Quantcast VHS & SAT to DVD... - digitalFAQ Forum
  #1  
05-21-2004, 03:18 PM
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I am a HUGE boxing fan and have been capping all the fights (ppv's) off my Directv onto dvd's.

I also have thousands of fights on vhs tapes that I wish to do the same with but with not very good luck so far.

I have a Canopus ADVC-100 running firewire into my PC running Windows XP. (I have two other pc's set to the side just for encoding purposes)



2 senarios that I need help and or advice with.



Satelite Capture to DVD:

I have allready been doing this and the results have been pretty good but I would like some advice so that I may improve my results.

I go from my satelite into my ADVC-100 with S-Video and stereo cables both short, heavy, and with gold plated ends and capture with WinDV.. I then cut the fights to the desired lengths with Microsoft's Movie Maker 2.

I have been using TMPGenc Plus (2.5) to convert to mpeg 2 and then using TMPGenc DVD Author to create and or burn the dvd.

What settings should I use for best results in this situation?

ALSO, I just got Canopus Procoder (1.5) as I have heard it does a good job as well but in a much shorter amount of time AND is easier to use, what settings would be best using this software?

The idea is that I will take both suggestions and use them on 1 minutes clips, burn to DVD and see which I like better.





VHS capture to DVD:

This one has given me ALLOT of problems since I cant even get them to look as good as source much less better and after doing some reading I now understand that I should save myself some hassel and buy a JVC HR-S9800 or equivalent.

After I have made this purchase, what settings should I use (again in TMPGenc & Procoder) to get the best results ?

This advice is very important to me so feel free to take your time with the answer as opposed to feeling the need to answer fast. - jmet
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  #2  
05-21-2004, 08:42 PM
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Are you trying to make it 720x480 or 352x480 resolution for the satellite captures?

Trying to collect some more facts before I give advice.

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  #3  
05-22-2004, 02:12 AM
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I have left it at the default in TMPGenc which seems to be 720x480.

Where as Procoder has the same setting as default but its greyed out and can't seem to change it.
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  #4  
05-24-2004, 03:00 PM
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I am very burried under videos atm and need to rebuild my system.

Any suggestions?
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  #5  
05-26-2004, 12:13 PM
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Satellite to DVD, I'm not sure what WINDOWS MOVIE MAKER does, not software I've ever needed to use. If it just cuts and makes a new file, then you're fine. If it has to re-encode a new AVI stream, then I'd suggest against that step.

TMPGENC basic settings should be ones used on the guides on www.digitalFAQ.com. I think 352x480 would be best for you (with 5000 max, 0 min, 85% avg, CQ_VBR), but altering to 8500 max, 3000 min, 90% avg, CQ_VBR for 720x480 should be fine. Ask any specific questions about specific settings if you have any.

For PROCODER, defaults are fine to start with (MPEG2 DVD NTSC). Then alter it to 2-pass VBR and put on HIGHEST QUALITY setting, also change the max bitrate to 9000. This should easily yield the best results. Half D1 with Procoder is a bit more difficult to create a custom profile, that'll be something I add to a guide on my site here in time. Procoder excels at high quality source, which is why I suggest it on these satellite catpures.

All my settings here assume you use AC3 audio.

The JVC 7000/9000-series VCR (or SR-V10U) is a good start for the VHS. I'd use the 352x480 TMPGENC settings for the VHS.

I've been a bit higher on the bitrate than normal, because high action of boxing demands it be peaked out like this.

The answers took a few days because I borrowed a boxing video and tested a few things myself (though captured AVI with ATI card, still similar situation).



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  #6  
05-26-2004, 12:18 PM
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Quote:
Satellite to DVD, I'm not sure what WINDOWS MOVIE MAKER does, not software I've ever needed to use. If it just cuts and makes a new file, then you're fine. If it has to re-encode a new AVI stream, then I'd suggest against that step.

TMPGENC basic settings should be ones used on the guides on www.digitalFAQ.com. I think 352x480 would be best for you (with 5000 max, 0 min, 85% avg, CQ_VBR), but altering to 8500 max, 3000 min, 90% avg, CQ_VBR for 720x480 should be fine. Ask any specific questions about specific settings if you have any.

