Quantcast KVCD: Easy Way to Convert 23.976 fps to 29.97 fps? - digitalFAQ.com Forums [Archives]
  #1  
07-24-2003, 02:05 PM
D Rated D Rated is offline
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Is there a simple way to convert a 23.976 movie to 29.97? I've read some posts but haven't seen anything relating to exactly what I want to do.

My standalone (Philips 724) doesn't like the 23.976 framerate, it skips and drops audio. This has happened on my conversions as well as the sample Kwag has posted (hbo-cap2 is the filename, I believe). 29.97 plays perfect. PAL at 25 plays fine too.

So, what's the best way to convert to 29.97 from a 23.976 source, while keeping the audio in sync? Are there Avisynth functions that will produce adequate results (I know there is ConvertFPS and AssumeFPS, but wasn't sure if either is what I am looking for). Would I want to do the conversion from within my AVS script, or would I want to produce the M1V (or possibly multiplexed MPEG) and then run pulldown or another tool to get to 29.97? And of course, would I need to do anything with the audio conversion (WAV --> MP2) to keep this synced up?

Thanks for any help.
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  #2  
07-24-2003, 02:45 PM
audi2honda audi2honda is offline
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Use telecide() and decimate() from the decomb.dll

Read the readme that comes in the zip file when you download it. Near the bottom are some very good examples of how to do exactly what you want.

I use the values in the examples to convert 29fps to 23fps and it works perfectly, but it can do the opposite too.
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  #3  
07-24-2003, 03:01 PM
D Rated D Rated is offline
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Thanks, I'll work with that a bit when I get home tonight and post results.

Doing this just adds frames and doesn't 'stretch' the video's length in time, correct? In other words, the audio MP2 should sync correctly with the output from the script with telecide() and decimate()?
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  #4  
07-24-2003, 03:46 PM
ak47 ak47 is offline
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I don't think decomb can add frames since decimate mean to remove. But if it's an mpeg2 movie you can use a program called Pulldown.exe (from doom9.org (on the full software)) so you don't have to recode it and won't gain file size.
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  #5  
07-24-2003, 04:00 PM
D Rated D Rated is offline
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I'll probably try pulldown as well. My output target format is MPEG1, and I thought that you could only run pulldown on MPEG2. However, when doing research on this within another post Kwag said that you can indeed run pulldown on MPEG1. Here's that thread:

http://www.kvcd.net/forum/viewtopic....ersion&start=0

I'll give that a shot too and see how it works.
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  #6  
07-24-2003, 07:18 PM
kwag kwag is offline
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Hi D Rated,

The pulldown in MPEG-1 is all screwed up. It makes your audio completely out of sync
I gave up on that
I suggest you encode as MPEG-2 at 23.976fps with 2:3 pulldown, and that way you'll keep your FILM quality, and the DVD player will see it as 29.97fps.
Just use Telecide() and Decimate() in your script, and set 3:2 in TMPEG, and encode at 23.976fps.

-kwag
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  #7  
07-25-2003, 06:58 AM
D Rated D Rated is offline
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You're right Kwag, I ran pulldown against my M1V and got some really strange results. In my standalone player, the video played much faster than the audio, so it was out of sync from the start. However, Media Player reported the movie time of the M1V to be almost 3 hours, with the original being about half of that.

I'll work with telecide and decimate and the suggestions from you guys today to see what happens.
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  #8  
07-25-2003, 07:29 AM
D Rated D Rated is offline
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So I took a 4 minute sample from the AVI, so that I could test this process a bit quicker. When I load the optimal 2.08 script, everything is fine, and the ToK log is shown below:

Code:
=============================================================
ToK Log: C:\Program Files\AviSynth2\avisynth2-kvcd.avs
=============================================================
 
Resolution (fps):352x480 (23.976 fps)
Total Frames: 5750
Total Time  : 00:04:00
-------------------------------------------------------------
However, when I add telecide() and decimate() to the script, I get the following error: I can't understand the framerate of your video.

The ToK log now says:

Code:
=============================================================
ToK Log: C:\Program Files\AviSynth2\avisynth2-kvcd.avs
=============================================================
 
Resolution (fps):352x480 (19.181 fps)
Total Frames: 4600
Total Time  : 00:04:00
-------------------------------------------------------------
I notice the framerate is now 19.181, and I know that isn't right. Am I missing some parameters in the telecide() and decimate() functions?
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  #9  
07-26-2003, 01:45 PM
incognito incognito is offline
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I'm running into the same problem now.

