Post the serial number and try another unit if you are not in a rush or still have some patience left... there is a list of dvd recorders that can do the same thing for far less than the CBT1000. If you have a TON of tapes and can justify the cost then go for it. If you are like me and have just enough tapes to make using a professional about the same or more then DIY then get something else.

Im not sure if anyone has actually done this yet but here is my personal analyses:

Total # of tapes: 92 (so far)
Total cost of new gear purchased (vcr, BVP-4, ATI-600, cables, premium membership to this site): $425
Archival media: $0.74/disc
TOTAL COST PER TAPE: $5.49

Just something to think about.

s/n 2238406012831

Sorry but I do not have my digi cam but here is some of the info:

Ic6 - LTB101 v2.1 S1011
Ic1 - NX?
Ic3 & 4 - AVERLOGIC. -AL440B-24-PBF
MS943
0950

Sorry but that's I can come up with. I guess poor lighting huh?

Excellent suggestion. :thumb:

If you run into a bad AVT-8710, then just get a TBC-1000 instead. It will be easier at this exact moment. The TBC-1000 is the obvious second choice to an AVT-8710, although it comes at about double the cost (street price ~$450). If you're lucky, sometimes the TBC-1000 can be had for about 150% cost of the AVT-8710, in the $300 range.

Site Staff is currently in the process of trying to "round up" as many known-working TBCs as is possible, with the intention of reselling them here on the marketplace forum at a reasonable price. It may be July before we'll have them available for sale, however.

While I patiently wait for my replacement AVT-8710, has anyone received a good working unit from B & H lately?

-- merged --

Well, after a long day at work anticipating the delivery of the replacement AVT8710 to arrive, I was not very confident. So I come home, and there is the box. I stared at it for a second thinking....I wondered if I ordered the TBC 1000 tonight when would it arrived, and I can take my time returning the 8710. So I open the box.....hummmm I hope they didn't send be a return unit? But wait, it looked different.....the plug looked weird..........why are there so many attachments? One for Europe, one for Australia and one for NA. Hummmmm. I think this is good news, did they realize they had some junk out there, and this was a quick fix?????????? I then turn it over to look at the S/N - 2238406015665. Is that good? Not too close to my old unit???????? So I Plug it in......turn it on........hit play........Yes!!!!!!!!! NO DOUBLE IMIAGES! It works! The menu screen is a clean image! The video God's were on my side!!!!!

Not sure if you can call B&H to have them look at the unit before shipping? But they DO have good units!

Ps - both units I ordered were both the black shell

That's excellent news.
Be sure to test it thoroughly. (Hoping it wasn't a false alarm -- but always nice to be thorough!)

Test???? What's that? What is the best way to test it? Find a tape that is jittery? And compare?

No, nothing so complex.
Play tapes, then go back to the JVC menu every few seconds. See if it can be "tripped up" in some way.

If not, then it's good. :)

Will do. But so far, it looks good. I have played 3 separate tapes, going back and forth between menu and tape. So far so good. Nothing like the first unit, but I will continue.

On a side note, not sure if this is the appropriate thread, but I am looking for a thread that had the optimum setting for the JVC hr-s9900u. I cannot find it, and I cannot remember if it was on this site or another "popular" video help site (not sure if I can mention it here?)

Thanks,

Rappy

Here or another site, it was very likely one of my posts you read. :D

And this site is always the best place to find me anyway. This is best addresses in a new post, since it's not really about the AVT-8710 at this point. This article on video playback hardware may be the one you're thinking of. Or you can always try to search the digitalFAQ.com forum for posts that have been made by Site Staff in the past. I know I've replied to posts here in the past, with specific questions on JVC S-VHS VCR settings.

Thanks LS. that helps a lot! I will they to keep all of my different questions separate.

Ok. So I am still not sure if the new unit is working or not. When it is not in capture mode (see my other thread) the menu screen looks good. When I am able to capture (icon to the far left above pause/play button) and I have the VCR blue screen (video not playing) or the menu settings screen- the screen is blurry. Not like the first unit (double images) but very noticeable. Tried taking screen shots, but it will not capture the error - sorry.

