Panasonic AG-W1, best VHS video capture method?

[digivcr]

Hi,

I've this VHS player and I use Elgato video capture. The Elgato software doesn't allow very limited options to capture the video the best possible way.

I wonder if anyone can suggest a better method/ option to capture the best possible VHS video capture.
I also open to any other device and/or option recommendation(s).

Thanks

[Eric-Jan]

Do you already have some options ? suggestion only have value, if you can get hold of that device, other factors are also important,
do you have already stable OS on your pc or laptop, do you have a lot of tapes to capture, and how much money do you want to spend ?
VCR's or capture devices are hit or miss, so try many of these before trying any of the more expensive devices, like TBC's, A TBC needs more knowledge anyway.
A VCR/DVD recorder combo can also be an option, as a direct solution or as passthrough, although composite or s-video as passthrough will give side effects, like dot crawling.

[lingyi]

Discussed numerous times on this forum and at videohelp.com. Start by reading these doing a search on both forums and stating what type of video formats you're working with, then read the following threads:

http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/vide...ing-guide.html Note that the AG-W1 isn't generally recommended.

http://www.digitalfaq.com/editorials...g-workflow.htm Everything except the cameras and the number of VCRs and TBCs (you can probably get by with one of each) applies.

http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/mark...-workflow.html

Then be prepared to put in a good amount of time learning and tweaking the hardware and software to get the "best quality" which is an elusive goal.

[Eric-Jan]

www.videohelp.com is also a good website with a forum, with more "neutral" opinions and views.
Yes, "*best quality* which is an elusive goal" because the resolution is very low to start with indeed....
The less you have to do to it, the better it is. (money wise, and the workflow)
The resolution was only meant for a CRT, and not a large screen, which shows far more detail.
www.videohelp.com will also show you which tools there are, to use, for any OS.
More research work is needed from your side, there is no readymade answer for capturing (VHS) analog video,

[lingyi]

I disagree with "The less you have to do to it, the better it is. (money wise, and the workflow)". It's actually the more you do pre-capture the better it is. Quality VCR, quality TBC, quality capture device all connected via S-video and tweaked (the VCR settings, including tracking, turning the internal TBC on/of, turning Edit mode on/off, setting Noise Reduction on/of, etc). It's not just a set it once and forget thing.

Oh, I don't know if you've ever read the thread, but at videohelp.com, there was a guy who claimed he had a dozen secret tweaks that he never revealed or even gave hints about, but claimed were real. He was obviously ripped apart and never returned.

[Eric-Jan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lingyi

I disagree with "The less you have to do to it, the better it is. (money wise, and the workflow)". It's actually the more you do pre-capture the better it is. Quality VCR, quality TBC, quality capture device all connected via S-video and tweaked (the VCR settings, including tracking, turning the internal TBC on/of, turning Edit mode on/off, setting Noise Reduction on/of, etc). It's not just a set it once and forget thing.

Oh, I don't know if you've ever read the thread, but at videohelp.com, there was a guy who claimed he had a dozen secret tweaks that he never revealed or even gave hints about, but claimed were real. He was obviously ripped apart and never returned.

Yes, that's exactly what i mean, one should not expect miracles from random VCR's or random capture devices, and not any TBC device will be a good choice in any case, it's the experience from other people who will share that, to re-create that.
Also, one needs a good working computer to start with.

[lordsmurf]

Quote:

Originally Posted by digivcr

I've this VHS player and I use Elgato video capture. The Elgato software doesn't allow very limited options to capture the video the best possible way.
I wonder if anyone can suggest a better method/ option to capture the best possible VHS video capture.
I also open to any other device and/or option recommendation(s).
Thanks

You need a better capture card. For USB, ATI 600, clones, certain Pinnacles, etc. What works depends on the OS in use. See also the marketplace subforum, some available for sale in there. Elgato has no real model numbers, so hard to guess which exact Elgato it is, also understanding almost all Elgato are terrible.

The AG-W1 is not great. Even if expensive, and multi-format, it's just a low-end consumer-grade VHS VCR. The signal output is pretty lousy. It doesn't at all compare to better decks, referring to S-VHS VCRs from Panasonic and JVC, with line TBCs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric-Jan

suggestion only have value, if you can get hold of that device

You can get almost anything anywhere, unless you live in some isolated location that (apparently) only has internet and not mail. Even Antarctica gets mail.

Quote:

before trying any of the more expensive devices, like TBC's, A TBC needs more knowledge anyway.

TBC is not optional. All VHS needs some sort of timing/timebase correction.
TBC doesn't need any knowledge to use. Plug in input cable, plug in output cable, turn on. The device does all the work, you don't do anything. (Yes, some models have optional proc amps. And then not-suggested broadcast models have various tweaks.)

Quote:

Originally Posted by lingyi

http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/mark...-workflow.html
Then be prepared to put in a good amount of time learning and tweaking the hardware and software to get the "best quality" which is an elusive goal.

Well, an advantage of getting my hardware is that much of the learning/tweaking is taken out of the equation. I try to make it as plug-and-play as possible. The most challenging aspect is usually getting the capture card installed, and generally because the person insists on using Win8/10 OS, Linux, or Mac. Those OS often work, but it can be a PITA, as those OS are video-unfriendly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric-Jan

with more "neutral" opinions and views.

