Help with Apex AD-1500 skipping
 

I have an Apex AD-1500 DVD standalone player. With the original Kwag templates I can get 352X240 working fine. On the KVCDx2 with 702X480 VCD, the audio skips. I can encode as SVCD with 3:2 pulldown and it works, but is larger. I have tried remuxing with BBMpeg and had no luck. I also have bumped up the min bitrate to 500. I worked alot with BBMpeg last night and just couldn't get it. Audio still skips. Video looks great though.

Please help, I'm at wits end!!!

Thanks!!!

Re: Help with Apex AD-1500 skipping
 

I too have had much trouble getting kvcdx2 to work without skips on my apex 1500. I've done all the muxing and remuxing tricks in the book. Same with the VBV. The problem seems to be the framerate. At 23 fps the video slows down and speeds up, but at 30 fps it works fine. This works for mpeg1 and mpeg2. From what I can tell, TMPGenc's pulldown function actually encodes the extra frames whereas if you apply pulldown after encoding (using pulldown.exe @ http://www.inwards.com/inwards/?id=36) it only changes the rff/tff flags for 2:3 (3:2? I always confuse them) pulldown. This will fix the filesize problem. Note: this will only work for mpeg2 (svcd).
If you want to use mpeg1, the only way I've got it to work is to encode at 30fps. So you still have about a 20% filesize increase :cry: .

If you want, take a look at one of my previous posts, It shows how I used cce, kvcdx2, and andreas' matrix to get pretty good results.

http://www.kvcd.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=361

I hope this helped. Cheers

Darkstar808

PS This method fixed the audio too :)

I have an apex 1500 and i have experimented using 29.97fps, and using 23.97fps with 3:2 pulldown.

I personaly found that using 29.97fps gives me a much better picture quality than using 23.97fps with the pulldown.

My apex plays any of kwags templates perfectly, so long as I use 29.97fps. And that's ok because I still get a better quality and smaller file size than compliant vcd.

THANK U SO MUCH KWAG. You make me wonder why I spent so many years wasting my time doing divx. Your Templates are all I use now exlusively.

Thanks Mr_J :lol:

kwag

I'm starting with a full screen DVD for testing. These are my results on Apex 1500.
KVCD 352x240 VCD - works fine
KVCD 352x480 VCD - choppy
KVCD 352x480 SVCD w/ 3:2 pdown - works fine
KVCDx2 704x480 VCD - choppy
KVCDx2 704x480 SVCD w/ 3:2 pdown - works fine

I would love to get the KVCDx2 VCD to work. Video looks great and filesize is good too. Is there any way to do a 3:2 pulldown on VCD (mpg1)?? Some folks remuxed with bbMpeg and got it to work on the 1500. I couldn't get it to work. Maybe some bbMpeg settings are wrong for me.

I also have an APEX 1200. Neither of the SVCDs worked on it.

Any more ideas appreciated.

Great templates Kwag!!!

Bump for any other ideas.

Hi sterogers:

The 1500 works, as reported by many users.
You must Demux/Remux as SVCD. Use joint stereo in X2.
I don't have a 1500, so I can't test it :cry:

kwag

Thanks Kwag.

Demuxed and Remuxed, but didn't try Joint Stereo. Will try tonight.

Thanks again!!

Kwag,

Tried the Remux with Joint Stereo. Still didn't work. Working with the x2 one disc template. Making mpg1 file and upping low bitrate to 600. Changed audio to Joint Stereo. Demuxed w/ Tmpeg. Remuxed as SVCD in BBmpg and unchecked "Add SVCD scan offsets" and "Align sequence header". Burned with VCDEasy as an SVCD. Still skips.

I can use KVCDx2 (704x480) and encode as an SVCD with 3:2 pulldown. That plays fine, but larger. Another big prob with this is that when I burn with VCDEasy, it makes the file much larger. Any ideas how to change this? Sorry for all the questions, but I have a 760 MB mpg2 file that I can burn onto an 80 min CD.

