Just Bought New AVT-8710 - Defective or not?
 

I am new to this site and read this whole thread which is quite long and has a lot of details. Is there a very simple way to determine if my new AVT-8710 (sn#2238406019888) is defective or not? (Wrong chipset? Bad sn# range? Fails a particular test? Etc.) I am not experienced with TBCs & want to make the determination before the return period expires in 2 weeks from BZBExpress. I see that a lot of people have had problems with this unit but some like it a lot. In my first experiences with this unit the results were mostly disappointing but I'm not sure how much I can expect out of it. I am using it with a Mitsubishi HS-HD2000U.
Thanks!
Mike

Welcome to the site. :)

One of the posts discusses the chipsets affected. You may have missed it. Just go through it again until you find it.
The easiest test is to see how it reacts on a JVC S-VHS bluee screen. Good = good, wonky = bad.

Thank you for the warm welcome! I connected my JVC (HR-S4600U) video out directly to my TV & got a clean blue picture in both the standby & menu modes. However when I put the AVT-8710 in between the VCR & the TV, I first got a herringbone like pattern, then a multi colored confetti like pattern & then just a screen full of tiny dashes lined up horizontally in both standby & menu modes. I tried both S-Video & composite inputs/outputs with the same results. The strange thing is that I didn't see these patterns while playing a tape. But, I guess this means the unit is defective, right? Is it worthwhile getting a replacement with all these defectives out there or is there a better choice? I do like the proc amp features in the unit so I can adjusted color, tint etc. should I need to do that.

-- merged --

Is the gosting issue with the AVT-8710 a defect in only some units or a design flaw in all of them?
Thanks!
Mike

Unfortunately, I think you one of the defective units.
It was semi-random, and did not affect them all. However, it tended top affected an an lot/stock. So don't buy it there again.

It presents less often with a tape, but still happened. So that's not good.

Been having some trouble with my AVT-8710 lately, especially random "ghosting" during video playback. Found this old thread and learned A LOT about this unit, so thanks to all for sharing the info. I'm sorry to report however, that B&H still has bad units for sale. I just ordered mine last week, received today, 7/16/13, turned it on and tried my JVC SR-V101's menu screen, and sure enough, got the same crazy problem.

S/N 2238406021680

Has anyone else had any luck finding a good unit? Thanks in advance.

That's disappointing. At this time, the DataVideo TBC-1000 (or TBC-100, if you can find it) is suggested. While it's about $100 more expensive than the AVT-8710, it works. You won't have to waste time testing, buying/returning defects, etc. Note that it's only more expnsive when new ... sometime you can find them on eBay for less used. Sometimes even in the $225 range, like the AVT-8710.

You best bet is to find a used green/black model, if you want the 8710.

Hello everyone,

I bought an AVT-8710 on eBay a few months ago and I think my TBC started having the same problem since today...
I have provided a sample of the problem as attachment. Some frames freeze for some seconds
Can anyone confirm this is the problem mentioned in this topic? As I don't own a JVC VCR to test the menu.

Man I'm so angry right now... Bought the TBC for about 115€ second hand from an ebayer in the UK, so there's no chance of getting any warranty whatsoever...

The device worked perfectly for months and started acting up like this all of the sudden.

Something like this does not "just start", but rather is a flaw that's always present. (You may have simply just noticed it. Better check past transfers!) It's an uncorrectable error in the chipset that was switched to at some point back in 2011 or so. I have TBCs from before that time, which are flawless. The new ones, sadly, are not. It's somewhat random, because every unit does not use that same chips. To me, that sloppy (inexcusable!) practice by the manufacturer, Cypress Technologies.

That all said, I'm not sure what's causing this image problem. So here's what you need to do:

1. Re-capture part of a tape that used to be okay. Has it changed? (I doubt it did.)
2. Try to capture on another device, with the TBC.
3. Try another TBC. I know, you probably don't have one. But that's sometimes the only way to compare.

Something like this could be caused by capture cards, tapes, or even the computer itself (internal codec issues). It's hard to know what did it.

Well, after a night of sleep I tried again this morning and everything seems to be ok now. I hope it stays this way. Could this be caused by the typical overheating of the device? (I've read about this on another forum) As I'm in the process of digitizing 22 Hi8 tapes.

However, I'm pretty sure this ghosting was caused by the AVT-8710 itself, because as soon as I linked the Hi8 player directly to the capture card, the ghosting was completely gone!

Yes. After about 6 hours, it overheats, and can do odd things.
I forgot about that. (Haven't used mine for a few weeks. Doing editing, not capturing lately. Out of sight, out of mind!)

