That's right :!:
And I suggest all the people of that forum that are visiting this site now, to take a good look what's being hosted there. It's all external ideas from this site, and many other excelent sites. Not one original (and professional!) idea is being created there. Just sit, and think about that for a moment :roll:

-kwag

So do I. At the beginning of my page ------ I wrote: DCD-Templates based on KVCD-Templates. There I uploaded my modified Templates with my lable.

Now I created a matrix. I mixed it up. 50% it is still notch.

In my guides everyone will read "kwags script" or "KVCD-Script".

As I upload "my" CCE Guide, I too didn't in the beginnig add credits for vmesquita and all who helped him to "my" Guide. If you, jim, now read my guide, you'll see that I noticed him and kwag now twice in one guide.

If I didn't add this, it dosn't matter, because I handle with KVCD-Templates and somewhere in my page I wrote this.

But it is even better if You give them respect, who did the whole work.

look at the top of my guide in the "needed list" you can read
KVCD AviSynth Script (CopyRight by Kwag)
...
etc.

@ Jim
pleasure to meet you Jim!
:wink:

:ideasmiley:
what do you think?
when you develp something new,
came here and post about this and the date will be the proove.

when someone here develop something new,
we post in your forum but i need your promisse,
:arrow: don't delete our post ok? :roll:
let the date in "peace" !...we will do something "new" first!
:lol: :hihi:

"don't mistake my poor english with my clear intentions."
:lol: :rotf: :hihi:

ps:
it's not personal, is the kvcd team opinion!
:lol: :lol:

so what do you think?
Dear Kwag,
maybe even you should stop flaming us.
Was it your idea to use vbr or was it from motion picture expert group?
Have you *stolen* it, or have you just used it?
Using vbr and mpeg1/2 is the only similarity of both systhems.
If someone in the MVCD Forum asks: "I have found this great xyz-Tool in the KVCD Forum, is it possible to use it with MVCD?" i see no reason to close the thread. Is this unprofessional?
It looks childish to say"But they are unprofessional ...and in the past ..."
as "incredible" sayed:
Just sit, and think about that for a moment
I drive my car with no stolen parts, and without a bad certain

Excuse me my friend, but VBR applies to audio, video, MP3, etc. It's not "Patented" or "Registered". Period. So, case closed on that issue :!: Yeah, right. Well' we're talking now about intellectual property. User guides, who have been developed by some fellows here, and are now "appearing" at MVCD, like original work :!:
That's what this issue is about. Could you point me to that thread :?:
Because I don't mind Anyone using our tools. That's what they were made for :!:
But I do mind people ripping other people (like mole), and presenting work as if it was their own. That's what this is all about. I would re-write that: "We are all ONE-CD-Sincere-MOVIE-users" at KVCD.Net, who are being ripped off by "ONE-CD-unprofessional-MOVIE-users" at molevcd. Mind you, not all, but only the ones who are aware of mole's practices and continue to harvest his piracy :!: Yes, you really should sit back, and think what you are saying. As the way I see it, you are on the MVCD side, even though you are aware of ALL the practices that have been going on since the start of mole's first posts in this forum, and then starting MVCD with all our ideas and methods.
Just think about it ...
As for the flame, I'm very sorry, but as I said before: MoleVCD has been marked for life as a dirty sheep. There's no way out, and no matter how good (or bad) MVCD is, it will always carry the mark of piracy and stealing practices. As for us here at KVCD.Net, we are clean, as our ideas have been originally developed (scripts/software/techniques), and we don't need to look behind our backs, with a guilty conscious. And we PROUDLY give credit to developers and everyone who contributes. That's the mark of a gentleman, and that's the difference and attitude of all the people here at KVCD.Net.

-kwag

lol.. sorry :)
but here starts the philosophic part.. like
has Microsoft stolen the idea of windows at ATARI-GEM?
has atari/Digital Research stolen the idea of its GEM at Apple?
has apple stolen the idea of using a mouse by .. whereever..
and now Windows appears like original Work. Is Microsoft the "dirty Sheep"?

the only thing you may think that i may have done wrong is that i gave my work and my templates to the mole comunity.
ok, at that point i am guilty

Yes :!:, hell, they've stolen the GUI from Apple, who stole the ideas from Parc Place :lol: No, they didn't :!: Yes, again, they storel the ideas from Parc Place. All the time :mrgreen:
And now they "Wanna be like MAC's AQUA", with the new LongHorn :!:
Yes, they steal, and that's why they're always in court :!: Shame on you :compress: (just kidding!)
But then again, it's your original work, and you didn't take it from anyone. And that is priceless ;)

-kwag

:roll:

singing:
we will, we will
:arrow: "Roc" you :!:

Man Roc, You're a good man! Come over! :wink: Back to the roots!!!!

so the topic is someone has stolen cce templates...

i didn't stole anything from avalon

in his fourm he posted the thread new templates on 09.08

I posted my guide with my templates on the 09.07

2 month earlier

and avalon do you have the copyright of creating cce templates...
i think no..

so have a nice day

@kwag: stop saying mvcd guys are stealing your stuff... you know tht it isn't true! We have our own matrix and that was it! It has nothing to do with your stuff! This silly hate of everything with a name like mvcd is extremely childish!