Thanks!!

hmmmm
 

Sterogers:

When you encode as svcd do you just take the normal KVCDx2 template and change it to mpeg2 instead of 1?

Silly question, but just wondering......

tks

Yes, I up the min bitrate and encode as mpg2 with 3:2 pulldown. I have no problem getting this to work. VCDEasy just adds tons of data to my final mpg2 file while burning as an SVCD.

Hi sterogers !

For my opinion what happens to your file in VCDEasy is that VCDEasy converts our VBR file to SYSTEM (CBR) file and with CBR u do not have audio skips . 8O
Motion is smooth too but ....
As we all know file with CBR is much , much bigger then VBR . 8O
This happened to me when tryed to work with VCDEasy . :evil:
Try Nero with the same file and u'll see (if I'm wrong or right).

bman

I'll try Nero tonight. VCDEasy is so much better to work with though. I don't have this problem with VCDs. Just the SVCDs. I figured it added data due to the 3:2 pulldown.

U have to try to beleave ha..a..a? :D
Try and than we talk !!!
Good luck 8)
bman

bman

Tried with nero. Had 780mb mpg2 file. Tried to add over 100mb in the .dat file. Overburn burned as far as it could.

Added a lot of data just like VCDEasy did. This was a KVCD 352x480 mpg2 with 3:2 pulldown.

Any more ideas???

Alright, I know some of you said you got the 704x480 KVCDx2's to work on an APEX 1500. I'm talking VCD, not SVCD. If you did, please reply with the how-to's.

Thanks!!

I did get the 1500 to work with 704x576 res over the weekend.

Possible solution for some.

Wo...w !!!

How did u do that ?
Share with us !

bman

Just used Kwag's 704x480 template. Changed res to 704x576. My AD 1500 works with either Joint Stereo or Dual Channel. Others have said to try JS with the 1500 so I assumed DC didn't work for them. I have a lot more testing to do due to larger file size. I also started with a 4:3 full screen DVD. The 704x576 didn't go full screen. I want aspect ratios correct.

Am willing to test further for other folks.

Hi again !

4:3 - How big file size did u get ?
Must be more than 1Gb !!!

bman

I'm working with Shrek (4:3 NTSC Film ~90mins). With 704x576, min bitrate 500, CQ 45 I got it right below 800MB. This is still with small black bars on top and bottom though. I test with a 10 min fast/slow action segment. I will check out Kwag's PAL templates to check differences out next.

tested
 

sterogers

Ive tried the PAL tempate as well, and got the same thing on the apex 1500... I am too stumped by the letterbox format that plays when you do this though. I was told to screw around with the aspect ratio with a customized size..

tks


BTW. . when you play the CD do you have to make the dvd player go back to NTSC? I have too...

I can get KVCD at 352x480 SVCD with 3:2 pulldown to work. Just make sure you select "MPEG-2 Super VideoCD (VBR)" under the System tab. This keeps your burner from padding too much.

I also get KVCDx2 704x576 VCD to work. This gives not full picture. If I select "4:3 625 line (PAL)" under Aspect Ratio, I can get full screen. Don't know yet if I'm chopping part of the movie or not. File size is bigger too.

I have to compare the two next to see which is better quality.

Eureka!!
 

The bloody thing works now.. My apex 1500 will plays Kwag KVCDx2 Ntscfilm.. if i change the rez to 704x576 and like sterogers said change the aspect ratio to 4:3 625 line (pal) as well... Thats where i was wrong the last time.. Thank You.. Thank You..

Now all i have to do is test it on a full movie. Ive been doin clips and samples. The only other thing that i worry about now is the file size. Im one of those people who likes to get the most for my meg!! :)

tks

Re: Eureka!!
 

And that works for an NTSC machine?

Afterv reading this forum and alot of experimentation, this is how i get the best quality (in my opinion) kvcd for my Apex 1500.