Lord Smurf/admin- I sent an email regarding some work on an important video (long story). Not sure who it goes out to, but I am willing to send someone the unit to test, and use their far superior expertise to verify if it is a good unit or not?

Let me know if you'd be interested or not.

Interesting. Just got my first AVT-8710 in today. Same weird jvc problem. Seems like it sees the blue screen as no video and keeps outputting the last two fields. Other than that though it seems to work. All the adjustment settings do work, and I've taken time to calibrate it closely to my tapes, so the color / contrast / brightness are about the same as before going into the tbc. Real pain but the output isn't exactly equal to the input in terms of color and contrast.

No noticeable other issues thus far. Appears to be doing its job as far as I can tell. One tape I have had a sharp vertical jump at one point in the tape. It was still there - but instead of moving upward about an inch, it moved up only about a quarter of an inch. So I think it's working - but who knows for sure. I've also got on of those "new" serial numbers like rappy posted. I still notice some slight jitter but it is very slight... But this may be due to the composite cable... The s-video cable is coming in tomorrow, and I'll then be able to say for certain.
Should I concern myself about this blue screen death thing? Sure it's a bit of a pain to configure the vcr, but if it works otherwise.....

The best way to tell would be to throw a really bad tape at it and see if the image freezes or ghosts like the examples we have uploaded. B&H has changed the photo and raised the price of this unit since my original purchase... interpret those actions however you like. until there are some definitive answers from the mfg or an admin I'm considering this unit 'un necessary'

I actually am sending my second unit back. kpmedia was nice enough to "test it" for me and wasn't convinced it was working properly so I purchased the TBC -1000. Yeah it's twice the price but I figured I just wanted to be sure I had a proper unit and I want to do this project once and do it right!

Its interesting reading the reviews. It appears that newer AVT-8710s attempt to freeze the last good frame when encounters a dropout, but fails to refresh the frame buffer after that. My unit NEVER does any sort of freeze framing, if it hits a blank or really bad tracking section of tape, it goes to color bars.

This is exactly what is happening. I took several video capture comparisons before sending it back for rappy's RMA.
Those will be posted when I get a bit more free time in the next week or two.

I can confirm that bad AVT-8710 TBC models exist. :(

That's the problem - I have no really bad tapes. All of mine are good. Some better than others - but no noticeable tracking issues. Some though have jitter. At least I think it is jitter - straight lines move slightly left and right).

I have really two questions on this thing. My main question is whether it should technically remove all minor horizontal jitter (particularly at the left and right side of the video) so that basically none exists. I don't unfortunately have a baseline for this unit so at current it is a shot in the dark as of exactly how it should behave. All of my tapes are in good condition, but there are some ep tapes that have slight horizontal jitter after leaving the jvc vcr, and that doesn't seem to be corrected by the tbc. I have heard that they correct jitter as a side effect of the time base correction. So either 1) This unit doesn't get rid of all jitter (as intended) , 2) this unit is defective. 3) Since I am new to this, maybe I am missing something (which is a definite possibility).

So the real question is: does it remove basically 100% of jitter, or should I expect some to remain on the output?

One thing you can do to stress the tbc is turn off the jvc tbc and then turn on manual tracking (turn off auto calibration). Then adjust the tape to the point it does have frames drop. I think this functionality in my unit may be working because it did freeze the frame for a few seconds until it was so bad that I got color bars until the tracking went back enough to give a usable signal.

As for calibrating it to output colors correctly, the closest I've gotten is: color: +5, contrast -2, brightness -1. The pluses and minuses represent quick button presses (plus or minus) for each setting I've adjusted). It's not perfect, but close. I'm still working on getting a better setting. If anyone has better default neutral configuration, I'd love to hear it...

This horizontal jitter.

This defect is correctable with an internal TBC, not an external TBC like the AVT-8710 or TBC-1000. That's a somewhat more advanced timing error not addresses by the external units, which focus more on the frame synchronization aspect. This is why both types of TBCs are suggested.