If this tutorial was taken from this board ok... but that wasn't the mvcd crew! we can't control our members like you can't control your members saying stupid things about mvcd without having any clue what they are talking about!

Avalon does a great job! The MVCD Crew reacted at Avalons protest and now? Shall we meet and battle? This is exactly the way your members present theirselves ...

Thats exactly what I do also in the Guides there. I do show the people from where the aplication is, I do tell the people who spend the time by programming Utilities like Moviestacker or TOK, .... everybody can check my Guides just for proofing. Like the TOK mod. You also can modify it by using a standard TMPEGenc based matrix or GOPs ... its just a very good aplication to receive an optimal CQ value.

Right! And thats how we should see te Situation now! We do use them. I sometimes quote Kwag in some postings, cause he began with the ONE CD Idea (well I think so). And thats why I made the comparison to the CAR and its type of gas-brand. Do you understand now what I meant by using this comparison.

But the situation which started this Thread is that at MVCD nobody thaught (and thats true) that there could be something misunderstanding or even stolen. Kwag, would you check every Thread from a "member" (not a mod or an admin) in KVCDs Board if it could contain something wich appear to be stolen? At the MVCD board it was not seen and so it was a mistake to let this Guide online.
ROC already apologized for it.

So please try to forget the time where something was stolen! The Idea of the MVCD Members NOW like me or especially roc is not to see WHERE we can get stuff, we just try to get best results with the 2.5 Template ... shure.. both Templates got their advantages. Thats why I communicate at both boards.
At MVCD Board, now they make the same stuff with different templates.
I dont know what happened exactly in the past. When I met the MVCD Board a short time ago it was just interesting what these 2.5 templates will offer in quality.
For me at this moment the 2.5 templates appeared totally different. But there are also Jobs on the other side where KVCDs Templates do offer better quality (like the KDVD Template). ok.

There should be no battle .... only 2 different types of templates and the Programs we use to obtain max. possible quality on one CD.

Kwag you said, "Dime con quien andas, y te dire quien eres"..."Tell me who you hang out with, and I'll tell you who you are" ...Si tiene razon!. ok Now I know people like mods at the MVCD Board who are doing jobs with the 2.5 Templates! They do not steal anything, they are helpful, they got knowledge like roc and its very interesting to communicate with them, and to figure out how we can obtain a maximum of quality by going NEW ways. Thats also the reason why I said "yes" when they asked me a short time ago if I could also be a member of the moderator circle. At the beginning when I was only a member with for example 2 Posts written by myself it was complicatet and I had my own experiences like CQ encoding ... Kwag, you remember the Message I send to you, by asking you whats the best way to eplain the advantage of CQ? I quoted you there, you know as I also still do now. And others there also.

In the future it would be very nice if we could communicate all together, someones do use 2.5 Templates and the other do use KVCD templates, but we try to go the same way .... I give you a hand! And others at the MVCD board with no thief instinkt too.

What you don't seem to be grasping (or are conveniently overlooking), is that Mole originally STOLE Kwag's Notch Matrix without giving him any credit, and CALLED IT HIS OWN WORK!!!!! This is documented and true! Then, some people finally found out about the Mole's deceptive ways, and warned him to give credit to Kwag for his work. It was only after being caught, that MVCD then came out with a newer, slightly modified matrix, so that they could say it was "different" :roll: . But we all know that it was still originally based upon Kwag's work, and Mole probably never would have known how to come up with something like that from scratch.

So sorry DasSchaf, but the history of MVCD is based upon stealing other peoples' work....this may (according to you) no longer be the case today, but originally, it was...and this all could have been avoided if Mole had simply given credit to Kwag in the beginning, rather than stealing it and calling it his own! And that is a "scarlet letter" that will forever be branded upon MVCD, whether or not you see this as being fair today :roll: .

When someone takes freeware, changes the GUI a little bit, and then sells it for profit, don't you think that it is illegal, or immoral? Most people would say yes. Look at how many ripoffs their are of programs like DVD-Shrink....do you think it is okay for people to steal the code and sell it for profit? If you answered no, then you should also understand why people here at kvcd.net will never respect MVCD as being legitimate. The question "What came first, the chicken or the egg?" is much more difficult to answer than the question "What came first, KVCD or MVCD?". KVCD came first! And MVCD is basically mimicking KVCD and changing very little to make itself unique in any way, so there's really not much point in MVCD even existing. Most people who want excellent quality on 1 cd will always first turn to KVCD....only unlucky, misinformed, unaware people who only speak german would likely ever use MVCD.