Keep those fingers crossed, and maybe it won't happen again! :)

Yep, started happening again after about 4,5 hours... Any way to solve this problem? (As in: extra heat sinks on the chips?)

I actually wonder if this is caused by the heat of the chips or bad soldering... Tried blowing with a fan on the board but ghosting was still there unfortunately.

There may be room to mod it with extra heat sinks. If not, you may have to mod the case for it, too.
I never run this one more than ~6 hours at a time, and it's fine. It's the older (~2003) NTSC green/black model.

I might make a modded casing in the future.
Let's see if my test setup works :P

Well, that didn't seem to have much effect... Problems still start to occur after a certain amount of time. Even with a fan blowing at full speed on the chips.

I'm busy with a tape now where i seem to be unable to capture the 90 minutes as a whole.
The tape has an unstable image since it was captured while driving on a bumpy road which probably made the tape/heads move a bit in the camcorder resulting in the wobble of the picture

After a while of playback, it's like the AVT-8710 says: "screw this, too much work" :P and then there's the ghosting again which i can't get rid off unless i leave the TBC off for a few hours...

Very strange... Should've saved my money for the TBC-1000 instead of buying this unreliable piece of equipment :(

Are there still defective units of these around. Here's what I'm getting:

http://1drv.ms/1gdNTcP

Four pictures on my onedrive, the third one without the AVT8710. Should this unit be sent back?

That almost looks like bad wiring, or a bad input/output connection.

Do the faulty chipset units still exist? Sadly, yes. The USED units are passed around all the time, as they're unwanted. The persona selling wants to recoup funds and unload it on another sucker. Lots of eBay/Paypal disputes from this mess.

Are NEW units still bad? That I do not know. I've not seen a new units in months now.

But again, your exact images don't appear to be a chipset issue. Not at first, anyway.

OK, this is a brand new unit, I'm going scart to composite in, composite out, but I've also done s-video in, and composite out with the same results. I like what it does when the video starts :) Though it does seem to brighten the picture quite a bit, or dull the contrast, but I've just started using it.

Another question, though may be this should go in another thread, shouldn't these rectify PAL60? i.e. playing an NTSC vhs in a PAL VCR. Direct to TV it's colour, through the AVT8710 it's black and white.

None of that sounds right.

It should NOT be messing with the brightness or colors. That points to the chipset issue. Is it a major difference, or just a minor nitpick of 1% differences? A TBC does change these values some, but it should never be harsh or major. (A few noted exceptions for badly damaged nth generation videos.)

The TBC won't signal convert, if that's what you mean.

What I've got going is a scart going from the VHS to a scart/composite splitter. A scart cable goes direct to the TV scart and the composite goes via AVT8710 to the composite on TV so I switch between the two. What I've noticed is that when I switch from scart to composite input on the TV i.e. from direct to via the AVT8710 the picture is vibrant for a second and then dulls by itself.

Here's some test photos if they're any use, I haven't got a capture card yet so taking pics of the TV is the best I can do for the moment, direct to TV and via AVT8710:

http://1drv.ms/1ge6Ig9

It does a good job but wondering why it thinks about it for a second then dulls. The TV isn't on 'intelligent sensor' just 'satndard'

For my other query I'm wondering how I can get a colour picture from a retail NTSC tape as the AVT8710 outputs a B/W picture. I thought it was to do with mv.

New version
 

Hi there, today I received my AVT-8710 with serial number 2238406 025619

It seems to have some newer components in it.

Now I don´t have a JVC deck to freak out this device so I cannot test it with that.

My Philips VR550 does have some blue menu´s it is connected via composite (it is only VHS so no SVideo out) and then from the AVT-8710 I go to my Pinnacle 700 pci card via Svideo out of the AVT-8710

Now so far I have not seen any ghosting. I did see it, but that was due to noise removal from virtual dub.

I am not really shocked by the dramatic improvement this makes on my video´s so far. But I didn´t have much time yet to thoroughly test it.

I don´t have the idea there are frame freezes (except when I fast forward video)

So any ideas on how I can give this a good test?

Hope that I can either find out if I should return the unit, or that I can help determine that if it is safe again to buy these devices.

So far I do not get the impression it gets very hot, but maybe I should leave it on for some time.

I converted the picture to PDF so the resolution stays high enough to see the parts :D

Can you take photos of the inside of the unit -- especially the chips?

Picture
 

Please see the PDF file in my previous message. It contains the picture you request.

