Quantcast CCE for KDVD: Bitrate Doesn't Go up 3000 - digitalFAQ.com Forums [Archives]
  #1  
01-09-2004, 09:06 AM
digitall.doc digitall.doc is offline
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Hi all:
keep posting my problems with CCE in this thread, since I use it for KDVD encoding.
The question now is that I'm trying to fit to DVD in a KDVD (Gladiator and Ocean's Eleven). With 720x576 was getting too big, so I changed to template 352x576 in CCE. And suddenly I noticed that max bitrate was set to 2500. Changed it manually, but during encoding the test, it didn't go up 2500-3000 (avg 1100), as it internally had max bitrate at 2500. I tried to load other scripts in CCE with 720x576 template, set at max 5000, but it keeps with max 2500 when encoding. Tried to uninstall and reinstall, and still th same, as it has internally fixed max bitrate at 2500.
Any suggestions about what I can do to solve this?
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  #2  
01-09-2004, 09:59 AM
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You're doing your jobs using CCE in Q-VBR right?

To me it seems that the Q factor also is responsable for the rise of the peaks.

BTW: at 352x576 and using the Notch .... do you really need more than 2500kbit at max??? I do encode all my KDVDs using a max of 3000 @ 704x576 and they do come out perfect, no matter if in uneasy waterscenes or explsions etc. Best example is "Private Ryan" which I encoded also at max=3000.

So at 352x576 and 2500max the VBR will have enough room to "breath", ... or did you recognise ay quality drops at high Bitrate scenes

Another BTW: Ocean's Eleven and Gladiator should easy fit on one KDVD using 704x576, even in anamorph mode. I also encoded these both movies, ... not in this constellation but I do know how they do behave.

Do you predict the movies a way that each of them has to fit to a "half of 4,3GB"??
Thats not the right way, cause maybe one of them needs less space for the same quality which will give more space to the more needed quality of the other movie

So do an AVS Script where both movies are appended and do a prediction accorded to the 4,3GB minus the total amount of MB of the Sound (AC3 5.1). After prediction do enocde both movies using the archieved Q value and you'll end up that exact as the Q based prediction is able to be exact.
And by this both movies incl. audio tracks will fit on that 4.3GB DVD-R
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01-09-2004, 10:31 AM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by incredible
BTW: at 352x576 and using the Notch .... do you really need more than 2500kbit at max??? I do encode all my KDVDs using a max of 3000 @ 704x576 and they do come out perfect, no matter if in uneasy waterscenes or explsions etc. Best example is "Private Ryan" which I encoded also at max=3000.
I trust your eyes but it seems hard to believe. A regular (commercial) DVD encoded at least than 5000 is really awfull. If the Notch Matrix allow to use half of this and have a correct image, it's the eighth wonder

(but I repeat, I trust your eyes !)
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01-09-2004, 10:46 AM
incredible incredible is offline
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Commercial encodings of 5000kbits and other commercial encodings of 5000kbits can be a totally different pairs of shoes (as they say in germany)

In general you're right! But as especially we both know that using AVS and other sexy techniques do offer nice quality outputs at low AVGs - this lets us smile.

I do almost all my encodings afterwards load into Bitrateviewer to see the Qualitys behaviour and other things. Well that's the technical check.
But some times I saw that the Quality factor changed to a bit worse when reaching a Peak .... and in 95% of my encodings when checking that encoding at this part using Zoompayer or Vdub ther'e aren't any blocks etc. and quality is totally ok.
(also if I do a color(luma)sync-like test when rising the gamma to Tv specs using levels etc.)

And thats my intention of THIS reply, to say that bitrateviewer is tricky!, also mb1 at doom9.de found out whe comparing DVD2One and Pinnacle's DVDcopy that in the case of the DVDcopy testing there are some Quality falls in the stream when inspecting using Bitrateviewer, but in real-view it was totally ok.

Did you recognised such a behaviour also?

And thats also my conclusion like yours - I do only trust my eyes
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01-09-2004, 01:24 PM
digitall.doc digitall.doc is offline
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Thanx a lot for your answers friends, but I'm afraid I'll need some help else.
As you advise incredible, I'm predicting (BTW I'm using ping-pong prediction) both films at once, putting them in the same script. But when I tried at 720x576, I got a 2% file size of 72 MB, when predicted file size 2% was 66 MB, at Q 40, that's why I decided to lower resolution. The problem I have, that makes me lower resolution, is I want to put some "extras" in DVD (2 audio tracks and 2 subtitles each film), so I end up with "just" 3200 MB for film (and both films together last more than 4 hours).
I didn't try to encode at max bitrate 2500 (that will raise Q sure!), but if I can encode at 5000 max bitrate with Q less than 40, I'd prfer stay at max 5000 to avoid problems in high action scenes.
Nevertheless, the point of my question was how can I encode again with CCE at max bitrate 5000, and why doesn't work now, after changing to 352x... template (I use template reg files from vmesquita guides)?. And I'm sure it doesn't work well because I encoded animatrix at max 5000, and got bitrate spikes about 5000, with avg 2800...
Help please
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01-10-2004, 06:34 AM
digitall.doc digitall.doc is offline
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Hi all:
I don't know if this is the answer to my problems, I'll tell you. After reinstalling for second time, I tried again to encode with CCE at res 352x576, and avg bitrate 1100 and max bitrate not greater than 2800. Then I load the 720x576 script and... max bitrate at 5100!!.
So... is it possible that lowering resolution to 352x... less max bitrate is needed?, I guess yes, and that it wasn't a problem with the encoder but less bitrate is needed. Don't you think so?.
Now, at 352x... resolution I can raise Q value, but I'm thinking about using bigger resolution (544x or 528x) to get better image. But this resolutions are not compatible with DVD standard. What do you advise me to do?. Do I keep in standard with 352x or can I go to 528x and better image?. But, in the last case, I may have compatibility problems with some standalones, isn't it?. If I finally decide (or if you advise me to) change to 528x res, will DVDpatcher work with IfoEdit and DVDlab?, have you tested that?.
I think that your comments and suggestions will be of a help for everybody, and I'll appreciate them a lot.
Thanx
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