And it's fine that MVCD users (at least, the ones who don't know any better) are using the great programs that are created here at KVCD.net, but why aren't there any original MVCD programs? Why is everyone at the MVCD forums using all of the methods and programs that are available here at KVCD.net? It's because everyone from MVCD comes here to KVCD.net first to see the latest and greatest innovations in 1-cd encoding...and then they bring them back to the MVCD forums. :roll: Maybe some of the MVCD team should create some useful MVCD programs (based on their own ideas), rather than always coming here for their inspiration :!: Why shouldn't all the MVCD members (and uninformed newcomers) just cut out the middleman and come directly to KVCD.net since you're really not providing anything unique there, other than a slightly modified version of Kwag's Notch Matrix and maybe a few template changes? MVCD is basically a german carbon-copy of KVCD with very few differences...and you "borrow" most of the techniques developed here....so why does MVCD even exist?. Most people who have compared report that quality of KVCD is better anyways...plus KVCD was here first!

As soon as I hear about an entirely original MVCD program created solely by MVCD members used to create MVCDs, then I will give your argument some small degree of merit. But until then, it seems to me that you and your "team" need to do some programming (but I truly hope you don't just change Tok or ACP and call it your own! :roll: Only time will tell). Creating your own programs instead of linking to or modifying ours would probably be a good start towards making MVCD a little bit more reputable in some peoples' eyes (but I'm affraid you will likely never change the minds of those who know the history of MVCD...this would take some serious work).

The fact is friend, most of us do know what we're talking about. Look at the history. It doesn't really matter if you changed things around since then...MVCD started out on the wrong path by stealing. Even your current "unique" MVCD Matrix should at least probably say the words "Based in part on Kwag's KVCD Notch Matrix" somewhere on it since I highly doubt that whoever "created" your current MVCD Matrix never even looked at Kwag's Matrix one time before or during "developmental" stages. :roll:

Normally the members of KVCD.net are an extremely friendly, thoughtful and open-minded group of individuals. :idea: But maybe we present ourselves slightly differently here when someone wrongs one of us by stealing ideas without giving proper credit (as Mole did for certain, and now possibly this Jim person has done as well). At the very least, can you really blame us if we hear someone claim something bad about MVCD and then we assume that "it's probably true"? Afterall, it has happened before....and you (Mole) have nothing to blame for your "scarlet letter" but your prior actions....it's not our fault Mole was a thief.

If you really want to show that MVCD is legitimate and has some actual merit of its own, then why don't you just remove all links and references of KVCD and every single program or guide that was originally developed at KVCD.net from your board? Tell your members they will be banned if they post or ask about programs other than the unique ones that the MVCD team has developed themselves, if any of these actually exist. (and even if you do develop a unique MVCD program, I can almost guarantee that you would NEVER see any kvcd.net members using it....wonder why? :roll: Because we don't snoop around your forums! But then again, why would we?...afterall, much of the content on your site originates from KVCD.net anyways, so it would be rather pointless for us to visit your website, now wouldn't it? :lol: ).

This kind of bickering almost never happens here unless provoked, and we really don't care too much for it, so rather than continuing to sucker us in and wasting your breath here proclaiming of MVCD's innocence, uniqueness, or value, please just go about your business back at the mole hole and have a nice day,

:wavey:
-d&c

@incredible: your olive-branch peace offering is a nice attempt (and I commend you for being a responsible person who gives credit where credit is due), but I'm affraid that no amount of apologizing or sweet-talk is going to change what happened, so it is probably best to just let KVCD and MVCD co-exist seperately, and not try to say that they should be considered equals who should try to work together. As long as people don't steal ideas or works without giving proper credit, then a general tolerance of each other should be possible to some degree at least...but this history runs deep and probably won't be so easily forgotten. This thread has probably now run its course and both sides should probably just agree to disagree, while staying out of each other's business unless new copyright issues should arise. At least, that is my feeling.

Note: I changed the title to "KVCD vs. MVCD : Round 199203: The CCE Idea".

--------------------

I can speak very good german. So I traveled around the MVCD-Forum. It took 1 hour or so. There was nothing what I hadn't known before! All was Rip-Offs of KVCD-Forum.

Some People will blame me for DCD-Templates. In the first Template I used Notch-Matrix. On my first "Retail-Box" was written: "Jetzt mir Notch-Matrix von KVCD.NET". Yes I did it! The Templates are MODs of KVCD. If You'll open now a DCD-Package it will show You this:

or this:

So I add all credits to "my" work.

It is so simple. Look at my page and You'll see that I've since today a mirror page of vmesquita's. Think about it!!!

@ dazed&confused
I dont believe that you know what you are talking about.
bullshit
as you may notice... I, and no one earns money by sharing the mvcd-templates
I do, so cool down
1. There are not that much programmers in the MVCD-Community as in the KVCD-Community, this says nothing about the Quality, this has just regional reasons, and why should i invest time to reprogram Kwags great tools? I never testet them, but if anyone like them, why should't he?
2. Most people (me to) are happy with the results they get if they use tmpgenc, load the templates .. maybee change the cq a little ore change to 2pass and click the "run" button
.... but i think you never testet this
To me it look that your oportunity is to flame around a litle, isnt it?

