not both. DDR2 will be slightly faster but DDR will be fine.
Condition, price and availability will probably drive your choice of CPU and ram, but it should all be quite cheap. I stuck with the E6700 in part because it is a 65W unit and the faster ones were either more money or more power or both. Read up on the supported CPU's for your board here (or whatever) to understand the wide array of CPU options you will have. You'll also need a heatsink for the CPU capable of handling whatever CPU you get. Then go hunting for a CPU. Same thing but simpler for the ram. You may want to find an IDE (parallel ATA) drive to use as the boot drive. Setting up to boot from SATA can be a bit tricky with those VIA SATA ports. I did it but needed to install a floppy just to be able to install the correct SATA drivers while installing Windows XP. I couldn't figure out a better way to do this but maybe there is. Using the IDE for boot gets around this problem. I also had an older IDE optical drive to use for my Windows install. I don't know if it would be possible to do the install from a SATA optical drive. With the right BIOS settings, it might be possible (ATAPI and/or IDE compatibility settings). Just for reference: a passmark comparison of 3 CPU's. I believe the "single thread rating" is more important for capture than the "CPU Mark", but for your board it shouldn't be a problem to find one plenty good for the job. BW |
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Canopus and other options were discussed pretty extensively in your previous threads. There was a lot of information to absorb in those threads but in the end you seemed to want to pursue the AGP/AIW based PC option. http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/vide...hs-minidv.html http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/vide...dedicated.html So what AGP motherboards did you get? Does your friend know their history? Were they still working when he took them out of service? Did you get anything else (CPU, memory, etc.). Try to get your friend to consider it a challenge to revive and get one of his old boards back in service! His/her help could be VERY useful... even if it has to be via texts/email, etc. for now. Stay healthy! BW |
The motherboard is ASROCK 4CORE DUAL-VSTA. I also found more 775i65G R3 but those don't support DDRII only DDR up to 2GB both. DDR is 400 MHz and DDRII is 800 MHz so i would choose DDRII for a little bit higher performance. The AGP connector restrict the motherboard range. Those support only maximum 2 GB RAM (some 4 GB with DDR). You said that ATI AIW cooperate well with Turtle Beach. I also found 4CoreDual-SATA2 on eBay but the 4CORE DUAL-VSTA costs less ($20 against $100) also the shipping is more simple and cheaper. It has only SATA with 1.9 GB/s not 3.0 GB/s for the SATAII but i think for the capturing SATA is enough. I didn't ordered anything yet. I have a computer case with a "modern" motherboard with PCIe (without AGP) and got some motherboards with CPUs, RAMs and heatsinks. On the asrock.com in the supported CPUs there is X6800 that i didn't find anywhere so i searched and found an E6700. Also searching for 2 GB DDRII modules. I don't know that it should be dual channel (2x1GB DDRII modules) or a single. One IDE HDD for OS and one for capture via SATA. Applying the heatsink and done.
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Try this search on eBay "ddr2 pc5300 1gb -(sodimm, laptop)" Just to be sure, you probably don't want "server" memory though it might work. Quote:
Further processing? That will be up to you to decide what format(s) you'll need to watch or distribute the videos as you want. That's another deep subject that I'm not really qualified to provide guidance on. The AGP AIW does give you decent direct to MPEG options if you don't want to do much restoration or editing. Check out the various guides on the site for more info. BW |
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May want another 1x PCI for SATA/eSATA PCI card. Quote:
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In general, smaller (even IDE) drive for OS is fine. Large 2tb for capture files. Quote:
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And BTW, if one of the boards doesn't work, it does NOT validate your friend's idea of "old tech = poopy". What it truly means is that either (a) he stored components that were alerady broken long ago, even if he claims "it was fine" (because human memories suck), or (b) he stored it in lousy conditions, subjected to heat, humidity, dirt, rat feces, or whatnot. The odds of a well-stored motherboard mysteriously fizzling out is minimal and unusual. Quote:
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Great example: all those modern cars that come with auto shutoff. ARGH! &%$@&!!!! Not, at all, an upgrade. Certainly not something user requested!!! |
I just revisited my thread because didn't get any notification for a long time. I answered lordsmurf's comment but now it lost. I did everything just the same as before (quotes, picture in the attachment). Somebody deleted it? I am not nervous just curious what happened. Did i something wrong? No notification that telling me i violate one of the forum rule or something. I would be more careful if i know what did i wrong? Not allowed to attach picture about capture cards or did i insult somebody?
:depressed: |
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Are you sure it posted? Or are you sure it was posted in this thread, and not another? Check your past posts from your profile page: http://www.digitalFAQ.com/forum/members/cortez.html |
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I waited with this reply because today the ATI AIW card with the purple box arrived. So all the capture cards are ready i just need to put them into a machine.
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PS.: I thought my reply lost because i watched it only in preview. The only reasonable answer because i didn't use preview before and forgot to post it later. |
I have been using SSD's for my XP Pro SP2 capture boxes for over a year without issue.