I used a PDF file because else, the picture would be reduced in resolution causing the picture to be unsharp.

:cool:

AVT-8710 defective?
 

I have an AVT-8710 (SN 200804160080 black case) that I purchased on eBay about 2 yrs ago. I have been tinkering with capturing some Hi8 home movies when I have time but have been mostly disappointed with the results. Several issues around audio sync drifting in and out, color shift, and some tearing and ghosting that tends to emerge slowly after 15-20 mins of capture and get worse as the capture continues. I have almost given up and switched to a Canopus AVDC110 and just captured DV.

After reading through this post and several others I became concerned about the AVT-8710 being defective so I hooked it up to my JVC SR-V101US and sure enough it ghosts on the menu screens. This makes me think the AVT might be the source of some of my woes. Is any further testing justified or should I trash it and move to a used TBC-1000? What would be the best economical TBC option to purchase right now?

The menu ghosting is due to the way the AVT handles video. As the menu output of the VCR is interlaced and doesn't follow any actual spec, the AVT will sometimes display the regular image, but more often will lock one set of fields and not the other. When the tape actually plays and it has video coming in, it doesn't do this. In a way, it is proof that the unit is actually working.

The ADVC is a capture unit, while the AVT is a frame sync. What were you capturing with before?

No. A properly working AVT-8710 does not do this. :no2:

I read somewhere a while ago that it couldn't resync a menu signal due to the way the VCR outputs its menu, I have to wonder if mine is broken too, though I haven't really had any complaints as of late.

After having read this forum for a while I also ordered a AVT-8710 (since I can't find the TBC-1000 anymore, production stopped?) and it seems to exhibit the same problems. At first I thought I was doing something wrong and rearranged gear and cables. The problem with the JVC menu seemed to have gone away.

I can only reproduce the JVC menu error after repeated tries (dozens of play/stop actions for example) so I kinda take that as a good sign. I have included a sample from a video that otherwise plays perfectly and has no ghosting effect.

I do not seem to get the ghosting on any of my tapes, even the pretty bad ones except for one VHS tape that had originally been shot on a camcorder and later transferred to VHS. If this is not ghosting or is another type of problem/error please correct me since I am still learning.

When I watch the previous video without the AVT in line and just the JVC TBC turned on it seems that on the parts where the AVT is affected the image jumps vertically ever so slightly. I can't capture it well but imagine the top line going black and the noise at the bottom dropping down a bit. This is very fast and does not really bother me but I am afraid these errors will produce drops during capture.

In any case, I digress. I made pictures of the unit inside and out and have attached them. If the errors shown are the same we can safely conclude that defective units are STILL made by AVT / Cypress and I beleive the buying guides should reflect this. I vote for removal of this product from the list since chances of a defective unit seem to run rather high.

Sadly, I agree. It needs a warning. Most units do seem to be defective now. I'll make that change in a bit. The only reliable units are the older "green with black trim" models (and I can take a picture of my own).

However, jumping can be a byproduct of timing correction. So I'm not sure this is actually a defect of the unit here.

Re: "Is my AVT 8710 DOA?" thread
 

I'm hunting/looking for section of posts within that thread (many pages), about how to error test AVT 8710, or is that part of a guide?..or should that be made into a guide?..I noticed the first post is from LS about some kind of update, but that was 2011?..Also,I couldn't find any screenshots of good/bad AVT 8710 from posted by admin?. Please help :question:

There's not a guide, and one has never been suggested.
What post is missing screenshots?

I merged your post here. Keep the same conversations together.

LordSmurf,

The jumping I described is when watching the same tape without the AVT in line so it's not a byproduct of the frame TBC, perhaps the line TBC of the JVC? I'd have to try that.

All I could observe is that at the parts where the AVT displays it's "ghosting" (see above attachements, I have not yet had confirmation of my description or analysis is correct) the video slightly jumps vertically without a TBC in line.

Well..I Re-Read your updated message at beginning of this thread, and now I realize it says to read thru the 1st 6 pages for info about AVtool 8710 problems, I was looking for any screenshots of TEST PATTERN generated by a defective/good 8710, but there may not be any, Plus I was looking for any posts about how to test the 8710 for defects, without having to fish thru the whole thread, but I will look again, I may have missed or breezed right past it!..perhaps I will post some shots of my 8710 Test-pattern, But my problem could still be the RF interference thing..still troubleshooting that, Plus I'm replacing the Power Supply in Capture PC, found out it may have over heated, and may be causing some RFI interference!:unsure:

Did you find any way to test to see if the 8710 is defective?

