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  #1  
04-30-2021, 07:00 AM
32pennies 32pennies is offline
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I saw the best alternatives to ATI all in Wonder Cards and I looked into Aja's video solutions and I'd like to know if there is any possible way to capture s-video with an AJA KONA LHe Plus HD-SDI / Analog Video Capture. I want to capture my vhs with it if it is possible. I already have audio figured out but I want to know if it is possible to convert s-video to sdi for capture with this card. I have found blackmagic cards that apper to do this but I'm not sure. I've already had bad experiences with bm so I probably wont buy another bm again.
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  #2  
04-30-2021, 07:13 AM
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You don't want a a Blackmagic card. Wrong path, path of misery, for SD sources.

Specific SDI workflows can work, but it can also be a problematic path.

In general, the path of least resistance is certain know-good USB capture cards. Or better yet, specific AGP/PCI cards for use with dedicated capture systems (and using WinXP).

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  #3  
04-30-2021, 08:29 AM
32pennies 32pennies is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lordsmurf View Post
You don't want a a Blackmagic card. Wrong path, path of misery, for SD sources.

Specific SDI workflows can work, but it can also be a problematic path.

In general, the path of least resistance is certain know-good USB capture cards. Or better yet, specific AGP/PCI cards for use with dedicated capture systems (and using WinXP).
I am currently building a new pc so Im going to have pci slots. Specificly 3 PCIe x16 and 3 PCIe x1. I'd like to not use a usb device if possible. I am looking for the best capture card that can capture many analog sources. I found an Aja Kona LHe Plus for $139. I already have a Creative Sound Blaster SB1510 ZxR PCIe Sound Card for my audio. What card do you recommend?
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04-30-2021, 10:28 AM
32pennies 32pennies is offline
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Ok Ive found a couple solutions. My first solution is to get the Aja FS1 which has an s-video input and an sdi output but that would put me at a really high cost. The FS1 costs $3000. I am going to go with my second option which is to buy a deck with a sdi output like a Sony SVO-5800.
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  #5  
04-30-2021, 06:46 PM
latreche34 latreche34 is offline
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The way Windows 10 is going your best bet is to avoid USB and PCI-HD cards unless you want to install Win 7 in dual boot, A SDI interface card in your desktop is hassle free, works with both Win10 and MAC and drivers are still being produced because it's a professional interface and Microsofft and Apple don't want to miss out on that lucrative industry.

That Black Magic box is a no no, No TBC, No frame synch, it is not good for consumer video sources, The FS1 may not work with VHS as well, Not sure though. If you are spending that much money get a BE75, maybe you can source one out for under $1,500. I have an extra one but not selling it, I keep it as a backup.
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04-30-2021, 08:01 PM
32pennies 32pennies is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by latreche34 View Post
The way Windows 10 is going your best bet is to avoid USB and PCI-HD cards unless you want to install Win 7 in dual boot, A SDI interface card in your desktop is hassle free, works with both Win10 and MAC and drivers are still being produced because it's a professional interface and Microsofft and Apple don't want to miss out on that lucrative industry.

That Black Magic box is a no no, No TBC, No frame synch, it is not good for consumer video sources, The FS1 may not work with VHS as well, Not sure though. If you are spending that much money get a BE75, maybe you can source one out for under $1,500. I have an extra one but not selling it, I keep it as a backup.
Thanks Ive found a better deal on the card and a great deal on a JVC professional vcr with tbc and more than I could ever want. It has 75ohm sdi outputs so it should work with the card. I'll tell you what I got once I buy it.
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  #7  
04-30-2021, 11:17 PM
latreche34 latreche34 is offline
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Just to be clear, the TBC inside a VCR is called a line TBC, An external TBC or the one built in a capture device is called frame TBC, They don't replace each other just like a prybar and a hammer.
I'm not sure about the VCR you have though, It could have a line TBC and some sort of field timing sync. The catch is those VCR's are designed for S-VHS and VHS SP, I doubt they will work with LP recordings. Still having a VCR that captures on its own and output digital SDI is neat.
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  #8  
05-03-2021, 06:25 PM
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I just shake my head at threads like this. It won't work like you're thinking.

Creative audio cards = mostly terrible low-end stuff, barely better than onboard audio (and sometimes worse)

$3k for an Aja card is just plain nuts.

Where did you find a "deal" on a JVC deck? If eBay, be prepared for disappointment.

What exact model JVC deck? Some are as latreche says, some are not.

You need to slow down, not just starting throwing money left and right. Quick way to go broke, and have worthless expensive junk to show for it.

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  #9  
06-09-2021, 11:51 PM
23fps 23fps is offline
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hi all, long time lurker, first time poster.

I'm very interested to hear of anyone's experience with the AJA FS1.

is it a good solution with a DMR-EH57 for Hi8 capture ?

I'm in the (very drawn out) process of digitising my ancient personal Hi8 tapes. I've tried using a Digital8 camcorder with an internal TBC going out to miniDV, which wasn't great (audio sync issues and DV compression). So I bought a mint condition Hi8 camcorder, a BMD intensity shuttle and a very expensive S-Video cable, but the shuttle wasn't happy at all without a TBC. I've been able to source an ES10 as well as an EH57 and can possibly get an AJA FS1 (it's not $3K but it's still fairly pricey). So my pipeline would be:

Hi8 camcorder (S-Video/Stereo RCA) >> DMR-EH57 (S-Video/Stereo RCA passthrough) >> AJA FS1 (S-Video/Stereo RCA in-out) >> BMD shuttle (S-Video/Stereo RCA in -USB 3.0 out) >> USB3 PC Windows 10 (Premiere)

any thoughts very greatly appreciated.
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  #10  
06-10-2021, 12:30 AM
32pennies 32pennies is offline
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I wouldnt go to blackmagic. Ive had bad experiences with the company and I know many other people who have too. What id do is when you get to the fs1 in the pipeline go into it with svideo and a male db25 to rca cable for audio then out with sdi. Connect the sdi a breakout cable or box that goes into an aja lhe. Well that should work if you have a pcie slot open on your pc. I have never converted Hi8 but that is what my approach would be.
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  #11  
06-10-2021, 12:48 AM
32pennies 32pennies is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lordsmurf View Post
I just shake my head at threads like this. It won't work like you're thinking.

Creative audio cards = mostly terrible low-end stuff, barely better than onboard audio (and sometimes worse)

$3k for an Aja card is just plain nuts.

Where did you find a "deal" on a JVC deck? If eBay, be prepared for disappointment.

What exact model JVC deck? Some are as latreche says, some are not.

You need to slow down, not just starting throwing money left and right. Quick way to go broke, and have worthless expensive junk to show for it.
I'm shaking my head at this thread now. I got a JVC BR-S822DXU. It has amazing audio definitely the best I've ever heard off a vcr. But.. big but the video doesn't necessarily work. I realize now that it's not SDI either but it does have svideo. A very very early y/c connector that no one makes anymore svideo. It was a $150 find so Im not too disappointed. I also bought an unknown Victor "Super Collection VHS" vcr, HR-X7 and HR-X5 all for $50 knowing that they wouldn't work. The person has not shipped the HR-X7 which is what I bought it for as it at least "powers on". I'm contacting him to see if he'll actually ship it. My next corse of action is to get an oscilloscope and test from the given video test points on the front panel. I already know what video signals look like and I have a few ideas of what it could be but Im not jumping to any conclusions at the moment. I've already fixed various belts and feeding mechanism problems. After I figure out the video stuff hopefully there isn't much more hidden for me to fix.
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  #12  
06-10-2021, 02:09 PM
latreche34 latreche34 is offline
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DUB connector is for editing, It is not Y/C (S-Video). It has the luma signal and chroma under signal in KHz, before it is converted back to MHz, Most if not all u-Matic machines have that connector. There are workarounds that convert that connector to S-Video but none of of them is a true solution because they take the chroma from composite out which defeats the purpose of using S-Video. There is one guy who managed to tap into the chroma signal right before it enters the composite stage on a u-Matic machine.

Here is a nice write up about SUB connector in u-Matics.

As to the Intensity Shuttle, If it cannot capture a line time based signal from a Hi8 camcorder that goes to show how crappy of a device is and should never be used for SD sources, My Pinnacle 500-USB did way better without an external TBC.
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  #13  
06-10-2021, 02:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by latreche34 View Post
My Pinnacle 500-USB did way better without an external TBC.
You've said this many times, but I need to add something here, having also had 500-USB in the past (sold it long ago). Yes, it did do better than many cards, when fed a signal from a S-VHS VCR with line TBC, but it still was far from flawless. A frame TBC was still required to avoid dropped frames (thus audio sync) and flashing/unstable luma/chroma issues. The standard "what frame TBC is for". Without any TBC, it was no better than anything else.

I don't want newbie goobers piling into eBay, thinking the 500-USB is some magic fix-all card to avoid TBCs. It's not.