There is a ton of debate online about using SSD's with XP. I myself like using the SSD for the OS and use a 2TB Seagate for capture. There are some caveats: 1) Get an SSD that has software that is able to be used in XP. There are not many but there are some. Those programs have TRIM schedulers built into them that you can utilize. 2) Format the drive on a Win 7 or higher machine before installing OS. 3) You may have to slipstream AHCI drivers during XP OS install. Multiple ways to accomplish this effectively. The easiest is finding a motherboard that has AHCI built in and is capable of running in IDE mode. 4) You have to setup the OS to run the SSD effeciently. Many, many links online to optimize SSD's for a particular OS. Just giving you some options. |
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Thanks for the options but it sounds like risky to me. |
My :2cents: follows:
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Alternatively, you could keep searching for a 4CoreDual-SATA2 until you find one. Putting your capture 2TB HDD in an eSATA enclosure will simplify moving files to another PC for transfer or final processing and storage on something other than your capture drive. Discussion on eSATA enclosures, etc. Quote:
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List of Core 2 CPU's, features, power consumption, etc. List of supported CPU's for 4CoreDual-VSTA Among the officially supported CPU's the E6700 still looks like a sweet spot to me. If someone else can verify unofficial support of a later, faster CPU it might be worth trying. YMMV as they say. Quote:
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BW |
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What does YMMV mean? :question: "Your Mileage May Vary" :hmm: |
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That is far superior to any mechanical drives. |
@Cortez: "What does YMMV mean?:question: "Your Mileage May Vary" :hmm:"
Yes. Sorry for any confusion. I've been looking through Via and Intel chipset information to see if I could really understand what was the best choice for SATA drive compatibility and speed. It's confusing and there is probably no right answer. What I've found MIGHT lead one to conclude that the 4CoreDual-SATA2 was worth spending more for vs. the 4CoreDual-VSTA. As others have said, the extra spped should be nice. But it might also be more compatible with later drives which is probably more important. Still the 4CoreDual-VSTA can be made to work quite adequately... As for as I can tell, neither the 4CoreDual-VSTA or any Intel 865 based motherboard actually support SATA2. But it seems the Intel chipset is more likely to be "compatible" with later SATA standards, especially SATA3. But compatibility does not mean faster, just more likely to work reliably, but at SATA1 speed - at best (as I understand it). Of the two Via based options (4CoreDual-SATA2, and 4CoreDual-VSTA), it would seem logical to think that the later chipset in the 4CoreDual-SATA2 would be more likely to better support SATA3. But no guarantees. The reason that is important is that all new HDDs and SSDs are SATA3, supposedly backwards compatible with SATA2 and SATA1. Here's a thread that discusses some of this. To really understand it you'll need to read up extensively about the different chipsets (Southbridge versions, esp.) and also read lots of old posts about people complaining about not getting theoretical SATA1 speeds out of their new SATA1 drives, etc. Maybe NJRoadfan or someone could provide more clarity. BW |
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Back to the SATA Expansion PCI card. How should i imagine that? A card connected to the motherboard's PCI slot and has two SATA connectors? So if i use an eSata drive to move my files to another computer i have to remove the computer case's side panel to remove the drive? Using screwdriver and other tools? In that case does it matter if i unplug the SATA cable from the Expansion card or directly from the motherboard then remove the screws? It provides two more connector to SATA drives. This is the main function? |
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I have some news.
I ordered the 4CoreDual-SATA2. Within only 3 days it arrived from Poland to Hungary. Very impressive. The wrapping (packaging) was professional with bubble foil and styrofoam pads. Unfortunately some pins are deformed (front panel pins) but nothing else. What i noticed that on the motherboard at the SATA connectors the text is only SATA 1 and SATA 2, not SATA II_1 and SATAII_2 as i saw on the official site pictures. The type is visible on the picture and i think it is a REV 2.0 but the SATA text is still confusing me. What is the explanation behind this? Should i test with some tools when it will work? What is the next step? Now i can replace the motherboard in the computer case and using the 1 GB RAM module for start, later i will buy another 1 GB. Can somebody suggest me an unofficial supported CPU list to experiment with it? Starting from the top with a high end CPU ? |
The detailed information about the rev. level, etc. is the small text just below the model number text: 4CoreDual-SATA2. Can't read it in your photo.
Overall it looks like it's more likely to be a SATA2 than VSTA board. I'm sure there were small differences in the exact labeling of the boards as they went through various production runs. I can't help with "unsupported" CPU ideas. Going with something officially supported to start would be my choice but that's up to you. I'd recommend doing some Googling and video watching on the basics of "How to build a PC". That will answer a lot of your questions on the details of building a PC. Most will be about gaming PC's and newer systems but the basics are the same. Here's a start: https://www.intel.com/content/www/us...gaming-pc.html Be careful regarding static electricity. Also, be sure to match the "standoffs" that support the motherboard in the case to the actual screw-holes in the motherboard. Remove any extras (if there are any) or move them to where they are needed for your motherboard. You absolutely do not want an extra standoff to short out some component on the motherboard. Be extra careful of the "pins" of the CPU socket on the motherboard. Don't bend any... Installing the CPU will protect the pins from then on. It's often easier to assemble some components to the motherboard before installing it in the case, but you still need to be able to access the motherboard mounting screws as it's installed so that isn't always possible. Still, doing some "dry run" assembly outside the case could be useful just to get the "feel" for how things install. It might also help understand what order of installation will work best. For instance, sometimes you need to install the ram before the CPU heatsink, etc. BW |
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