A tape in good condition generally would not exhibit that problem. So your tapes may be a bit more damaged (or badly recorded, as the most likely scenario) than you're thinking. But that's okay, it can be fixed, and this site will teach you how.

You'll want to implement the same strategy used for "tearing". Search the forum, it's been documented in detail in several threads. (If you have trouble finding the info, after doing a search, let me know.)

Some stray lines will always slip through, especially on really awful tapes. The goal of restoring video is to make it better, not make it perfect. That said, I do think there are some more potential fixes for your situation, using hardware suggesting for correction of tearing (specific DVD recorders on passthrough, D-VHS VCRs, etc).

Interesting. I've never noticed a color problem with an AVT-8710. I wonder if your unit is in some way "bad" or if there's a flaw in your calibration method.

Hey Everyone,

I'm new to the site. Been reading various posts in preparation for a VCR capture project. Unfortunately I missed this thread until today :( I ordered a AVT-8710 a little over a month ago and am unfortunately past my return period with B&H.

I connected the AVT-8710 to my JVC S9600U and noticed the ghosting problem with the menu. However it seemed that playback of a tape worked OK, so I didn't think much of the JVC menu issue at the time. And granted, I only tested one tape for about 10 minutes of playback onto a TV... at the time I was looking to just test the basics - I'm just getting into this and I don't have all my equipment ready to start capturing, after all :)

Anyway, after reading this thread twice, my interpretation is that OLDER AVT-8710 units did not exhibit the problem with the JVC menu. Newer AVT-8710s, completely defective or questionably-defective, are having problems with the JVC menu. If my interpretation is correct, this puts me into the later category where my AVT-8710 is either completely defective or questionably-defective.

So my follow-up questions are:

• Does the JVC menu issue = a completely defective AVT-8710?
• If the JVC menu issue does not imply that my AVT-8710 is completely defective, then what do I need to do to ensure that my AVT-8710 is going to reliably playback VHS? I saw some suggestions about stress-testing the AVT-8710 with bad input... but it sounded like the overall conclusion was that JVC menu issue = bad unit.
• I don't want to half-donkey this project. Given that I can't return the TBC to B&H at this point... should I just eat the cost and buy a TBC-1000?

As much as I dislike being the bearer of bad news -- especially when it means the loss of $$$ -- this is indeed the case. You have an expensive paper weight. While it may work, it is wholly unreliable and cannot be trusted to do a quality job on video transfers.

Pretty much. :(

Make a case with B&H that they sold you an overpriced paperweight, from a device that was known to have defects as far back as June 2011. I would not just give up and roll over. They've basically profited from a flawed device, and they're not 100% off the hook as far as I'm concerned. This was brought to their attention by numerous people throughout 2011, so "it's not our fault" will not be an acceptable answer.

I'd fight. Tell them you're quite willing to upgrade (PAY MORE!) for the known-flawless AVT-8710. Even if they want to hit you with a 15% restocking fee -- which is ridiculous -- I'd still cave on a $30 loss vs a $200 loss.

Thanks kpmedia. I didn't think about trying to work the "I'm willing to upgrade" angle. Good call!

I'll give them a ring tomorrow morning.

By the way, I assume you meant to say "to the known-flawless TBC-1000" :)

Hi Frankle

I had one of those blasted things sometime around last august or so. Had to return it. Same issue as you.

I ended up using videoredo 3 tv to edit the video (remove commercials) and author. I used the JVC's line TBC as often as possible (on occasion tracking problems causes the TBC to really mess the video up even more so I would turn it off). As for maintaining sync, videoredo adds (or removes - i can't recall offhand) audio frames to maintain sync on an imperfect source. Just be sure to set the encoder quality to High instead of the default AUTO. If you leave it on AUTO, you get really crappy encoding at your cuts. It will only encode minimally when you place cuts (to remove commercials, etc).

It may not be optimal. But for me it worked and haven't noticed any problems. Of course this was done on some old shows that aren't on air anymore. So they're important but not "precious irreplaceable family video" important.

