DVD recorders (LSI chips) in capture system?
 

Hey please help to arrange the puzzle!

My system has Panasonic NV-FS200 and ATI Wonder 600 USB. Maybe one day i'll try to grab one TBC-1000 from ebay if the price is good.
What I dont understand is what place takes dvd recorders (lsi chips) in workflows!?
For what is used ? Does it replace ati600usb as final destination or it can be used as a passthrough (just to clean the image) and then capture the signal with Vdub?

What is better -to use it as passing through , or record direct on the disc? There are some models with HDD. In what file type they record the video on the hdd? VOB+folders? Or TS, Mpeg?

If necessary I'll take one DVDR again (I already did but it was NTSC, so i never included in my workflow). Can you please recommend me dvd recorder model supporting PAL. i'm located in Europe.

How good is Panasonic DMR-ES10, and what else can you recommend supporting PAL?

Are these possible?
VCR -> DVDR -> ATI600USB - Vdub
VCR -> DVDR -> TBC -> ATI600USB - Vdub

Thanks
Alex

edit: I just so ... yes i can be used as pass thru, and its doing kind of tbc feature...not the same but....also ES10 is very good model

DVD rec orders can be used to record VHS directly to DVD, especially if you're fond of low-quality transfers and espcailly if you don't intend to do any editing or restoration. With this noisy method, what you see is what you get. Try to to do "restoration" and you'll mend up with crap when recording to lossy codecs. The cleanest results can be had using recorders that have LSI chips. Will it look as good as a fully lossless restoration using good components? No way.

A few legacy recorders are used as pass-thru between player and other components for the line-tbc effect. There is also a nominal but not very powerful frame-level sync, but it won't defeat copy protection errors. Most DVD recorders don't work for pass-thru, and most of those that can be used don't have very good tbc's. The ES10 and ES15 are proven performers. If you want to spend time and money trying others, you don't have to take our word for it.

The main benefit of LSI is chroma NR (removes red/blue misty chroma noise that is present on all VHS tapes), along with better VBR bitrate allocation both intra and inter on the GOP.

The minimum goal for tape transfer is to not look worse that the tape did. Most DVD recorders fail at this, making DVDs that are vastly worse than the original source tapes.

The ideal goal is to make a tape look "better" (as good as the original signal actually is, not simply viewed as crappy as a low-end VCR makes it be) when capturing/transferring. Therefore good VCR to full extract the quality signal, and some required TBC processing so the capture can happen. And using a good capture card that also doesn't degrade it from the tape.

I use JVC LSI recorders on hobby content, mostly my own VHS/S-VHS recordings from TV. Quality of the source is good, the newly made DVD is better. sanlyn is correct, a long process would yield better results. But for that source, it's somewhat wasted effort for minimal returns.

Non-TV homemade camcorder tapes almost always need lossless capturing. At very least, non-DVD high bitrate MPEG specs (and preferably 4:2:2 when available).

LSI recorders cannot be used as TBC(ish) passthrough. Passthrough is a function that is available on a very few DVD recorders, generally only ES10/15 units (and maybe some HDD models of the same specs; not ES20/25/etc generations).

PAL has an ES10 model, I have one for my PAL workflow -- for anti-tearing, not as TBC(ish).

Here is my answer from anoher post on this forum.

There are threads with list of all suggested DVD recorders with Lsi chips.... as i understand only a few of them are good options. It is normal that these dvdR cannot replace TBC's...

First i checked JVC drm10 but there is only S-video Out ...
Panasonic ES-10 has s-video in/out. - looks as the best option,nobody tells better model for now.

After all can we say that if there is NO TBC device in the workflow, DVD Recorder (lsi chips) is definitely MUST HAVE ? Yes if its specific model that is proven!

i bought ES10 in very good condition. here are some examples with/without es10 passthrough.