Quote:
LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files\MovieStacker\Filters\MPEG2Dec.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files\MovieStacker\Filters\DecombLegacy.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files\MovieStacker\Filters\DustV5.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files\MovieStacker\Filters\UnFilter.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files\MovieStacker\Filters\LegalClip.dll")

AviSource("G:\Ripps\Narc.avi", false)
LegalClip()
Telecide(guide=0, gthresh=30, post=true, threshold=15, dthreshold=9, blend=true, show=false, agg=false, reverse=false, firstlast=false, chroma=false, nt=0, mm=0)
Decimate(cycle=5, mode=0, threshold=0, threshold2=3, quality=2, show=false)
BicubicResize(352, 174, 1/3, 1/3, 9, 0, 574, 320)
SpaceDust()
UnFilter(50, 50)
MergeChroma(blur(1.58))
MergeLuma(blur(0.2))
AddBorders(0, 33, 0, 33)
LegalClip()
Quote:
================================================== ===========
ToK Log: G:\Ripps\NewScript.avs
================================================== ===========

Resolution (fps):352x240 (19.181 fps)
Total Frames: 121131
Total Time : 01:45:15
-------------------------------------------------------------
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  #10  
07-28-2003, 12:31 AM
urban tec urban tec is offline
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Unless I am mistaken your source is 23.976, run pulldown on the resultat m2v file and remove telecide and decimate from your script.
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  #11  
07-28-2003, 06:07 AM
Dano Dano is offline
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Pulldown does work quite well on mpeg-1 actually. Run pulldown on your .m1v, if you use DoPulldown.exe like me you need to rename your .m1v to .mpv. Mux with bbMpeg as SVCD and under the Pulldown dialog box select 2:3 pulldown, if you leave it on auto it does not detect the pulldown flag.

-Dano
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  #12  
07-28-2003, 02:53 PM
kwag kwag is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dano
Pulldown does work quite well on mpeg-1 actually. Run pulldown on your .m1v, if you use DoPulldown.exe like me you need to rename your .m1v to .mpv. Mux with bbMpeg as SVCD and under the Pulldown dialog box select 2:3 pulldown, if you leave it on auto it does not detect the pulldown flag.

-Dano
But then, aren't you taking the 3:2 out again, and your frame rate will then be read again as 23.976
Then, it can't be imported into DVD authoring programs

-kwag
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  #13  
07-28-2003, 03:51 PM
incognito incognito is offline
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So kwag what is the best way to do it? I have a ton of avis I'd like to re-encode.
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  #14  
07-28-2003, 05:33 PM
Dano Dano is offline
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Kwag, while 3:2 pulldown does exist it is very uncommon and I have yet to see it. Almost all telecined material uses 2:3 pulldown even though it is often referred to as 3:2. When I mux mpeg-2 in bbMpeg that has already had pulldown applied I leave the dialog box on 'Auto" and the log says "2:3 pulldown detected" Now when I mux an svcd using mpeg-1 bbMpeg does not look for the pulldown flag and that is why I have to select 2:3 pulldown. Apparently, bbMpeg does not apply pulldown but only looks for the flag because if I take a mpeg-1 that has not been pulldowned and check 2:3 pulldown bbMpeg does nothing to the file. All I know is that my Apex AD-5131 plays it perfectly whereas it could not otherwise. I was very surprised since this player is less compatible than my Apex AD-500W, it will not play KVCD's with less than 500kb as a min., but the 500W will.

-Dano
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  #15  
07-28-2003, 05:44 PM
kwag kwag is offline
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Thanks Dano
I'm giving that a try later

-kwag
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  #16  
07-28-2003, 06:11 PM
Dano Dano is offline
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No, thank you Kwag. You gave me the idea in the first place.

http://www.kvcd.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=677

-Dano
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  #17  
07-29-2003, 01:16 PM
D Rated D Rated is offline
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Anymore news on this?

@Kwag: did you get to run your test?

@Dano: Can you explain your process a little more, or tell me if I did anything wrong? I encoded a 2 minute of an AVI (23.976 FPS) sample using ToK at 352x480 resolution. I was left with an M1V file that was at 23.976 FPS. I ran pulldown on this file (using PullDownBatchFE as the FrontEnd) and it outputs an M2V file, which runs at 29.97. I muxed this using bbmpeg as SVCD with 2:3 pulldown. This gave me an MPEG file which, while the audio is fine, speeds up and slows down in my standalone. Any suggestions, or did I do something wrong in the process? I didn't do any conversions on the MP2, I assume if I get this to work I'll need to change the MP2 within BeSweet to sync with the new 29.97 FPS.
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  #18  
07-29-2003, 01:57 PM
Dano Dano is offline
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Sounds like you did it right as far as pulldown goes, so I think it is more likely something to do with your encode or your source. What is the .avi of, is it a capture, dvd, etc.?

-Dano
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  #19  
07-29-2003, 02:10 PM
D Rated D Rated is offline
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It's an XVID Avi. I can't give you all the specs b/c I am at work, but I can edit this post when I get home to give you the resolution, bitrates, etc.
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  #20  
07-29-2003, 02:12 PM
kwag kwag is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D Rated

@Kwag: did you get to run your test?
Not yet. Too busy with CQMatic

-kwag
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