OK, I gave B&H a call this morning and spoke with Issac. He suggested that I call the manufacturer to get a warranty replacement (warranty on this thing is 1 year). I don't have the serial number with me here at work, so this will have to wait until tomorrow. B&H provided me with AV Toolbox's customer service number: 859-647-1077

Anyone had any experience in dealing with AV Toolbox's customer service? I don't have high hopes...

lopaka, thanks for the info. I'm trying to go the route of a hardware-based TBC rather than software-based... but good to know that your solution worked OK for you in the end.

I'd still push for the upgrade option, if possible. They can deal with warranty/returns just as well as you can.

I've never dealt with AVToolbox support either. And they're just a reseller (private label) anyway -- the real manufacturer for this TBC is Cypress Technology in Taiwan. The real model number of the AVT-8710 is the CTB-100. There's a chance they have finally fixed the bad chipsets, and new units are fine. (That still means B&H has old stock on their shelves.)

Try both ways.

OK, good news! B&H agreed to let me return my AVT-8710. I'll have to pay the 15% restocking fee, but definitely better to lose 15% than the entire cost.

TBC-1000 order has been placed. And I ordered a couple inexpensive commercial VHS tapes from Amazon in order to test the TBC :)

You give up to easily. Know what you want, know what your options are - why are you backing down?

I would have told them that if they tried that restocking fee crap, after making another purchase - and when knowing the item was defective in the first place, that I would do a chargeback on that 15%. I'd pay for return shipping and the shipping to you - and that's it.

Do you know what a credit card chargeback is? If not, look it up. You have more control over this than you know. But they will take as much as you give them. They are trained to be pushy, so push back.

If you remember - please report here how the tbc-1000 works. I probably wont get it this late into the transfer - but I'd still be curious to know how well it does, and what features it has... If you remember... and have time :)

The only reason they're charging a restocking fee is because I disposed of the manufacturer's packaging. So, with that being said, I think the restocking fee is reasonable.

If I had the packaging and they were pushing a restocking fee, that would be a completely different story and I would be pushing for a full refund.

Lesson learned: don't order specialized equipment until you 1) know how to completely test & validate it and 2) have any other equipment that you need to do the validation!

Yep, you're pretty much stuck there. :(

See if they can, at very least, provide you with a prepaid UPS return box/label.

15% of $200 is only $30, so it's not a huge loss. I personally wouldn't cry over it. Losing money sucks, but I've been ripped off for far more in the past ($50 to $1,000), so I try to keep things in perspective. With the $175 or so -- whatever it is you have -- you'll be able to make a nice down payment on the TBC-1000.

And if you remember, be sure to use our B&H link when ordering the new one -- the link is added to the word B&H automatically by the forum software on the first two uses in any post. B&H shares about 4% of the sale when anybody uses our links. These tiny slivers of a few bucks each is one way this site is funded. That and the Premium Memberships, of course.

So have you gotten the TBC-1000 yet? Im considering selling my ADVC-300 and getting one. Let us know if youve gotten it and had a chance to try it out yet.

I've used TBC-100 and TBC-1000 for the past decade. They're always excellent.

There can be issues with the TBC-1000 and TBC-100 picking up electrical noise, which results in image signal noise. It really depends on the quality of power in your area, as well as the porousness of electrical noise coming from other hardware in your workflow. This should NOT scare you away from using DataVideo TBCs, but is simply something to be aware of.

In the past, there were also complaints about the DataVideo TBCs being softer than the Cypress TBCs, but it was mostly forum grumblings that never got backed by indisputable evidence. (I think most times it was just in the person's imagination.)

Also: We have one TBC-100 (PCI card) for sale for $300 + shipping if you're interested. :2cents:

I did try out the TBC-1000 yesterday. I was happy to see that commercial copy protection did not work when dubbing a tape, so that means the TBC did its job.

Question: do I need to worry about routing audio through the TBC-1000? Or can I route audio straight from the VCR to my capture card?

See this post: http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/vide...html#post19665
The same question was asked just yesterday.

I bypass the audio in/out on the TBC unless I'm using the distro amp for some reason. :2cents:

Cool, that's what I figured. Thanks!

