Panasonic AG4700 and HS1000 heads?

[ofesad]

Hi guys, Marcelo here from Argentina.

I currently own four AG4700's. 3 in working order and one for parts.
First let me say that there are two versions of the AG4700's:

The first model is the most known has a front panel the look like this:



a little more detail:









And then you have the second model, or like I called: "the M2 model" (or just Model 2):









As you can see there are less buttons, a new switch and some new indicators.

Less buttons:

and the extra switch:


And the panel:



If anyone had some experience with these, please let me know. I still haven't found a way to turn the M1 and M2 indicadors or even what it does.


Anyway, this thread it's about heads.


Finally, after months and months of waiting, a friend o mine sold me his AG4700, wich is the "M2" model I mentioned.

When inspecting this AG4700 the video head is different from any other AG4700 I have.

Heres' a pic:


As you can see, this head is a VEH0651, wich is the SAME used in the HS1000 (according to the Service Manual)!

Also, the AG4700 (and all the other AG4700 I have) uses the VXP1747.

Like these:




HOWEVER.

I found in this site a post by dcmatt (Panasonic NV-HS1000 video is jumping?)

And there you can see his HS1000 head:


wich is a VXP1747.

So, my theories are:

A) Someone, sometime long ago switched the upperd head of the AG4700 from VXP1747 to a VEH0651. Wich seems to be possible. (or the entire deck, since both are K mechanisms and are exactly the same).

B) At some point Panasonic decided switch the VXP1747 to VEH0651 heads. Since this is one of the late AG4700's, could be it has the "new" head.



Weirdly enough, in our local electronic market theres a guy selling two used videoheads...
you guess'd wich models? VEH0651 and VXP1747.


So, for those with HS1000 and AG4700 decks looking for heads, look for VXP1747 or more probably to found: VEH0651.

[hodgey]

There are two versions/revisions of the HS1000 (and the TBC-less HS800). It's noted in the start ofthis service manual. The video head drum and much of the electronics were altered. We got the early version of the NV-HS1000 here, with the VEH0651 cylinder. It's quite likely the same is true for the AG4700. Additionally there are several versions of each revision with different tuners and NICAM/no NICAM, but the difference between those should be irrelevant to video capture.

Quote:

Weirdly enough, in our local electronic market theres a guy selling two used videoheads...
you guess'd wich models? VEH0651 and VXP1747.

Ah that's neat.

[Quasipal]

Thanks for this. Never fully knew myself. In the UK we never had the standards switch option. Makes me wonder if these are machines intended for different markets and made on different assembly lines. Like the PAL and NTSC decks - quite a few differences between them despite supposedly only one being PAL and one NTSC.

All the best, Ian

[ofesad]

A little more instrospective about the AG4700's.

Like I mentioned I own four of these decks.

2 model 1 (1 working, 1 for spares)
2 model 2 (both working)

Deck 1: Model 1
Deck 2: Model 2 (bought togheter with Deck 1)
Deck 3: Model 1 (for parts)
Deck 4: Model 2 (bought past sunday)

Here are the Serials and models of the first model (the Model 1):

Deck 1: AG4700EY


Deck 3: AG4700EY


Both of those machines uses the same head, the VXP1747.

As you see, they are identical in model and serials.


And the Model 2:

Here's where it gets interesting...

This Model 2, came with the first Model 1: I buy'em from a school that used to teach editing for spots and stuff like that. It has a VXP1747 head:

Deck 2: AG4700BY


This is the latest deck I bought, just past sunday, it's the Model 2 with the VEH0651 head.
Deck 4: AG4700B



Both Deck 1 and 3: have some certification logos of approvals (I don't recognise where are they from). CE certification. Also, at the bottom writes: VGN7594 in both decks.
Deck 2 has the British Electrotechnical Approvals Board (BEAB approval). At the bottom writes: VGN7595
Deck 4: Seems to be older than the others, cause it doesn't have any certification. In fact... how could they sell'em with no CE certification? At the bottom writes VGN7250

[Tester]

The "M1" and "M2" ("MONO-1" and "MONO-2") indicators are (were) active during the reception of bilingual broadcasts/signals (esp. NICAM). The tuner would select "M1" by default. You could then monitor the "M2" audio, or both combined, with the "audio out" button. Both M1 and M2 would be recorded on tape regardless of this setting (M1→L, M2→R).

[editman21]

In case anyone comes back here looking for information on the AG-4700 units (I am planning on buying one), here is some useful information:

Version 1: AG-4700E and AG-4700B
Version 2: AG-4700EY and AG-4700BY

The upper cylinder (heads) that shipped in the original AG-4700E/B was the VEH0651
The upper cylinder for the AG-4700EY/BY was originally the VXP1747, which was later replaced by the newer VXP1561.

ALSO: If you want to know when your Panasonic VCR was BUILT, it's easy to tell from the first two characters of the serial number. The first character is a letter corresponding to the first 12 letters of the alphabet...that's your month. A=Jan B=Feb and so on... the second is the last number of the year (you have to know the period the model is from) KD is the factory (likely Kadoma, Osaka) and the rest is the sequence number (higher is newer).

The first two units pictured (above) start with "D9" so those were built in April 1999
The next one starts with "B6" which was built February 1996
The last one is "A5"....January 1995 (one of the very first ones built, I'm guessing)

[Traderbam]

I've inherited an AG4700 but the head drum number is VEH0467 which seems to be different from the 2 model numbers mentioned in this thread. Does anyone know what this is out of, and is it likely to be a reasonable transplant or will it give less good performance?

[ofesad]

That's kinda weird. The VEH0467 head was mostly found in the NV-FS90 and NV-V8000 decks. Both S-VHS decks.
I was checking the pictures and even if the mechanism looks different from the Ag4700, the heads look similar.
Is good news for me, sin I have 2 non-working FS90

Still tho, ain't rare that Panasonic used different heads on the same machine, but also could have been done by some repair technician.

One of the decks I got, had a head from the HS1000 (wich is the same as AG4700) and the owner confirmed that was replaced, but he didnt know that was changed to another model. Of course, it works the same.

I wouldnt worry too much, if it works, it works.

Ofesad.

[Traderbam]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ofesad

That's kinda weird. The VEH0467 head was mostly found in the NV-FS90 and NV-V8000 decks. Both S-VHS decks.
I was checking the pictures and even if the mechanism looks different from the Ag4700, the heads look similar.
Is good news for me, sin I have 2 non-working FS90

Still tho, ain't rare that Panasonic used different heads on the same machine, but also could have been done by some repair technician.

One of the decks I got, had a head from the HS1000 (wich is the same as AG4700) and the owner confirmed that was replaced, but he didnt know that was changed to another model. Of course, it works the same.

I wouldnt worry too much, if it works, it works.

Ofesad.

Thanks for that. It does seem that the VEH0467 was the standard head in the FS200 and it is listed as one of the top decks so it'll be fine for me. Let's hope it keeps working.

[editman21]

VEH0467 is an upper drum used on PAL decks like the NV-FS90 / NV-FS200 (and FS88/V8000). It isn’t the part that originally shipped in the AG-4700, but many parts lists show it as interchangeable with VEH0651 (the AG-4700E/B spec), so it’s very plausibly a past repair transplant. If the machine is aligned correctly, performance should be comparable.
Some catalogs explicitly group VEH0467 with VEH0651 (and VEH0454) as equivalent 7-head S-VHS drums for the FS88/90/100/200/V8000 family—i.e., same K-mechanism lineage—which is why you sometimes find an AG-4700 carrying a VEH0467 after service. If the machine is aligned correctly, performance should be comparable.