First of I load up Kwags kvcd x 2 template (704x480)
Next I change the framerate to 29.97fps.
Ill put the CQ at 70 (usually)
I make sure the p and b frame spoilage is set at 0,0 respectively
I make sure that the detect scene changes is not checked
Ill load up the default svcd quantize matrix and use that
I use 48000hz audio and encode at 48000hz, 192kbs, dual channel(The apex 1500 will handle it)

I dont use IVTC, fit cd, avisynhth, temporal smoother, or anything else thats fancy. I keep it real simple.

When the mpg is finished I demultipelx it in TMPGEnc

Then I remux as a SVCD in bbmpg (I uncheck add svcd offsets and alling sequence headers)

Ill burn it in nero as a svcd with the standart compliant unchecked.

What this gives me is about 50-80mins of SWEET, sweet quality video, excellent audio all on 1 80min cd.

Thats what I do and It plays great on my apex 1500

Also, Ive experimented and found that as long as I use 29.97fps and remux as a svcd in bbmpg, the apex 1500 will play without problem, resolutions such as 352x240. 352x480, 480x480, 704x480, and of course720x480.

I LOVE MY APEX 1500, AND I LOVE THIS FORUM

I like to think of this forum as an excellent laborutory manual. Thank you to all who have contributed!

Why the default (no numbers selected?) over the KVCD numbers. Also why not the MPEG option?

Why demultiplex it? I find the resolutions work fine on my APEX 1500. Though I have burned the HACK rom into it and my APEX 1000. :lol:

Why? :oops:
Why? :oops:

yeah
 

Reman:

Yeah it works for my apex 1500.. The apex 1500 has a feature on the remote where you can switch from Pal/Ntsc/Multi..

When i pop in the disc and it starts the play the screw is all screwed.. Then I press the pal/ntsc button and it switches to Ntsc and plays perfectly fine. Odd eh? :)

tks

I find that (for my eyes) the default svcd quantize matrix gives me a better picture than the mpg or Andreas matrix.

Occasionaly if I dont demultiplex and remux as a svcd, the apex will not play my video. (althought I found no need to do this with the 352x240 or 704x480 resolutions. It seems to play those resolutions fine as a mpg-1 vcd)

The reason I put the p and b picdture spoilage to 0,0 is because I have found that otherwise(0,20 or whatever else) I get vertical glitch line artifacts in my video that I find irritating.

I make sure that the detect scene change is not checked because I find it unnessesary using a large gop 1-18-3-1-48.

Keep in mind that I use these settings with video quality as the main objective and small filesize as the secondary objective. I take quality as the priority.

Yes, the 352x240 or 704x480 resolutions work fine on 1500 and 1000. I found it hard to work with odd formats. Like a 360x240! The video must have been done thinking it was half of 720.

:D

What does this mean?
 

"You must Demux/Remux as SVCD". How is this accomplished?

Re: What does this mean?
 

Hi Cambridge:

Here's the thread: http://www.kvcd.net/forum/viewtopic....6ca4c1a618f708

kwag

reman

What did you do to get 704x480 working on your 1500. Won't work on mine. I get audio skips. Tried demux/remux too. No avail.

Well...easy! change the 23fps to 29 fps. I encode with 128 sound. I also use 1150 to 1750 for max bit rates. Depends on the movie. Typical is 1550. :wink:

I like the 704x480 due to really high quality output. My main problem now is an illegal floating point error. See new post.

I remember trying that a while back. I got slight video skips, if I recall correctly. I ended up doing 480x480 SVCDs. That way, I could use 3:2 pulldown. Works good. I would like to get other formats/resolutions working for testing purposes though. I am trying to get the best possible quality onto 1 CD.

Thanks!!

Please try it again! :D It works! :wink:

Why do that?

Will try again. Got results written down at home though.

Going to 29.97 fps adds substantial filesize. With SVCD, I can keep 23.97 fps and use 3:2 pulldown to keep my filesizes down. Again, my intentions are to keep each DVD ripped movie onto 1 CD with the best quality.

Yes, the size does goes up but for the APEX 1000 and 1500 it solved my "audio skips" problem. Really, 5 years ago, DVD players SHOULD have started to use DivX. I have done some GREAT 120 min movies that are 750mb! Oh well!