Lordsmurf,

Been kind of following this thread, actually purchased one of these units on your advise the AVT8710. On the 1st go, had a signal problem with the unit and sent it back. Later to find it didn't like the inputs from a betamax RCA cable.

Sometimes with the S-Video cable, if it had a loose connection or really nothing other than the AVT8710 didn't like the cables, would get random pulses in the picture. It is kind of weird were the screen would get a random flicker through the entire recording.

My menu gets the same thing that is stated above, just thought it was the way the AVT8710 worked. Had two of these units.

Also found if the area of the recording had trouble, like a random drop out or screen shift, (common with betamax) it would create a backwards frame. Which was really weird.

When I picked up on this duplicate or wrong frame problem decided to not use the unit anymore. My unit is about 1 year and 3 months old and purchased it from B&H for about $200.

Don't like the buttons on these units, they seem to be really cheap, however the comb filter does help improve some of the betamax tapes. It has also been kind of useful when doing PAL to NTSC work.

Don't use this as a double TBC or anything like that. However use the JVC VCR as a passthrough to not get a signal problem with the unit. Was wondering what I should do, and if you know of any kind of other units that would work better on Video Tapes. aka Betamax recordings, cause none of those machines have TBC's, most of them don't have S-Video outputs, at least none of my units do.

What are the pro's and cons for this TBC1000?

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/cont...=REG&A=details

Is this place an ok source for the AVT-8710
http://www.bzbexpress.com/Multi-Stan...-AVT-8710.html

I found them on ebay then found they had a website. Seem legit to me. Or is B&H the best place reallY?

Are current units from B&H still in green casings and are defective units still being sold as of Feb/March 2012 or have they disapeared now?

Dot crawl? Sometimes the unit can be finicky with cables.

Again, it can be finicky with cables. And remember that your cables age. I throw out a handful of cable each year. I use old coax cable outside my house, to tie a tree down to rebar stakes. That's really all it's good for that that point -- wire for the yard. I have a long composite/RCA cable trio that's about to join the wire box in the garage. I throw away s-video cables (too short, too thin for anything useful).

Unfortunately, no. That's not how it should work. On some ancient TV sets, however, you may see pulsing on the JVC menu, but never the video. The video pushed out by the JVC VCR is not 100% compliant/normal NTSC video. The older tube TVs seem to pick it up more, though I'm not yet sure what the technical explanation would be. It's not present on EOL SDTVs, or HDTVs.

The only con is that the units seem to be easily susceptible to external electrical (FM?) noise, and it will cause noise patterns in the video. It doesn't happen often, but it does happen. I had to sell off my TBC-1000 back in 2006, because the new place I moved into had power that was disagreeable -- even with a UPS+AVR.

Some units are reported to be soft, but I've only seen or read/heard about that a few times -- and a number of the unseen reports seemed like imagination as far as I'm concerned. The person wasn't testing with anything to verify.

Looks fine to me. :thumb:

- All current AVT-8710s appear to be black.
- The older green cases appear to be gone at this point in time.
- The CTB-100 editions are all baby blue and silver/gray.

Ok thanks, i might give them a go. First i will buy a Datavideo TBC though. They seem harder to get.

We have a TBC-100, new in box, never used (outside of testing it), for $300 available. :cool:

It's the "guts" of the TBC-1000, which plugs directly into a computer. Only one is available.
The rest all sold out last year. I hung on to this one for a project that ended up falling through, so it's available now.

Just an FYI for anybody looking. (Not yet put it for sale in the marketplace.)

Still want to get a Cypress/AVT 8710. Just read through this thread again but still not sure what to think. Does not seem to be any more new complaints comming in about faulty AVT's. Are people still buying them? Have you been happy? I was also thinking of the TV One TBC. I believe i saw it on AV tool box site and they directed you to the TV one site saying that the TV one TBC is a 'professional TBC' and something like 'please see TV ones website' They said something like that as i was redirected to the TV one site for that TBC. I dont think i would need the Genlock version. Just by looking at what it can do it seems to be the same as the AVT8710 but just in a different case?

http://www.tvone.com/1t-tbc-main.shtml

Essentially, yes. :2cents: