Quantcast Sansgrip Filters: Need an Aternative Resize to Gripfit - digitalFAQ.com Forums [Archives]
  #1  
07-01-2004, 09:29 AM
Zyphon Zyphon is offline
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Hi Guys,

I am making a KDVD and backing up Shrek1 and Monster's Inc to one DVD for my kids.

Recently AOL send a CD through my door and on it had some movie trailers and making of from Shrek 2.

Now to stop the kids bothering me to keep playing it on my PC I wanted to convert it to KDVD and have it as say extras on the Shrek1 menu when I author it.

The mpegs were of PAL VCD size 325 x 288. Now I know converting this to KDVD @ DVD res will produce cr#p results but my kids are not really bothered about the quality they just wanted to watch it on their TV.

I used QuEnc to make the m2v files all went well except for one file.

Here is the script used its the 2 VCD to KVCD one.
Code:
directshowsource("E:\Movies\Convert\trailer2.mpg").killaudio()

ConvertToYV12()
BlindPP(cpu=4) 
Blockbuster(method="noise",detail_min=1,detail_max=3,variance=0.1,seed=1) 
Convolution3D(1, 6, 12, 6, 8, 2.8, 0) 
GripCrop(720, 576, overscan=2, source_anamorphic=false) 
GripSize(resizer="LanczosResize") 
Undot() 
TemporalSoften(2,7,7,3,2) 
DCTFilter(1,1,1,1,1,1,0.5,0) 
#Blockbuster(method="noise",detail_min=1,detail_max=10,variance=0.3,seed=5623) 
GripBorders() 
MonitorFilter
All 5 mpegs are PAL VCD res @25fps and all convert fine except for this one.

I get the 'AviSynth caught an access violation blah blah blah'

I was wondering if someone could give me an alternative resize script for this movie other than GripFit.

Thanks in advance.
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  #2  
07-01-2004, 09:38 AM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
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Of course ! Use Moviestacker or, if you don't have it yet on your HD (the DL is link is removed for GPL issue) look for FitCD on the net.

This tool will compute the correct value to use with any internal resizer of avisynth (bilinear, bicubuc, lanczos...)
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  #3  
07-01-2004, 09:38 AM
Prodater64 Prodater64 is offline
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You can use Moviestacker and Bicubicresize or Lanczosresize.
If you post your original resolution, I could help you further.
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07-01-2004, 09:42 AM
Zyphon Zyphon is offline
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Wow thanks guys that's what I call a quick response.

I do have MovieStacker I was one of the lucky one's who got the last version before it was removed.

@Pro

My original resolution was PAL VCD 352 x 288

My target res is 720 x 576.

What is the best resize method to use in MS bicubic presize or lanczos?

EDIT: I just fired up MS and got the following resize params:
Code:
Lanczos:
LanczosResize(688, 382, 68, 144, 344, 288)
Code:
BicubicResize:
BicubicResize(688, 382, 0, 0.6, 68, 144, 344, 288)
Which method is best or is it just a matter of personal taste and preference?

Or indeed does it make any difference.

Info would be really appreciated guys.
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  #5  
07-01-2004, 10:23 AM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zyphon
What is the best resize method to use in MS bicubic presize or lanczos?
For VCD -> DVD enlargement lanczosresize can produce too much artefacts. So let stick to bicubic precise.

Quote:
Which method is best or is it just a matter of personal taste and preference?
Generally it's a matter of taste. But generally we NEVER enlarge a video but always reduce it .

Quote:
Or indeed does it make any difference.
Lanczos generates a picture with edged more sharper. I personally prefer that but others give their choice to the couple Bicubic + asharp. Personnaly I do not like asharp results !

Note: taken alone, bicubic gives a file up to 10% smaller than lanczos.
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  #6  
07-01-2004, 10:25 AM
Prodater64 Prodater64 is offline
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Lanczos sharper than Bicubic sharper than Bilinear.
Is really a taste question.
Somebody tell me that if your source es avi = Bicubic, if your source is DVD = Lanczos. (but i don't know if this can be a generalization)
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07-01-2004, 10:39 AM
Zyphon Zyphon is offline
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Thank you very much Phil and Pro for the info provided on resizing I have learned a lot here today, I really appreciate you taking the time to explain these things to me.

I shall use Bicubic to resize then.
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  #8  
07-01-2004, 10:53 AM
jorel jorel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prodater64
Lanczos sharper than Bicubic sharper than Bilinear.
Is really a taste question.
Somebody tell me that if your source es avi = Bicubic, if your source is DVD = Lanczos. (but i don't know if this can be a generalization)
no,it's not the same!

from avisynth overview:
LanczosResize is an alternative to BicubicResize with high values of c about 0.6 ... 0.75 which produces quite strong sharpening.
It usually offers better quality (fewer artifacts) and a sharp image.

remember that the max c (acceptable) value in Bicubic is 0.6!
From c>0.6 the filter starts to "ring". You won't get real sharpness,
what you'll get is crispening like on a TV set.No negative values are allowed for b. Then stay on b=0.

and in the last avisynth we have:
Lanczos4Resize (added in v2.55) is closely related to LanczosResize (correct name: Lanczos3Resize). The latter uses a 6-tap filter and the former a 8-tap filter to do the resizing. The result is that Lanczos4Resize produces sharper images. Especially usefull when upsizing a clip.

it's not (only) a question of taste (i did "billions" of tests), is from what source you have to what target you want,...
Phil posted very cool explanations with very good taste!
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  #9  
07-01-2004, 11:15 AM
Prodater64 Prodater64 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jorel
Phil posted very cool explanations with very good taste!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dialhot
Cuando ? Cuando vorrei !

