Quantcast TMPGEnc: Vcalc v0.0.5 (Beta), a Pro Bitrate Calculator - digitalFAQ.com Forums [Archives]
  #1  
07-27-2003, 02:28 AM
vhelp vhelp is offline
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----- ----- Welcome to VHELP's 3rd installment tool ----- ----
-- = -- = -- = -- = -- VCALC.EXE -- = -- = -- = -- = -- = --

- --- --- --- --- --- a PRO bitrate calculator --- --- --- --- ---

Lets try this again !! !!




* DOWNLOAD: vcalc.v0.0.5 (beta)
* DOWNLOAD: borland.files.rar

You may need to D/L the Borland files if you can't run the app

WHAT IS IT:
-----------
A tool to calculate bitrates, movie lengths, video size, ave bitrate and
NEW formula for calculating "Ave MIN bitrate" for CQMatic and TMPGEnc - posible
future versions to include other enhancements etc.
Also, equipted with a scaling factor % using a slider to obtain a close
approximation to MS final readout.

NOTES:
* using an experimental mathematical precision proximeter. Default is 0.73%
...when enabled. This is to be used when comparing/debugging w/ MS readout.
Sorry, but I'm alone on this, and I'm doing the best I can, w/ my limited
math skills


LATEST CHANGES - vcalc.exe
------------------------------------------

07.27.03 - v0.0.5 (beta) .. (prev. was v0.0.4)
MAIN INTERFACE
[x] - BUGfix: bitrate off, thanks to Kwag for finding this one.
[x] - Adjust: CDsize (or number of disks) list is expaned..
[x] - Add: precision slider for MS scale factor.. experimental.. (def 0.73)
.......also, slider is Disabled by default.
[ ] - Debug: note, not all error-trapings have ben caught/implemented.

07.26.03 - v0.0.4 (beta) first release..
MAIN INTERFACE
[x] - Add: precision controls for finer settings
[x] - Adjust: all controls have respective HINTS for "what is"
[x] - Adjust: all hints applicable, include "formulas" associated
[x] - Adjust: not exactly placement coordinated, but workable.
[x] - Add: option for "always on top"
[x] - Add: option for change 1024k calc to 1000k calc
[x] - Add: option for modifying (0.57 * AveBitrate) calc precision

PLANNED FEATURES..
[ ] - DVD calcs and things
[ ] - cdSize for DVD ie, 4.3gig
[ ] - Save last project on shutdown.
[ ] - Ouput generator (text formt) (well, you may want one)
[ ] - Save certain NEW values (future discoveries) - maybe


BASIC USE:
-------------------
If you've ever used a bitrate calc before, you should feel at home with
VCALC. If not, just move your mouse pointer over the controls, and read the
hint baloons that pop up. You can also use the crsr up/down, rt/left keys
to adjust the precision sliders and dropdowns.
Anything in cyan (light blue) will be the only fields that needs user inputing.
No other field should be edited in any way! No typing anything in any fields.
And, no decimals either!!


TO USE:
------------------------
1 - First, begin with selecting your CD size. This is your required size (goal)
2 - Next, select your preferd audio bitrate ie, 112k, or 192k for others that
....considers themselves sound gurus.
3 - Then, input your Movie Minutes ie, 128 minutes or 68 minutes etc. For
....finer precisions, drag the "slider bar" left/right to increment minutes.
3a - You can adjust the precidion of decimal (Dec [2]) places. Note that 2 is
.....the default value. Mostly for debuggin purposes.
4 - Finally, watch your bitrates jump out at ya.. well, watch them display.
5 - Special treat.. all controls are WYSIWYG updateable.
.
Update.. 07.27.03
6 - There is now a scale factor for MS equivalence. After enabeling the
......field, MS prec[x], the slider to the right should now begin to activate
......and reflect the new "scaled" bitrate, approximating MS's. It's not
......perfect, but better than nothing, if you're an MS gauger.


SPECIAL NOTES:
----------------------------------
* You'll note a field for [calc 2] this is just another field for "kbits" calculations.
....Just another debuggin aid.
* The field for [Using: [1024k]].. I decided to implement this option to switch
....between 1024k and 1000k because I saw this used in other bitrate calcs and felt
....must serve some purpose. Changing this field (default is 1024k) will reflect
....in changes in calc'ed bitrates etc.
* Speical note, I've incorporated an option to revise the (0.57 * AveBitrate) 's 0.57
....to be variable adjusted, by moving the precision slider. This was a last minute
....decision, in case a change was to be made in the formula.. and last item worked on.
.
Update.. 07.27.03
* incorporated a scaling factor, though experimental. I'm also thinking
....about incorporting a "pivot" pointer. That may narrow the result even
....further, to MS's. I'm thinking about it


THANKS:
---------------------------
* to RazorBlade2000, for his assistance w/ the forumulas, and putting things
....into perspective I could understand, in versions prior to v0.0.4

Enjoy,
-vhelp
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  #2  
07-27-2003, 02:50 AM
kwag kwag is offline
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Looks really nice vhelp
But check your math against Moviestacker. I just compared a 120 minute movie, which gives me an average bitrate of 800Kbps in MS, but only 782.79 in vcalc

Great job
-kwag
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  #3  
07-27-2003, 03:26 AM
jorel jorel is offline
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a new gift vhelp?

thank you, seems great.

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  #4  
07-27-2003, 10:11 AM
vhelp vhelp is offline
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hi Kwag.. and all

Becuase I'm only using the formulas as is - straight.

If you'll notice in vcalc, you'll see I have the formulas inside the HINT
baloons, so that you too, can following how vcalc is calculating/arriving at
the bitrate.. so that if you have issues w/ its calc's, you can correct me,
and I'll be happy to fix - but it's their mainly for those who want to know
how vcalc arrives at the final bitrate. That's all

Below is the formula uesd at arriving at the bitrate (from hint box)

* Value is: (movieSec * audioSize kbits) / 8 / 1024) = final size in MB.

hmmm... LOL ..I just realized.. "where is the above formula in vcalc source code?"
I can't find it !! I wonder what happended to it ??

Oh well, now to find out where to PUT IT!! hehe..

Thanks Kwag, for find the FIRST BUG !! hehe..

-vhelp


Quote:
Originally Posted by kwag
Looks really nice vhelp
But check your math against Moviestacker. I just compared a 120 minute movie, which gives me an average bitrate of 800Kbps in MS, but only 782.79 in vcalc

Great job
-kwag
EDIT: -- ahh, and here's the bad formula:
Code:
var
  i: integer; r: real; s: string;
  r := strToint(txt_calc2.text) / strToint(txt_movieSec.text);
.
and w/ no (movieSec * audioSize kbits) / 8 / 1024) to be found.
The above code-snip is incorrect anyways though.

I'll fix it shortly.
-vhelp
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  #5  
07-27-2003, 11:04 AM
rendalunit rendalunit is offline
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This looks really nice Could you add a number of cds setting? It seems that when I change the cd size to 1600, 2400.. I get the same result as if I were to change the # cds though

great job on this vhelp

ren
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  #6  
07-27-2003, 11:08 AM
jorel jorel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rendalunit
This looks really nice Could you add a number of cds setting? It seems that when I change the cd size to 1600, 2400.. I get the same result as if I were to change the # cds though

great job on this vhelp

ren
great idea friendal,


vhelp, maybe a "custom size"... can you add?
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  #7  
07-27-2003, 11:09 AM
vhelp vhelp is offline
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Hi rendalunit.. pal,

I'd love to implement your ideas, but at the moments, I'm pulling my hair
out, cause of an error in a calculation - thought it was easy, but it's proving
to be a pain in the neck. Cause, the formula I revies (see above) is still
in error. ..the part her: ) / 8 / 1024 is not working. I think I made
a mistake in my understanding, and confused the issue w/ Razor.. that
we were factoring in a calc based on MANUAL "videoSize" and that's causing
me problem w/ the accuracy of the final bitrate, otherwise, it's off by a few
10ths (well, you know what I mean)

Thanks for your interest. I'll get back to ya on this
-vhelp
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  #8  
07-27-2003, 11:58 AM
vhelp vhelp is offline
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@ all..

I think I fixed it. Maybe, a yeah!! But, we'll see

Could someone Please run a few tests for me, using MovieStacker (I don't
have it installed) ??

Using below params, and give me what the Ave Bitrate is:

LN 01 - CDSize: 640 / Aud: 128k / Movie: 104 min. =
LN 02 - CDSize: 700 / Aud: 128k / Movie: 104 min. =
LN 03 - CDSize: 800 / Aud: 128k / Movie: 104 min. =

LN 04 - CDSize: 640 / Aud: 112k / Movie: 104 min. =
LN 05 - CDSize: 640 / Aud: 112k / Movie: 120 min. =
LN 06 - CDSize: 800 / Aud: 224k / Movie: 58 min. =

LN 07 - CDSize: 640 / Aud: 128k / Movie: 104 min. =
LN 08 - CDSize: 640 / Aud: 112k / Movie: 104 min. =
LN 09 - CDSize: 640 / Aud: 96k / Movie: 104 min. =

What I'm doing is test a "widerange" of values.

Please, I would really appreciate it MUCH !!

If all works correctly (or close) I'll release the next version.
I mean, does it really have to be 100% accurate ??
Otherwise, I'll release the next version with more smiles

Thanks again,
-vhelp
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  #9  
07-27-2003, 01:05 PM
rendalunit rendalunit is offline
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hey vhelp,

There's no setting for cd size = 640 in MovieStacker. It's 74, 80, 90 and 99

ren
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  #10  
07-27-2003, 01:38 PM
jorel jorel is offline
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some problems :

when i run the prog show a warning:
'1217.42' is not a valid floating point value
than i click ok
another warning:
'1201.49' is not a valid floating point value
than i click ok again.

the program open but in the botton(brown window)
don't have anything(no numbers).
in every adjust that i try,i got another warning...
and can' t get any result!

i download and unrar the borland files in the same folder.
please vhelp, what is miss in my system?
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  #11  
07-27-2003, 01:58 PM
vhelp vhelp is offline
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@ all..

Unfortunately, I'm taking VCALC down permanentaly, due to the faulty
calculation in final AveBitrate. It's off by 2.19%, but even trying to add
compensate for the 2.19%, it's still not working. Percentage was never my
strong point. And, I can't seem to get it to flow into the formula:

* (strTofloat(txt_calc2.text) / strTofloat(txt_movieSec.text))

which by the way seems to be the correct formula anyways. (see below)

I've exhausted myself on this one field, and it is not matching no matter
what I do to it. I'm using Kwag's first attempts:

* CD size: 800 / Audio: 112k / Movie min: 120

The above is adding up to an aveBitrate of 782.79 based on the
formulas.

I honestly thing that MS is padding the bitrate someone by 2.2% because if
the formulas are the same, MS should be resulting with: 782.79

I can't see having a faulty app here. There's too much going on, and we need
better accuracies w/ these apps. I just feel like not polluting it w/ mine.
So, I'm sorry for disapointing you all.

For the record, below is the formulas and scenario for the movie "Dogma".

Those of you who have D/L'ed the VCALC (good luck) have fun with
the scenario below. Those who didn't D/L, sorry.. isn't worth it, if
it's off by a few numbers. I'm going by MS to be the true giver here

-------------------------------------------

Move Title: "Dogma"

cd Size: 800
audio Size: 112k
video Size: 688 ------ Result base oncdSize-audioSize)

Movie Min: 120

Wanted VS: 704,512 -- Result base on videoSize * 1024 )
Calc2: 5,636,096 ---- Result base on wantedVS * 8 ) (is kbits)
Movie Sec: 7,200 ---- Result base on movineMin * 60 )

AVE BITRATE: 782.79
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  #12  
07-27-2003, 02:22 PM
rendalunit rendalunit is offline
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hi vhelp,

The problem just might be a bug in the formula like not converting kb->mb or something. I've been studying this page to try and figure out where the problem lies- but am getting a headache now

ren
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  #13  
07-27-2003, 03:03 PM
vhelp vhelp is offline
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hi rendalunit..

Quote:
hi vhelp,

The problem just might be a bug in the formula like not converting kb->mb or something. I've been studying this page to try and figure out where the problem lies- but am getting a headache now
Actually, I just came back from my headache nap. But, i"m pretty finished
with this app. That's why I took it off. I didn't think it was worth having
it around if my formula was buggy at the last stage (w/ no answers)
The link, yes, I've ben their. Believe me. The formula is correct. Also,
Razor.. helped me, on these formulas too. But, I did continue doing other
searches on bitrates math, and in the end, my formula stays!!
And, he hasn't (Razor) hasn't said anything either. So, something's def.
ammiss here.
So, I don't know. Only way to know for sure, is to find Mauddib, and
ask for his source code (you do the honors) and/or ask him is he's using
some padding hehe..
Maybe it's a MS thing that needs it for internal calcs or something. I don't
know, but damn that 782.79 seems correct to me.

All in all, if my calcs are correct, then, I wonder how many peoples are
using MS's bitrate as a final answer ? And, what if Kwag incorporates
this same padding into his future bitrate he going to implement into CQMatic ?
Makes me wonder about all those countless issues we've all had with all
the various apps and steps and new ideas that's ben coming along since
MS's release.

Even if MS IS padding, w/ the 2.2% I calculated, using:
-> =$D$1*(D5/D6)-$D$2 - - (from excel)

-> ( 100 * 800/782.79 ) - 100 = 2.19

This is our 2.2% padding I need to add into the formula below:

-> (strTofloat(txt_calc2.text) / strTofloat(txt_movieSec.text)) or,
-> (5,636,096 kbits / 7,200) = 782.79 bitrate (<-- add 2.2% here, to make
......final bitrate 800, as in Kwag's test w/ MS)

I haven't ben able to incorporate it into my aveBitrate formula !!
Any math guru's here ? Theoretically, the 2.2% should work in the final
stage, but it's not. I'm doing something wrong. But, here is what I have
case someone is math guru, and can figure it out (see above)

-vhelp


----------------------------------------------------------

FROM VCDHELP's page:
Quote:
Manually calculate the bitrate
The basic bitrate formula is

(Size - (Audio x Length )) / Length = Video bitrate
L = Lenght of the whole movie in seconds
S = Size you like to use in KB (note 700 MB x 1024° = 716 800 KB)
A = Audio bitrate in KB/s (note 224 kbit/s = 224 / 8° = 28 KB/s)
V = Video bitrate in KB/s, to get kbit/s multiply with 8°.

°8 bit = 1 byte.
°1024 = 1 kilo in the computer world.

Example
90 minutes video, L = 90 x 60 = 5 400 seconds
700 MB CD but be sure that if fits use a bit lower like 695 MB, S = 695 x 1024 = 711 680 KB
Audio bitrate, A = 224 kbit/s / 8 = 28 KB/s

(711 680 - (5400 x 28 ) ) / 5400 = 104 KB/s x 8° = 830 kbit/s.
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  #14  
07-27-2003, 03:24 PM
vhelp vhelp is offline
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Just for those that were curious, and want to tackle the issue w/ their
math wizidry (see above post) ...

MS says 800, but vcalc says 782.79 (2.2% difference)

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  #15  
07-27-2003, 04:18 PM
vhelp vhelp is offline
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Hi Jorel..

Sorry for not responding to this post (below) I missed it.

Since you and Rendalunit are the only ones who D/L'ed it anyways..
I'll see what I can do ta help w/ what you have now. Bare in mind, that
its the last version !! If I make any further enhancements (ie, fix the bug)
I'll keep it to myself. I didn't think that others here would be interested in
another calc. (I knew that) but I wanted to give it a try FWIW.. Anyways..

Ok, the FIX:
Basically, you don't need to reload the Borland files. Especialy if you got
it working w/ my other apps ie, SLIM-G

If you reopen VCALC, don't bother entering in number manually. These
are the error-trappings I was refereing to, that I haven't yet caught all of
them on. Instead, leave these boxes filled in, and only use the dropdown
boxes. Since CDSize is already selected (highlighted) you only need to press
the crsrDN/UP keys (and watch the bitrate values change instantly) same
w/ AudioSize, and MovieMin (click the sliderbar, and crsrRt/Lft for some more fun)

As long as you don't type anything into these boxes, all will work no mater
what. That's why I made the TAB key only browse to the pulldown boxes.
though the MovieMin did escape me (was suppose to be the sliderbar)

Also, if you want to test the (0.57*aveBitrate) w/other values ie, 0.75 you
would check the box ie, min prec.[x] and it will enable the slidebar
for it to change. Just click on th slider (right of [x] box) and using your
crsrRt/Lft keys) see the NEW precision calc before your eyes.

I'm sorry about that nasty calc bug for aveBitrate. It wuold have ben a
great app. I had other feature plans for it, and actually stated to emplement
some of them ie, rens' CD issue etc. but.. - too bad Anyways..

If you can, please enjoy what's left of it, and thanks again for your great
support !!
-vhelp



Quote:
Originally Posted by jorel
some problems :

when i run the prog show a warning:
'1217.42' is not a valid floating point value
than i click ok
another warning:
'1201.49' is not a valid floating point value
than i click ok again.

the program open but in the botton(brown window)
don't have anything(no numbers).
in every adjust that i try,i got another warning...
and can' t get any result!

i download and unrar the borland files in the same folder.
please vhelp, what is miss in my system?
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  #16  
07-27-2003, 05:32 PM
jorel jorel is offline
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vhelp,
i adjust the values like your picture posted.

i don't have the 446.19 (yellow numbers) in the brown(little window).
nothing is there,no one number!
and for each moviment in the prog,
i have the warning with the same advice posted.

my position about your project:
don't need to wrote that we don't want to loose your develop here.
i'm sorry that i can't help you to build it,i don't have knowledge.
but if i could build something like you did,i never will stop.
here we have many many inteligents members like you.
they are wise,friendly and helpful.
maybe one or more of them can help you to
encrease the precision of Vcalc!

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  #17  
07-27-2003, 05:58 PM
vhelp vhelp is offline
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hi jorel..



That's very strange. I just tried it on my other pc, and everything is all
working well. That pc (2nd pc) does not have Delphi 6 installed on it. It's
my test machine (from a newbie point of view) Sometimes, though I forget
to test on it first, before releasing. In any case, it past the test. So, it must
be something you're giving it (value'wise)

Make sure you are NOT using any decimals in your number ie, don't use 1217.42
Just use 1217 (if you must type it in manually, and out of curiosity of what
vcalc would calculate for the bitrate of that CDSize)

CDSize is based on the actual size of the CDR ie, 640, 700, 800 and 900.
I ended up adding in those that ren wanted (before I became stumped w/
the calculation isssue)

I'm not sure why you would need any "." in your numbers though. But,
the reason why you got that error message (and you got stuck with it) was
becuase the format w/in the control does not allow for decimals, and thats
why you got that error, and thats also why it stays, and never dies (like
energizer battery) untill you Ctrl+Alt+Del and close it hard.

Note, if you have any params that you feel or comes out to, w/ decimals,
ie, 128.5 minus, please just use 128 or 129. Don't use any diminals for
CD Size / Audio Size/ and Movie Min

So, just close down VCALC and rerun it.
If I remember correctly, the Borland files go into the \system directory or
in the current foldre of the app ie, VCALC. But you're best to put it into
\system though.

I wish I could just figure out how to incorporate that 2.2% into the formula
(see above) - - RaTtS

Have a great evening all.
-vhelp
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  #18  
07-27-2003, 06:18 PM
jorel jorel is offline
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vhelp,
i was not clear.

i don't put this values there.
when i run the prog,the window with advice show this values
than i click ok twice.then the program came.
if i don't click ok,the prog don't came and the warning
wait for the ok(wait to the click)
(don't know from where it came)

all moviments that i try in the prog i got the same warning
with another number in the advice.
like this:
'xxx.xx' is not a valid floating point value.
then i have to click ok again.
if i try to change the cd size or the audio size,
the warning came again and wait for another ok.

all moviments in the prog give the same advice warning posted.
and no one yellow numbers like your picture posted
show in the brown (little window)
conclusion:
i can't put any number,this warnings show the numbers
"xxx.xx" with the same advice.
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  #19  
07-27-2003, 06:33 PM
vhelp vhelp is offline
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hi jorel..

you know.. in all the futzing around, I just bet that you might have run
out of STACK space. When that happens, your sys resources are very
low. It happended to me today, and my system rebooted on me.

But I'm stumped w/ your xxx.xx error cause I have VCALC running all
afternoon (in right corner w/ [x] stay on top checkeck) cause I'm still
LOL bebbuging this app, and I'm at 35% sys resource remaining under
Windows 98.

But, once you get out of the error message (ctrl+alt+del) and close down
that app, double check your sys resources to make sure you aren't running
low, and then restart VCALC. Again, you should see the same pic at the top
of this page. I keep here (there) for debuggin purposes for you.

The first thing you do when it opens, is just click the [800 [:] box and
make your selection their. You can use the crsrDn/Up if you like. Don't
type anything into the boxes (only crsr bold) to the left of:
[800 ] ... [800 [:]
[112 ] ... [112 [:]

If you're still getting errors message, then your system must have gotten
corrupted due to STACK errors. You may have to reboot

And, remember.. no more decimals ie, "." ok ?
-vhelp
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  #20  
07-27-2003, 06:58 PM
jorel jorel is offline
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again i wrote to you my friend vhelp.
i don't put the decimals

the program show the decimals caming from nowhere


i can't put anything in the prog cos i got the warning advice
in all situations.....before and after i run the prog.
i reboot the system,put the borland files in the program folder
and in the windows system folder....just the same!
the 'xxx.xx' and the warning came after any moviment in the prog.
i don't have any numbers in the bottom of the prog,
only the brown banner.
when the program came all numbers and adjusts are the same like in
your picture posted without the yellow 446.19 number(nothing is there),
but all that i try to change in Vcalc,
the warning back and i have to click " ok" again and again!

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