Hello. I have the same problem as described before. I have question to people with faulty ones about power supply. My model is powered by 12v 1,25 A power adapter. In descriptions of avt 8710 was always 15V. Maybe here is a problem?

In the manual from www.avtoolbox.com there is inconsistency - in table of specification is 115 VAC to 15VDC adapter and
two lines below 115 VAC to +12VDC. I'm Wonder if problem appear when they've changed voltage.

Hello Klastes, got your Private Message. I think defective units were sold between (about) 2010 and 2012?. If you notice, this thread was started in 2011, but is still very active!.. I bought my 8710 from B&H Photo in 2011, I thought mine was bad, but found out my problem was from something else, not my 8710. My power adapter says 15VDC. I think the +12VDC is just a technical thing, (like "+" means "above" 12 volts?), or maybe the 8710 runs on/uses 12 volts, but the adapter puts out 15 volts, possibly to allow for minor power fluctuations, to keep 8710 operation stable?. Also I'm not sure what Country you are living, or where you purchased your 8710 from, but 8710 automatically senses TV standard PAL/NTSC, at power-up, But it's important to have it set properly (note there are 7 Lights/LED's across the bottom row), and the first "A" (for auto-detect) should be on, (if not then the "RESET" button is your friend!) These can be accidentally set to the wrong one, if you play with the buttons too much. Plus proper power adapter for proper Country is also very important.

Thanks for your quick answer - helped me a lot. I assume that you have 8710 powered 15V without ghosting effect.
Going this route I've bought universal power adapter. Connect to my AVT-8710 12v and set power adapter to 13,5 v.
The ghosting effect disappear!!!! I've checked vhs tapes PAL that have ghosting effect on 12v oryginal power adapter. Still remain strange interlaced looking menu in JVC HR-S9700 but this is no problem for me. Maybe when I go to 15V it will be gone, but I afraid to cook ma AVT-8710 with 15 V. I think the problem is voltage because when switch to 12 v on universal adapter the ghosting appear - more rare than on oryginal power adapter (there is a difference on voltage - the universal has 0,15V more) . The question is: If they change the power supply to 12 V do they change AVT-8710 hardware or maybe the hardware is the same - need to be powered 15 V?
I will report the progress on gaining voltage - wish me the luck.

I just got an AVT-8710 from B&H, set it all up...and the menu on my VCR ghosted. I'm running S-Video in and composite out at the moment, because that's all I've got in terms of cables (I've ordered a second S-Video cable). I ran a tape through it, and after I stopped it the menu worked fine.

Should I be concerned? I couldn't quite follow the earlier discussion in terms of which numbers were for faulty units and which weren't, and in any event I'm not sure where I should be looking for those numbers. Not too confident about pulling it apart either, TBH.

-- merged --

It's possible I'm going blind, but I can't find an "Edit" button.

Ran composite in and composite out, and it looked fine for a while, then ghosted on the menu again, and it's ghosting through a bad portion of the tape, so...faulty. Five years, and still this problem.

I'm currently in the live chat with B&H, and the tech is trying to tell me ghosting is normal, and then tried to tell me there might be a firmware update.

And there's a green/black one on eBay, which IIRC is the good one, but it has no power supply, and I'm guessing I'm out international postage for a return as well.

There is no "Edit" button on these. Are you trying to use the "proc amp"? Ghosting is not an issue with these chipsets. What you will see is jumpiness and flickering similar to frame skips. I just received one of the green ones from eBay, and you can check that post, but I'm in a rush right now, so all I can confirm is that it turns on and produces color bars. I'll be passing some trashy tapes through it later to confirm, but until I can open it and test it, its your gamble. Units appear to be surplus from University of Washington and the one I received was clean and didn't have any sort of stink to it. That's all I can vouch for at the moment. Power supply is 12v CENTER NEGATIVE 1.25amps if your wondering. I'll try to update ASAP once I can stress test. Sorry to be quick, but I hope this helps.

-- update --

Well, turns out my unit is defective (see http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/prem...html#post42651). Tried different cables, VCR, etc. It produces a garbled picture no matter what you throw at it. This is one from seller 'buyhitek' on eBay.

I got the black one and it doesn't seem to do anything, If there is a spot with damage to the magnetic tape it tries to replace the lost sync signal but it flickers frames, I will keep mine as I only got it for $130 but I will end up selling it later on if I don't find it useful.
http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/vide...vt-8710-a.html

So is the AVT-8710 even worth buying at this point? Is there a similarly priced alternative? It seems like all the other TBCs that have similar prices are all the same device.