Il resizer non e una problema di rizzoluzione della sorgente neancche quella della targetta ! E solo una domanda di piacere e di necessita di "compressibilita".

Bilinear da un file piu piccolo che bicubic, che da une file piu piccolo che Lanczos.

Pero ...

Lanczos da una imagine piu "sharpen" (scuzzi, no so la parola italiana) che bicubic, e bicubic da una imagine piu "sharpen" che bilinear.

Capisci ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Translation
The resizer is not a problem related to source neither target. It is related only with the taste and with "compresibility".
Bilinear gives a file smaller than bicubic. Last one gives a file little bit smaller than Lanczos.

But...

Lanczos gives a picture sharper than bicubic. Last one gives a picture sharper than bilinear.

Do you understand?
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07-01-2004, 11:30 AM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prodater64
Somebody tell me that if your source es avi = Bicubic, if your source is DVD = Lanczos. (but i don't know if this can be a generalization)
Like I was saying in the italian post that you quoted, this is wrong. As you can see in my V4 script (and all other scripts I did here) I use Lanczos anytime.

But I don't know to which test Jorel refers or what he was exactly saying. May be he was talking about the source and target resolution ?
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  #11  
07-01-2004, 11:51 AM
Prodater64 Prodater64 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dialhot
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prodater64
Somebody tell me that if your source es avi = Bicubic, if your source is DVD = Lanczos. (but i don't know if this can be a generalization)
Like I was saying in the italian post that you quoted, this is wrong. As you can see in my V4 script (and all other scripts I did here) I use Lanczos anytime.

But I don't know to which test Jorel refers or what he was exactly saying. May be he was talking about the source and target resolution ?
Well, you can read text between parenthesis. I mean I don't know if what he said me is for all encodes or only for what I asked for. When I found out your Italian forum answer, it was clear for me, and I quoted you because Jorel "quoted" you but with other meaning, and I don't know what jorel is exactly saying too.
Now, i don't know what is the correct answer to the question, as things can change with time, and I don't know resizers named for Jorel.
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  #12  
07-01-2004, 04:51 PM
jorel jorel is offline
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are we crazy?
first i was not answering anything in italian forum,i don't read there...
then don't matter what have in Italian forum about the same or seamless topic, i was answering for what i read here in THIS thread!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Prodater64
Lanczos sharper than Bicubic sharper than Bilinear.
Is really a taste question.
i was trying to explain exact what i wrote. quoting myself:
Quote:
Originally Posted by jorel
no,it's not the same!...
it's not (only) a question of taste (i did "billions" of tests), is from what source you have to what target you want,...
what you don't understand in my answer!?!?!?
please, now i'm more confuse than you!(and feeling stup)
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07-01-2004, 05:00 PM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jorel
first i was not answering anything in italian forum,i don't read there...
We never told you read the italian forum
Quote:
what you don't understand in my answer!?!?!?
We understand that after a lot of test you did, you arrived to the conclusion that the resizer to use depend on what is the source and what is the target.
And I tell exactly the opposite.

So can you explain a little more your point of view ?
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  #14  
07-01-2004, 05:58 PM
jorel jorel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dialhot
We never told you read the italian forum
then i don't understand why Pro quote part of my answer and use the Italian post in his answer for me here! forgeting all that was quoted from Italian forum after my answer now i'm trying to explain:
my answers are for what i read here in this thread only
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zyphon
Which method is best or is it just a matter of personal taste and preference?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dialhot
Generally it's a matter of taste.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jorel
it's not (only) a question of taste,..
atention here, i wrote: it's not ->ONLY<-a question of taste"
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prodater64
Lanczos sharper than Bicubic sharper than Bilinear.
Is really a taste question.
Lanczos,lanczos4 and bicubic sharp the pictures in differents ways and the result is not the same it's not a question of taste ONLY. don't need to copy everything again from the avisynth manual explaining the differences of that resizes,parameters and how lanczos work different of bicubic, need? for this reason i wrote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by jorel
no,it's not the same!...it's not (only) a question of taste,..
atention here again, i wrote: it's not ->ONLY<-a question of taste"


...opposite?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dialhot
Lanczos generates a picture with edged more sharper. I personally prefer that but others give their choice to the couple Bicubic + asharp. Personnaly I do not like asharp results !