Maybe you shoult read what kwag wrote:
so cool down
@ avalon: hetzer wie dazed&confused sind der Grund, warum ich mich hier nicht richtig wohl fühle :cry:

First in some point of views you are right, .... well I don't know the time at MVCD before the 2.5 Matrix (which is def. not based on KVCD) came out.
I only see both communities NOW. My intention is to help (there, here and everywhere I can and with the copyrighters of the originals mentioned) and to get experiences from here, there and everywhere ... as everybody with experiences does.

BUT this "battle" here is only based on a antipathic view in case of the past of MVCD, ... ok in some cases I understand. But your arguments as show above aren't really objective.
You say, from your point of view here could be a first chance of "forgiving" if they delete everything which links to KVCD net in the MVCD Board???
Man really, .... if you would be the author of such a program ... ok, but YOU also ONLY USE this programs, which of these programs did you author that give you the right to flame like this. Kwag said, he don't mind who uses theese programs.
So, what would be if someone uses TOK at Doom9.de to show how everybody can do a CQ prediction with standard TMPEGEnc settings like GOP, matrix and so on?? Do you would also tell him to kill the links and modifications??
You are here in this Famlily this family gots his experiences about MVCD in the past, ok.. I understand.

I talk for myself, so I want to communicate at both boards, even more boards ... just to get and give experiences. My home is where I can talk to People which are able to talk to me, people with experiences and people with less experiences so I can help them ...... and where the idea is to reach the mpeg limits with the experiences we all have. I get inspirations from everywhere combinet (yes) with thngs I see here and somewhere else.

As roc said ... yes you're a bigger community including the possiblity to have softwaredesigners as members (all over the world). At MVCD they don't have, ... but IF I would totally agree with your point of view .... every kind of software we use from the outside of a community should bring us problems like this ... even here at KVCD.

Example: When i lived in South America sometime I had to return to germany :cry: I went to my freinds, told them about those delicious Arepas they have in Venezuela. Wow ... lets try to make them here also ... and so I tried to get the ingredients to make my own Arepas de Pollo ... aqui en alemania! :lol:
Then I visited my friends Venezuela again in vacations and told them that I showed the people in germany how good and delicious YOUR Arepas are.
Ok ... and thats's the point ... I didn't told them in Germany theese Arepas are my invention but I told them from where they are.
So the Friends in Venezuela got very amused and where fascinated about it that they in germany also like Arepas !!! YEAH and they do!!! :D
And they don't tell me ... please stop showing them OUR recipes of Arepas.

But I think we here have only the Problem with a Name called "MVCD and its past" and not with Links to KVCD in another Board. Maybe its true and the past will never get out of someones minds .... but I still hope so .. cause both communities (and all other communities too) got friendly members, people with experiences .... and one day ... we can also turn ONE CD in ONE AREPA just by using another matrix in TMPEGEnc ..... this would be like "Christmas" to me ;-)

Take care .. all of you.
There's no battle just a bad experience.


PS: Avalon, was willst du mit deiner Thread Umbenennung bewirken?
Dass man all dies nicht zu ernst nehmen sollte? Wenn ja, dann sehe ich dies auch so ... ;-)

What planet do you live in, Ehh :!:. You're obviously someone uninformed, who doesn't know mole's background, or you are on his side, and you KNOW all the things mole did. Maybe not now. But mole DID steal our original matrix, never gave credits, and used it for a LOOOONG time. What part of that don't you understand :?:
That makes mole and MVCD a "dirty rotten site". PERIOD :!: The only child here is mole and all his followers, who continue to visit molevcd.de, knowing it's background. You damn right we can, and they get their ass kicked out of here in a flash :!:
That's what distinguishes KVCD.Net from other sites.

-kwag

@incredible,

Sorry, but I agree 100% with dazed&confused post :!:

-kwag

Deutsch (Germans talking too much. I must ever explain it with many sentences :wink: ):

Ich hab den Thread nur umbenannt, weil ich Roc einen Gefallen tun wollte. In manchen seiner Threads hasste er das Wort "Gestohlen".

Ok. Ich wars ja, der mit dem Thread angefangen hat. Ich fand es einfach nicht richtig, das meine und vmesquita's (natürlich auch die von allen, die Ihm geholfen haben) Ideen einfach als Jim's hingestellt werden.

Jim, ich weis nicht wie Du drauf gekommen bist. Da Du noch in der Schule bist kann Ich verstehen, dass Du gerne spickst. Aber warum nimmst Du einfach Arbeiten von anderen und stellst diese als Deine dar?

Vmesquita und seine Freunde (speziäl new_bee) haben Ihm geholfen, das mit CCE erst auf die Beine zu stellen, lange bevor "Deine" Anleitung entstand. Wenn Du den Thread lesen würdest (ich denke immer noch, dass Du durch diesen erst draufgekommen bist) wirst Du feststellen, das ich nur 4 Posts gemacht hatte, bevor ich meine Anleitung schrieb.

New_bee hat vmesquita's Anleitung 1:1 ins Deutsche übersetzt. Ich hab erst später damit angefangen. Ich teste meine Einstellungen immer bevor ich was online stelle. Desswegen hat es so lang gedauert, bis meine Anleitung fertig war. Zuerst gab's sie als Deutsch. Danach erst hatte ich sie in Englisch geschrieben.