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  #14  
06-10-2021, 03:26 PM
latreche34 latreche34 is offline
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Correct, At least not under Windows 10.
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  #15  
06-10-2021, 04:04 PM
hodgey hodgey is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by latreche34 View Post
DUB connector is for editing, It is not Y/C (S-Video).
Those JVC broadcast decks do have a special Y/C connector that looks similar to but is not the same as u-matic dub in/output, I think carries normal chroma like s-video as the connectors literally say Y/C443 and Y/C358 (depending on TV standard).

The BR-S822DXU does also has component outputs if the TBC board is present, and normal composite output, both using BNC connectors (adapters to RCA plugs are easy to find if needed.) It may be easier just to use component out rather than tracking down an S-Video adapter (the signal will be digital component inside the tbc in any case so you don't get a more direct output with S-Video, or at least not if using the TBC).

Even an easycap clone card can handle unstable video input better than the blackmagic intensity shuttles. The shuttles have some bad design flaw either in the hardware or the driver side of things that makes most even slightly imperfect frames come out as just black.

The JVC HR-X7 and X5 are also very interesting decks, they used some digital video circuitry that doesn't seem to appear in any the consumer models released in US or Europe. The western models SVHS decks use a more conventional video ic shared with their cheaper models, with the SVHS ones adding in a 2D or 3D Digital/SVHS board and extra circuitry on top for the extra functionality.
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06-10-2021, 04:18 PM
32pennies 32pennies is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hodgey View Post
Those JVC broadcast decks do have a special Y/C connector that looks similar to but is not the same as u-matic dub in/output, I think carries normal chroma like s-video as the connectors literally say Y/C443 and Y/C358 (depending on TV standard).

The BR-S822DXU does also has component outputs if the TBC board is present, and normal composite output, both using BNC connectors (adapters to RCA plugs are easy to find if needed.) It may be easier just to use component out rather than tracking down an S-Video adapter (the signal will be digital component inside the tbc in any case so you don't get a more direct output with S-Video, or at least not if using the TBC).

Even an easycap clone card can handle unstable video input better than the blackmagic intensity shuttles. The shuttles have some bad design flaw either in the hardware or the driver side of things that makes most even slightly imperfect frames come out as just black.
I'm testing with composite right now but that is good to know. I have the tbcs and it does have component. Though some of the connectors going to the components board were not plugged in when i got it. The linear stereo is definitely amazing on this machine lets hope once I get the head problems figured out that I can say the same about the video. I also found a site that has about every oem part for these machines for a hefty price. I'm going to look at the schematics and trace what controls the heads and test it. Here is also the schematic for the y/c out board if that can show you what type of signal is going through it.


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  #17  
06-10-2021, 04:36 PM
hodgey hodgey is offline
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Looks like it may be featuring both U-matic dub (YC688) and dub connectors with standard YC.
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  #18  
06-10-2021, 04:38 PM
32pennies 32pennies is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hodgey View Post
Looks like it may be featuring both U-matic dub (YC688) and dub connectors with standard YC.
Well then it would if I had the Y/C688 board but I dont. It came optional with the BR-S822DXU along with the tbc which I have.
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  #19  
03-25-2022, 03:56 PM
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In case this his helpful to anyone else: I am capturing from VHS using an Aja Kona LHi with a breakout box.

Source is a Panasonic PV-S7670 VHS player with S-Video output.

I am using an S-Video to BNC Y/C cable, connected to the Y and C BNC connectors on the breakoutbox.

The software is currently vMix

These are 25+ year old VHS tapes that have not been well-cared for.

None the less, the capture quality is actually excellent: I think I am getting all the video quality that was ever encoded on these tapes.

(I happened to have inherited this surplus Kona LHi and thought I'd give it a try.)

Previously I used a cheap Chinese S-Video to HDMI adapter, connected to a Magewell SDI USB Capture Plus (via a Blackmagic HDMI to SDI adapter), going into VMix. This worked, but the colors were not good...even after fiddling with correction in the VMix software.

By comparison, the color on the Kona LHi is spot-on with no correction.

With used Kona cards on eBay for about $250, this isn't a dirt-cheap solution, but it is fairly affordable and gives very good results.
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  #20  
03-25-2022, 05:03 PM
mrmuy97 mrmuy97 is offline
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Of course the HDMI adapter must've looked awful, so don't really need screenshots from that, but would like to see screenshots with the new capture card.

"Maybe that's just where we are now. Tape digitization is now a game where, unless you're building out a serious rig, it's not worth even looking into."
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