For PROCODER, defaults are fine to start with (MPEG2 DVD NTSC). Then alter it to 2-pass VBR and put on HIGHEST QUALITY setting, also change the max bitrate to 9000. This should easily yield the best results. Half D1 with Procoder is a bit more difficult to create a custom profile, that'll be something I add to a guide on my site here in time. Procoder excels at high quality source, which is why I suggest it on these satellite catpures.

All my settings here assume you use AC3 audio.

The JVC 7000/9000-series VCR (or SR-V10U) is a good start for the VHS. I'd use the 352x480 TMPGENC settings for the VHS.

I've been a bit higher on the bitrate than normal, because high action of boxing demands it be peaked out like this.

The answers took a few days because I borrowed a boxing video and tested a few things myself (though captured AVI with ATI card, still similar situation).


AC3 huh, I dont play with my audio at all....

Its just boxing so the sound doesnt have to be special, I just want the best image possible.

Will this affect me if I leave audio as it is?

Windows Movie Maker I only use to cut/trim clips then it saves back out as AVI, I dont know if it does anything special to the file.

What would you suggest for simple cutting/trimming of my avis?
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  #7  
05-26-2004, 12:24 PM
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Quote:
Satellite to DVD, I'm not sure what WINDOWS MOVIE MAKER does, not software I've ever needed to use. If it just cuts and makes a new file, then you're fine. If it has to re-encode a new AVI stream, then I'd suggest against that step.

TMPGENC basic settings should be ones used on the guides on www.digitalFAQ.com. I think 352x480 would be best for you (with 5000 max, 0 min, 85% avg, CQ_VBR), but altering to 8500 max, 3000 min, 90% avg, CQ_VBR for 720x480 should be fine. Ask any specific questions about specific settings if you have any.

For PROCODER, defaults are fine to start with (MPEG2 DVD NTSC). Then alter it to 2-pass VBR and put on HIGHEST QUALITY setting, also change the max bitrate to 9000. This should easily yield the best results. Half D1 with Procoder is a bit more difficult to create a custom profile, that'll be something I add to a guide on my site here in time. Procoder excels at high quality source, which is why I suggest it on these satellite catpures.

All my settings here assume you use AC3 audio.

The JVC 7000/9000-series VCR (or SR-V10U) is a good start for the VHS. I'd use the 352x480 TMPGENC settings for the VHS.

I've been a bit higher on the bitrate than normal, because high action of boxing demands it be peaked out like this.

The answers took a few days because I borrowed a boxing video and tested a few things myself (though captured AVI with ATI card, still similar situation).

As for specifics, on the Sat capture and considering that you said Procoder would provide best quality on that.

I only wish to do 60 minutes which is essentially the same as 12 rounds of boxing with ring walks and post fight interviews.

With only the need for 60 minutes, which settings would you suggest using with Procoder?
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  #8  
05-29-2004, 06:21 AM
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There is a max audio/video combined "safe" datarate supported by DVD players, and that's 10.08 MB/s max. Some players can go higher, but not always. PCM audio (WAV/AIFF) is 1.536 MB/s. So be sure your combined datarate does not exceed 10.08. That means 8.4/8.5 is the max video rate you should use. With AC3, you can go up to 9.8 MB/s video with 256k AC3 audio.

For only 60 minutes per DVD, you can easily set it to CBR at the maximum video resolution allowed (depends again on the audio you choose to make). For boxing, I'd go with AC3 to squeeze out all the video bandwidth you can.

Besweet converts to AC3 just fine, as does the new version of TMPGENC DVD Author and DVDit! PE. Only "flaw" of Besweet is it refuses to play on a Pioneer DV333 DVD player (which is the player's fault).


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  #9  
05-29-2004, 07:25 AM
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Quote:
There is a max audio/video combined "safe" datarate supported by DVD players, and that's 10.08 MB/s max. Some players can go higher, but not always. PCM audio (WAV/AIFF) is 1.536 MB/s. So be sure your combined datarate does not exceed 10.08. That means 8.4/8.5 is the max video rate you should use. With AC3, you can go up to 9.8 MB/s video with 256k AC3 audio.

For only 60 minutes per DVD, you can easily set it to CBR at the maximum video resolution allowed (depends again on the audio you choose to make). For boxing, I'd go with AC3 to squeeze out all the video bandwidth you can.