Ich hab auch ein bisschen was auf die Nase bekommen, weil ich anfangs die Credits nicht in die Anleitung eingebaut hatte. Es ging um die DCD-Templates 6.0.0.0, welche 1:1 vmesquita's Templates waren. Nur, dass ich sie für die Version CCE 2.67 geschrieben hatte.

Das ich sie DCD genannt hatte hat ein Paar hier gestöhrt, was ich auch verstehe. Danach hab ich ja das auch geändert. Damit aber alle was von meinem Wissen haben schrieb ich die nächste Guide. Somit konnten nun alle Templates für CCE 2.67 und eigentlich alle anderen Versionen erstellen, weil ich Ihnen den Weg beschrieben hatte.

Ich bin immer noch der Meinung, dass Du somit erst die Templates erstellen konntest.

Warum ich eigentlich hier im Forum mich wohl fühle ist, dass ich weis, dass ich hier bei dem Original bin. Ich hab mich für die Film-auf-eine-CD-Sache wegen eines AVCD-Films befasst, den ich aus dem Netz gezogen hatte.

Die Seite Chip hostet ja die MVCD Templates. Aber wenn ich in Google "TMPGEnc Templates" eingebe lande ich immer zuerst bei KVCD.Net. Somit hab ich mir das Board näher angesehen.

Erst danach bin ich auf die MVCD Seite gegangen. MVCD 2.5 ist schön und gut, ruckeln aber bei mir. Desswegen bin ich dem auf den Grund gegangen. Und siehe da, die Einstellungen von 2.5 können garnicht funktionieren. Als ich dies behoben hatte, hatte ich ein KVCD-Template. Somit bin ich flux zu KVCD.net gegangen und hab mich dort angemeldet.

So jetzt kennt jeder meinen Hintergrund, warum ich für KVCD bin. Wenn man bei dem Original bleibt hat man erst garnicht solche Probleme, die im MVCD-Forum auftauchen.

Ich hab den Thread von Jim gelesen. Und ich fand es einfach lachhaft! Alle Probleme, die auftauchten wurden in KVCD besprochen. Ihr MVCDler seit halt einfach Lade-Template-klick-auf-Run-Typen. Von AVS versteht Ihr fast nichts (es gibt natürlich auch Ausnahmen).

Es gibt überall Hetzer. Man soll halt nicht auf sie hören. Weil wer viel schreit kann nicht zubeissen. Man kann sich auf jede Lautstärke anpassen. Falls sich irgendwas sich immer wiederholt kann es passieren, dass man es dann einfach überhört, weil es immer da ist.

Hock Dich an den Bahnhof und hör den Zügen zu. Irgendwann meinst Du, das Du am Meer bist, weil sich die Geräusche sich ständig wiederholen, wie das Plättschern des Wassers am Strand.

Wer auf Hetzer hört ist selber Schuld.

--------------------------------------------------------------------

English (simple and easy to get to the point :roll: ):

So at all. I'm fighting for KVCD and I like Originals. The most what I hate are Rip-offs. If somebody what this german huge text translated use google or some other program for this. But I think I can do it for all english-ones in two sentences:

I found AVCD (rip-off of KVCD), traveled around (AVCD-Forum, MVCD-Forum) still I found the KVCD.net. I found out which one the original was and stayed here.

I only have one thing to say

Lang Phasen-KVCD



David

translate: You MVCDler are just Load-Template-click run guys.
YES 99.9% because it works that way. I made a 220 Min mVCD that way,
why should i change something?
So why the excitement if 0.1% trys to use tools and skripts published here at kvcd???
komisch bei zehntausenden von leuten funktionieren die templates. Just one look at the MVCD Forum and you shoult have seen, that, if there is a problem with your Player, you just have to change the vbv settings..

there is no fight at all, just a diskusion.. and if you like Originals, you know that z.B.:alaskas Guide :DVD2MVCD using DVD2SVCD came just 5 days
before your DVD2KVCD using DVD2SVCD guide..
zufall?

If MVCD is that bad, why talk aboud it? Use kvcd and be happy.
Some people drink Pepsi and other people Coca Cola.

Because Pepsi never started their business stealing the Coca formula, and changing it a long time after to say "Hey ! We do not use Coca recipe anynore, stop flamming us."

Edit : Can you ALL please stop talking german in english forums ?
Too lazy for doing it in english ? Okay, just don't post then !

Thank you.

Uh-Oh!

2 days absent and you need 1/2 hour to read what has been posted.

I've always seen MVCD as a "German translation", for people who don't understand English that well and thus can't use the explanations given at KVCD.
I wondered when they suddenly started to claim that they were a project on their own. How can a project be on its own if it constantly quotes (I say quote, not copy) another project? Remove all material by KVCD.net (e.g. Filesize prediction), replace it by your own and you'll be an independent project. No sooner will anyone from KVCD regard you as equal, and not sooner will there be ONE AREPA. (though mmkay-VCD is tempting :lol: )
As long as you don't do that there is no point of a discussion, because our side will not move. Call it whatever you want, I call it headstrong.
And regarding the CCE template: I'm ready to talk about it.

ey avalon sag mal peilstes nicht ?