WTF? The same capture advice here is there same capture advice there. Use good VCR, TBC, capture card. Not just whatever you want, not ignoring advice from experts in the field (both pros and seasoned hobbyists alike).

Quote:

Yes, "*best quality* which is an elusive goal" because the resolution is very low to start with indeed....

Resolution is simply 1 aspect of video, and it's generally even a make-or-break aspect. When it comes to capture, the hardware is what matters. Then the settings. And not just of resolution, but fps, AR, chroma, noise patterning, etc. Video isn't easy, but neither is it impossible, nor require a degree or formal education. It requires only reading and comprehension.

Quote:

The less you have to do to it, the better it is. (money wise, and the workflow)

I agree. But some aspects are non-optional. (And like Sheldon, you should just nod your head in understanding, not argue. "Ah!") Nor should you cut corners, and pay the price instead with lowered quality. Get what's needed. Buy it, use it, resell it. I'm also amused by the number of folks who will buy an expensive Blackmagic/Magewell card (not needed, not recommended), then skimp on the VCR/TBC (instead of putting funds toward this more-important hardware). Priorities?

Quote:

The resolution was only meant for a CRT, and not a large screen, which shows far more detail.

Yep. Old TVs hid problems. Modern HDTVs show you all the warts that need to be addressed/removed.

Quote:

More research work is needed from your side, there is no readymade answer for capturing (VHS) analog video,

Yep.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lingyi

. It's not just a set it once and forget thing.

Yep.

Quote:

Oh, I don't know if you've ever read the thread, but at videohelp.com, there was a guy who claimed he had a dozen secret tweaks that he never revealed or even gave hints about, but claimed were real. He was obviously ripped apart and never returned.

Don't forget about the guy who claimed to have a Ph.D in video encoding. In reality, he pulled a KVCD, trying to insist NR tweaks were a "new format" (that he wanted to sell for big bucks). He was ridiculed out of there, a snakeoil peddling moron.

The one you refer to was the guy who had an IMDB credit for editing a video (editing != capturing, difference skill set), claimed to have a secret sauce, and yet almost all of his information was jabberwocky nonsense or outright false.

Baldrick was too kind, we'd have banned those dipsticks without hesitation. This is a no-BS site, as exemplified from having a Myth/Misinformation subforum. I have no patience for that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric-Jan

Yes, that's exactly what i mean, one should not expect miracles from random VCR's or random capture devices, and not any TBC device will be a good choice in any case, it's the experience from other people who will share that, to re-create that.
Also, one needs a good working computer to start with.

Yep, all true.

[digivcr]

Thanks guys for your valuable inputs. I didn't pay enough attention to the specs when I bought AG1 assuming it will be good since it's a pro VCR and all I wanted a multi-format capable VCR at the time.

I do have an HP Z Workstation running Windows and have a mac-mini as well. I would go through the links provided to find a good option to capture the VHS I've. All I want is to capture them as is the video/audio quality they offer.

Thanks

[digivcr]

Does anyone know where can I find the operation and service manual of AG1 ?
Thanks

[Eric-Jan]

What i do, is google for it, most of the time a site called ManualsLib will have one for you, even service manuals, which sometimes give codes for service mode's or explain certain error codes you get on the VCR display.
Also do experiments with a VCR you got hold of, try all features to discover which give best results, in de past there have been
many different types of VHS VCR's with different options/features, connections, i have good experiences with my combo recorder, and one that has build-in quasi TBC, i say "quasi" because you can't compair this with a pro-TBC, and even any pro-TBC is a one time solution what i've heard about that, i don't have any experience with such a device, because i lack the knowledge for that, and didn't want to spend money on that.
https://www.manualslib.com has lots of manuals, and it's handy to find out what kind of features a certain VCR has.

btw. isn't that the AG-W1 or other type name ?
The manual for the AG-W1 i could not find anywhere, also not listed on this site....
I did find a 17 page (not complete) NV-W1E manual, but don't know if that's the same...

[latreche34]

Quote:

Originally Posted by digivcr

Thanks guys for your valuable inputs. I didn't pay enough attention to the specs when I bought AG1 assuming it will be good since it's a pro VCR and all I wanted a multi-format capable VCR at the time.

It is not a pro VCR, Professionals work on a single standard. If you want better quality you would want a S-VHS VCR to playback VHS tapes. a line TBC option is a plus but the price will be higher.

[Eric-Jan]

As long the as the recorder does it by the normal standard for PAL or NTSC it's o.k. but some of them "twist" it,
like PAL60 or NTSC50 it will play okay on a tv, but will give problems for capturing.
These multi standard VCR's are not "that" advanced for capturing to pc, maybe as source for a passthrough device, but only for one tv system, depending on the passthrough device.
It comes down to that you want a good JVC or Panasonic VHS VCR, with the more advanced features.
most of the the time you see advanced edit features on such a VCR.
Sound will be HiFi, which means it's not only recorded on the narrow analog track, but also as PCM "under" the video track, but only if the original recorded tape has this also. (HiFi sound became standard on most VCR's)
Through a s-video connection video quality will be slightly better.
cables should not be too long, to prevent signal loss or external interference.
Old plasma screens nearby can also cause interference to a vcr, but these days it's unlikely these are still around