Besweet converts to AC3 just fine, as does the new version of TMPGENC DVD Author and DVDit! PE. Only "flaw" of Besweet is it refuses to play on a Pioneer DV333 DVD player (which is the player's fault).
Using Procoder as you suggested and from going off your guide it looks the best I have done so far.

I have TMPGENC DVD Author, so as I understand it.. I could use that to trim my files instead of "M$ Movie Maker AND have it do the AC3 correct?

Then I could set the bit rate to 10000 as opposed to 9000?
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  #10  
05-29-2004, 07:54 AM
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Max your video should be is 9800. Going over 9000 is pointless, however (that is the plateau for 720x480 resolution, full D1 specs). The audio should be 256k stereo AC3 (plateau for stereo AC3).

If you dumped your captured DV AVI into Procoder, that will encode it. Then you can use TMPGEnc DVD Author to cut off the fat, correct. Encoding stuff you later cut may add extra time, but it may not be much, depending on speed of encode and amount of fat. If you encode overnight like most of us, you'll never even notice extra time.

Procoder batches are also MUCH more reliable the TMPGENC Plus batches (can crash or freeze on a frame).


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  #11  
05-30-2004, 11:57 AM
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I will start having Procoder split audio instead of doing a stream, then use Besweet to convert to AC-3 and load into TMPGEnc DVD Author to burn as I usually do.

Thanks again for the advice...

BTW, AC3ENC.DLL from the 2nd post under "AUDIO EDITING -- General Audio Editing & Restoration" is dead. - jmet
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  #12  
05-30-2004, 03:13 PM
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I fixed the link.
Here it is again: http://www.digitalFAQ.com/downloads/ac3enc.dll

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  #13  
05-31-2004, 03:45 AM
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So quick question as im confused about something, what gives me best picture for fights...

CBR or 2 pass-VBR?
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  #14  
05-31-2004, 11:53 AM
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VBR gives the best quality for anything. Takes longer, but worth the wait. 2-pass is best.

CBR is constant bitrate. Every frame gets the same amount of data bandwidth, whether it needs it or not.

VBR is variable bitrate. It judges which frames need more bandwidth, and gives more where more is needed (without exceeding the max), and then less when less is needed.

Examples: Boxing. CBR. The guy is standing, pic gets 5 (random number). He throws a fast punch, again pic gets 5. The fast punch will likely be blocky.

Examples: Boxing. VBR. The guy is standing, doing nothing, pic gets 2 because not much is needed. He throws a fast punch, now pic gets 9. The fast punch will likely be blocky at low bitrates, so more is added to make it appear smooth and clean quality.

1-pass may work, but that's determined on-the-fly. 2-pass analyzes first, then comes back and encodes with the final analysis it made.

NOTE: This does not apply to TMPGENC! Use CQ_VBR with that software because of how it encodes (2-pass weak on it).


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  #15  
05-31-2004, 02:44 PM
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Thats why my TMPGENC encodes always looked crappy, blocky and pixelated.

Thanks again, I have done my first split fight.. and am playing with the BeSweet wizard now to convert that wav to AC3.
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  #16  
07-20-2004, 02:56 AM
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Just wanted to update you abit and say thanks for all your help.

I have been encoding my audio using AC-3 as you suggested, keeping my video bitrate at 9000.

Everything is looking great!!


I havent purchased a svhs with TBC and DNR yet but will in the next 3-5 months, ill be back asking on your suggestions. I will be looking to pay no more then $400.00 of course.



I also just got Procoder 2 and will start playing with that tonight, a encoding queue has got me excited and am also curiouse about any improvements in quality.


Again thanks for everything and might I suggest that you have a locked thread where you post news of any updates you do on the front page?
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  #17  
07-20-2004, 07:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmet
might I suggest that you have a locked thread where you post news of any updates you do on the front page?
You mean like guide updates?
Hmmm.... maybe I will.

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  #18  
07-20-2004, 01:29 PM
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Yeah, I check back often and have to hunt and peck to see what has been added or changed.

I can understand not having a news section but a simple post that is locked or not just to let us know what youve done would be cool.

I enjoy reading all the updated stuff.
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