Ich habe meine Templates 2 Monate vor deinen gepostet siehe MVCD Forum und dein Forum...

Du hast deine Templates am 09.08 geposted ich am 09.07

Also nix geklaute CCE Templates..

So der Guide ist auch nicht geklaut

vmesquita postet seinen Guide am 18.07 ich aber am 09.07 ....

So jetzt darfste dich Fragen wer hier Die Templates geklaut hat..

Und dann noch dreist hier kommen und wieder sturr behaupten MVCD hätte geklaut.

einfach lächerlich

ENGLISH !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Il y a quelque chose que tu n'arrives pas a comprendre dans ce simple mot ?

Jim's post translated:

ey avalon, don't you get it?
i posted my templates 2 months before you did - take a look at MVCD forum and your forum...
you posted your templates on 09.08 and i did on 09.07 [new_bee's note: personally i believe that's 1 month]
so don't you say stolen CCE templates..
therefore the guide ain't stolen either
vmesquita posted his guide on 18.07 but i did on 09.07 ....
now you may ask who of the both of us stole the templates..

now you're cheeky on me and stubbornly claim that MVCD stole the templates.

just riddiculous

__________________________________________________ __________
Jim,

Vmesquita kann nur portugiesisch und englisch, nix deutsch. Er fängt mit eurem deutschem Forum daher eher weniger an.

Und WENN er die Idee von dir hätte (weisz ich nicht), von geklaut kann da wirklich keine Rede sein:

Anderer Modus (2-Pass)
Andere Intra-DC-Precision
Andere Flat Part Priority
Andere GOP
und natürlich andere Matrix

So ziemlich alles anders, was anders sein kann. Soll jetzt nicht heißen, er hätte alles anders gemacht, damit ihr euch nicht beschweren könnt, sondern wir haben uns diese Einstellungen und die zugehörige Filesize Prediction erarbeitet. Wenn du's nicht glaubst, schau mal in den 10-Seiten-Thread direkt unter diesem.

__________________________________________________ __________
Translation:

Jim,

Vmesquita can't speak German, thus there is no reason for him to visit your forum.

And IF he got the idea from you (I don't know), you can't say he's stolen anything:

Different Mode (2-Pass)
Different Intra-DC-precision
Different Flat-Part-Priority
Different GOP
and, of course, different Matrix

Nearly everything that can be different in two templates is different. I don't mean the differences are there so you can't complain, but we worked out the best settings and the Filesize-Prediction ourselves. If you don't believe it, check out the 10-sites-tread right beneath this one.

Thank you for the translations new-bee.

yes,thank you too new_bee!
:wink:

New_bee,

Thanks for your translations and explanations! :D

[]'s
Vmesquita

thx New_bee..

that was what i wantet to read.. so I re-opent Jims thread if this all is sooo different, then nobody (even not Avalon) can say that jims work is stolen.
end of discussion

:blabla:

oh yes, :roll: .....
like MY AVATAR,i did it and was really hard.
the source was pirate(divx) encoded with mvcd template(stoled)
see how the color is perfect....i did it all!
:roll:
is not the same like you did with "your" matrices and templates?

:rotf: :hihi:

Hehe, I should be given the title
"KVCD.net Official German-English Relations & Translation Consultant"

LMAO

+ lol @ jorel's avatar's macroblocks

OK! It is realy funnie here in this board. Talking german and translate this into english for all other people. So Jim's Thread is reopend, I think.

Ok. We know the original

@Roc,

No, not quite yet friend! :wink: I really didn't want to write anything more in this stupid thread about MVCD, but I feel I should correct you and Incredible about some of their misinterpretations and incorrect assumptions you made about my previous post. Perhaps it was due to the language barrier between us or because you used a bad translator (if you spoke english natively or I spoke german then maybe you would have understood my words better). I will try to explain it in simpler English for you if I can, but I don't have the time or desire to keep trying to teach you about what is right or wrong in life :roll: ...you will need to do some soul-searching or take an Ethics class to discover that on your own.

First off, there was no need for you to use profanity Roc. You just as easily could have gotten your point across without breaking forum rules (but then again, you mole folks don't seem too concerned about "rules" or matters of morality, do you? :roll: ). The decent and respectful thing to do for others here would be to edit your post to something more acceptable, even if it is only something like "B.S." or "bullsh*t". Secondly, what I was doing there was making an ANALOGY! Never once did I say that you or Mole or any mole people were earning any money with your templates! You put those words in my mouth, not me :evil: . You missed my point entirely. FYI, here is a dictionary definition of the word "Analogy", just in case you don't recognize it:

As most people could understand, the point I was trying to make in my post was about copyrights and morality and how people should know that it is wrong to steal another person's work and call it their own. The way that some people steal freeware programs, make minor graphical changes, and then pass it off as their own work and sell it for a profit is similarly dishonest and immoral to how Mole stole Kwag's Matrix and called it his own. I can't explain it much simpler than that for you. If you do not know the difference between right and wrong, then I feel sorry for you because you will probably live a difficult life.

Okay, I realize that I may have been wrong here, so for this, I apologize. If you say that you created your MVCD Matrix entirely by yourself without ever looking at Kwag's Notch Matrix (or one of Mole's early ripoffs of Kwag's Matrix) for any guidance whatsoever during development of your matrix, then it is definetly your own unique work and I will believe you and give you the benefit of any doubts.

However, surely you can see how we kvcd.net members are skeptical sometimes about what someone from the MVCD forums might say. I mean, you yourself admit you know about how Mole was a thief of Kwag's work earlier, and yet you still choose to give your support to a known thief by being a moderator and supporter of him and his website? I'm sorry, but in many peoples' eyes this makes you morally irresponsible and just as guilty as Mole himself. If you choose to moderate a known thief's forum while showing no qualms whatsoever about it, then surely you can see how it would be difficult for us to trust your words. Afterall, common sense tells us that if a person willfully and knowingly surrounds himself with thieves, then he himself is more likely to be a thief as well. And in most peoples' opinions, hanging out with known thieves and liars is morally irresponsible behavior. This whole thread started because Avalon said Jim stole his work without giving him credit for it, which is something that has happened in the past here done by the Mole, the administrator of MVCD! So I'm sorry if we tended to believe Avalon more than any MVCD member, but that's just how it is. Have you ever heard the saying "honor among thieves"? Well, the truth is that thieves have no honor, so there is no such thing as honor among thieves.

After I wrote about MVCD not having original content on their site and instead seemingly "borrowing" everything from KVCD.net, you said:
I'm sorry but I honestly don't see what you were trying to say by your Point #2 here. If you're asking whether or not I've ever tested an MVCD template, the answer is NO, and I never will. I will not give my support to a site that is ran by a dishonest thief who supports dishonest practices. I respect Kwag and and value his friendship too much to do such a thing. But I have read about comparisons people have done between KVCD and MVCD, and I've never seen anyone say that MVCD gave them better quality than KVCD....and I don't doubt this if all that you MVCD guys are doing is loading in a template and clicking "go". Maybe I misunderstood your post, but you made it sound like this is what you do, and I'm sorry, but that is something a newbie does. If that is all you do, then I can guarantee that my KVCDs will look better than your MVCDs probably 9 times out of 10...and why can I be so sure? Because KVCD.net is the main place that started all this extreme tweaking, and many of the ideas and programs on your website are "borrowed" from here (or other places), so who knows better how to use these programs than the people on the Forum that originally developed it? And don't confuse my words as Incredible did after my first post....I am not claiming to be a program developer, nor have I ever claimed that. I merely stated that most of "our" (KVCD.net's) programs can be found on your site, without much content of your own.

The only time I do any flaming is when they deserve it! DasSchaf was running his mouth off about things that he obviously had no idea about (or didn't want to admit), as you can plainly see by reading Kwag's very own words to him! So what I said was accurate, and he deserved it. Flaming is very rare here, and it didn't start happening until you Mole supporters popped out of the shadows. But anyone who knows of MVCD's shady history of what Mole did to Kwag and still gives him support is just as bad as Mole himself in most of our minds. So think about that before you post here. Nobody here, especially Kwag, cares to hear anything about MVCD. If we never heard another single thing about MVCDs here, we would be much happier.

@Incredible,

No, I did not say that. You also are confusing my words or trying to put them into my mouth for me. I said nothing about "forgiving" MVCD. You are the one who is trying to get people to forgive a known pirate who
completely disrespected Kwag and his hard work, and never admitted it or had the decency to apologize for being so unscrupulous. You are the one who continues supporting MVCD even though you know it's history and how Kwag feels about it (with good reason!..how would you like it if someone stole your work and put their name on it?...maybe I should start a website tomorrow called D&C-VCD.net and steal Roc's Matrix and call it my own without giving him credit?...do you think that would make him happy or would be okay? No. And I would never do or condone such a thing).

The point I was making when I suggested that the MVCD site should delete all KVCD methodologies and programs that are being used there was that there would barely be anything left on that site if they did this! Meaning that MVCD might want to start focusing more on creating some original content of their own rather than borowing everything that comes from kvcd.net all the time. MVCD might as well change their website to "GermanKVCDclone.net" due to all of "our" content found there (and by "our", I simply mean that it originates from kvcd.net). Doing this would help prove whether MVCD is a true competitor or worthy alternative to KVCD. If MVCD wants to prove its merit so badly and gain respect (from other people who are more willing to forgive Mole's past piracy from Kwag, not most of us from kvcd.net who are unwilling) then coming up with new ideas on their own seems like a logical place to start. Most people can detect a cheap knockoff of something when they look closely enough, and until MVCD has more original content, that is exactly what many people will label them as...a cheap knockoff. And I'm not saying this to be mean now, I'm just telling it like most people here see it.

:roll: Again, your reasoning is flawed or misinformed!

1) Yes, Kwag said he didn't mind anyone who uses the programs of kvcd.net, but what you continue to overlook is that he also said that disrespectful people who knowingly and willfully supports the Mole while knowing exactly what Mole did to Kwag in the past (and both you and Roc fall into this category) are just as bad as Mole himself! So maybe you should think about that the next time you use a program from kvcd.net over at that other website of yours! You don't seem to have enough respect for Kwag to do right by him, and yet you continue to use his work.

2) I never claimed anywhere to be an author or programmer, so please stop trying to put words in my mouth, because I really don't appreciate it. You can tell a person doesn't have much of a valid argument when they start putting imaginary words into someone else's mouth so that they can try to use it against them later. :evil: When I used the word "our" when speaking about "our programs", I was referring to programs that originated from "our" website, KVCD.net. That is what I meant by "our". :roll:

Do I really have to be a programmer to use the word "our" now in my sentences when I speak about kvcd.net? I am a happy member of the kvcd.net family, and as such, this is "our" website, period! My goodness man!...you are actually trying so hard to nitpick through my words to find something to "bust me" with that you tried to focus on my usage of the word "our" and tried telling me that I was calling myself a programmer by using that word :?: :roll: Please...don't try to telling a poster who speaks the primary language that he/she posted in what he/she is or isn't saying, okay? :roll: I promise I won't claim to understand all of the subtleties of your native language either when you write in german.

And the only flaming I did was directed at DasSchaff because he definetly earned it! (and of Mole and his followers who won't admit the truth, because they too have earned it). I find your notion ridiculous that I should need to be a programmer in order to qualify for the right to flame a Mole-supporting noob like DasSchaf who comes here without knowing anything about Mole's true dishonest history and then has the audacity to yell at Kwag about it! As a responsible member of this forum who respects Kwag and values his friendship, I have every right in the world to flame that schmuck!...in fact, I'd consider it a MORAL OBLIGATION for me to speak my mind in Kwag's defense when someone so clearly wrongs him! And I'd do it again for anyone else too who didn't deserve such treatment. But some people clearly don't care much about morals or "doing the right thing" these days, do they? :roll:

I guess I could have just directed you to this:

Bottom Line: Kwag has made his feelings about MVCD crystal clear in this thread for everyone to see! People who support the Mole while knowing about his thieving past will be considered nothing more than common thieves themselves. Shame on you for being so morally irresponsible. Nothing more should need to be said here, and this stupid thread should be considered closed!....either show some respect for Kwag's wishes and beliefs regarding MVCD, or else choose to go someplace else with your guilty conscience.

-d&c

great and wonderful explanations
my dear friend d&c(gentle giant).

i can speak the same like you and i don't need to "quote" your post.
:wink:

ps:
my hint for all in mvcd forum:

Roc without "k" don't "RocK" :!:

:lol:

macroblocks?
oh yes my friend new_bee...:wink:
:secret:
was the mvcd matrices/template used!
....it's normal.
:roll:

:hihi:

my last posting to that:
yes i did look at kwags matrix to make sure, that there are no similarities im both templates.
It was my childish thinking, that even people at kvcd are so close to reality (i do not know what some people here are smoking... leave it) to see, that there is no more reason to fight...as i sayed.. my childish thinking.
My english may sound funny to some people here, yes it is not my native language, but there is no reason to speak to me like to a little child.

We know that we do not use anything stolen from anywhere!
if you are to blind to see, your problem, not mine
good idea .. and you realy believe what you have written there?
all knowledge on earth comes from kwag .. as your simple mind may see it.
if you like to get polemic, i can do this to..

but.. why this all?
I respect kwags work, maybe he is the one who inspired many other people to make XVCDs or XSVCDs (nothig else is it) and get the best out of the 800MB CDR.
All i asked for was to give up flamig us..
.. maybe sometime kwag, dasschaf, incridible, you and me (may i invite mole?) should sit together, drink a beer ore 2 and in less than 5 minutes all discrepancies are cleared.

@Avalon :
sure you can read a Calendar?
@jorel
nice avatar, if you have nothing important to say.. just try to say nothing..
it works...

Yeh! I can read a Calendar ...Backward! :wink:

@ Roc:
only kidding Roc, no bad feelings,
this is not my intention.....only kidding.
:)

i knew about mvcd (maybe in d9,don't remember)when
your site had only one pal template,nothing more if i remember...
i don't test it cos i encode ntsc.
it was last year and believe me,i have it on my hd!
i can search to find the date if you want.
in this time i stay here in kvcd forum and see everything encreasing
in quality with the result of great friends and developers.
every day is better and members are really cool.
for me,Kwag is the best and friendly administrator in the whole world.
the friendhip in this forum don't have price....you can feel it!
see that here,i'm only a "helper" as i call myself.
i can't develop anything!
but of course we could be friends,
we only need to clear the intentions and rights!

best regards!
:wink:

ps:
excuse my poor english!