Note: taken alone, bicubic gives a file up to 10% smaller than lanczos.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jorel
Phil posted very cool explanations with very good taste!
i agree with that!.... where i posted the the opposite of you

forget the Italian post that was quoted AFTER my answer!
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07-01-2004, 06:17 PM
Prodater64 Prodater64 is offline
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[quote="jorelPhil posted very cool explanations with very good taste! [/quote]

Don't be angry Jorel. You said one thing and call Phil in the sentence over here, and I had read Dialhot that said other thing than you. I translated Italian forum because is the first post that I found. But Dialhot said that is a taste question many times. I saw others post from you where was said that you like this resizer and no other (but only for taste questions), then I would want to know what is the real thing. Don't be angry Jorel. Excuse me if I offense you in any way.
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  #16  
07-01-2004, 06:40 PM
jorel jorel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prodater64
Quote:
Originally Posted by jorel
Phil posted very cool explanations with very good taste!
Don't be angry Jorel. You said one thing and call Phil in the sentence over here, and I had read Dialhot that said other thing than you. I translated Italian forum because is the first post that I found. But Dialhot said that is a taste question many times. I saw others post from you where was said that you like this resizer and no other (but only for taste questions), then I would want to know what is the real thing. Don't be angry Jorel. Excuse me if I offense you in any way.
i'm not angry dear friend Pro,you don't offend me, i was only confused after you quote the Italian forum!
like i wrote,i think that it's not only a question of taste, it's a question of good results...this is our target!
i don't like lanczos for 320x240,i see "moving ants"(as i call) in the edges.
i like asharp(1,2) but depend of the source and i not use in all cases.
for Kdvd,i don't use any resize(no more),i think that 704*480(ntsc) give just a little more compression than without resize(ntsc dvd is always 720*480,right?).....see that here i'm posting my taste but the result is not a question of taste only, we check the quality of the source to know what resize can give better result before encode...well,i always do tons of tests before encode,i don't choose as "blind" X resize and filter standards to encode as "blind"...at the same time seems question of taste but it's not ONLY,depend of the quality of the source and the target that you want!
i'm confuse but clear .....and not clever!
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  #17  
07-01-2004, 07:10 PM
Dialhot Dialhot is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jorel
then i don't understand why Pro quote part of my answer and use the Italian post in his answer for me here!

Look at just above the italian part, that is wrote "Dialhot wrote:"
Quote:
i agree with that!.... where i posted the the opposite of you
For sure if you refuse to take in account what was typed in an other thread you will never understand where you are telling something opposite to what I said !

You said there : "is from what source you have to what target you want"
I said in italian forum AND I CONFIRM HERE NOW AND AGAIN AND NEVERTHELESS : "The (choice of) resizer is not a problem related to source neither target"

There is the opposite !

We never said you are telling HERE the opposite to something I also said HERE ! When a discussion is progressing new things can appears and sometimes they can come FROM OUTSIDE the present discussion.

So can continue the discussion furtehr yes or not ?

The problem is still the same : EXPLAIN YOUR POINT BETTER PLEASE ! And plese do not just copy/paste a manual for that because it's clear that you are understanding it in a different way I am !

So when you say " from what source you have to what target you want" what are you talking about ? What is the words "what" represent ? The format (avi, DVD, KVCD, KDVD) ? The resolution ? What ?

EDIT : forget the question, I read that you anwsered to all that in your last post to Pro.
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  #18  
07-02-2004, 07:50 AM
Zyphon Zyphon is offline
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Hi Guys,

I removed all the GripFit commands from my script and put in the values for Bicubic resize given by MS, now I get this error:

'Evaluate: Unrecognised exception!
(E:\Movies\Convert\SHREK~1.AVS, Line 17)'.

Judging from my script below to me this points to the 'DCTFilter' line.

What have I done wrong guys???

Code:
LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files\MovieStacker\Filters\MPEG2Dec3.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files\MovieStacker\Filters\Undot.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files\MovieStacker\Filters\Convolution3DYV12.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files\MovieStacker\Filters\BlockBuster.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files\MovieStacker\Filters\GripFit_YV12.dll") 
LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files\MovieStacker\Filters\DctFilter.dll") 

directshowsource("E:\Movies\Convert\trailer2.mpg").killaudio()
ConvertToYV12()
BlindPP(cpu=4) 
Blockbuster(method="noise",detail_min=1,detail_max=3,variance=0.1,seed=1) 
Convolution3D(1, 6, 12, 6, 8, 2.8, 0) 
BicubicResize(688, 382, 0, 0.6, 68, 144, 344, 288)
Undot() 
TemporalSoften(2,7,7,3,2) 
DCTFilter(1,1,1,1,1,1,0.5,0) 
#Blockbuster(method="noise",detail_min=1,detail_max=10,variance=0.3,seed=5623) 
MonitorFilter
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  #19  
07-02-2004, 07:51 AM
jorel jorel is offline
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monitorfilter?
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  #20  
07-02-2004, 07:58 AM
Zyphon Zyphon is offline
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Hi Jorge,

No my friend I dont think it's the MonitorFilter as I removed it after your last post just to eliminate it and the error was still there.

Im sure it has something to do with the DCTFilter as when I counted down to 17 lines I encluded the empty lines also.

I could be wrong though and I usually am lol.
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