Go Back    Forum > Digital Video > Video Project Help > Capture, Record, Transfer

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1  
02-03-2020, 01:33 PM
ChunkDaMan ChunkDaMan is offline
Free Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: United States
Posts: 36
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Just a quickie question.
I'm aware the Prime Image TBC/Freeze II isn't a praised external TBC compared to the Datavideo TBC-1000 and the AVT-8710, but obviously the two external TBCs are expensive as iPhones. Looking around the forums here and at VideoHelp (even Reddit), they say the Panasonic ES-10/15 DVD recorder has a "TBC-ish passthrough" and can perform its sync job fine, though not good as the two godly TBCs.

I'm looking to [slowly] rank up my external TBC setup, does the Panasonic ES-10/15 perform a better external sync job than the TBC/Freeze II? Luckily my TBC/Freeze II is doing a good job (especially the sharpening settings). Thanks.
Reply With Quote
Someday, 12:01 PM
admin's Avatar
Ads / Sponsors
 
Join Date: ∞
Posts: 42
Thanks: ∞
Thanked 42 Times in 42 Posts
  #2  
02-04-2020, 05:04 AM
lordsmurf's Avatar
lordsmurf lordsmurf is online now
Site Staff | Video
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 13,509
Thanked 2,449 Times in 2,081 Posts
You cannot compare these.

The ES10/15 is not a TBC. It especially does not act as frame TBC. It is a DVD recorder with a line TBC(ish) with passthrough abilities. The "ish" is because it's not entirely a line TBC either, as it has purposeful weaknesses to allow false errors, aka anti-copy signals (Macrovision, etc). The side effect is that natural errors can also permeate this barrier. It can balk and throw other issues, whether the tape is a homeshot video of Timmy playing T-ball or a Star Wars movie. ES10/15 also has negative side effects, namely posterization (color palette compression, visually obvious digital compression) and aggressive NR that does not 100% fully disengage even when NR is "off". The ES10/15 shines at anti-tearing and serious linear timing issues that can overrun a Panasonic or JVC line TBC. The net effect on those tapes is better video, even with the negative affects. Because, remember, restoration is about making it better, not perfect. And this combo is definitely better on those tearing and uber-unstable tapes. That's what it was always for, never as a TBC "replacement". It's an addition to a workflow, not an exchange.

The Prime Image is a rackmount broadcast TBC that expects non-consumer sources. It expects BetacamSP or U-matic, not VHS or Video8/Hi8. Those sources have different qualities, and the chaos of VHS will completely overrun this PI TBC. Since Hi8 is generally better quality sources ... maybe? But Video8/Hi8 usually drops massive frames, too.

DataVideo TBCs may be as expensive as iPhones, but in 2-3 years it'll still be as desired. Whereas that old iPhone can be worthless. TBCs don't have the same sort of devaluation as a car or phone, and is more like a pro camera lens.

In more recent years, the DVK+ES10/15 was discovered to be a good "poor man's TBC", but with drawbacks. Namely that the ES10/15 is no longer option, cannot be removed from the chain. But as a budget option, especially if you only have a handful of tapes, it works well enough. The DVK has decent frame TBC, but completely chokes on bad line-timed sources (as does the related TBC-5000). The Es10/15 has strong line abilities, but almost no frame performance. These complement one another.

- Did my advice help you? Then become a Premium Member and support this site.
- For sale in the marketplace: TBCs, workflows, capture cards, VCRs
Reply With Quote
The following users thank lordsmurf for this useful post: ChunkDaMan (02-05-2020)
  #3  
02-05-2020, 02:31 PM
ChunkDaMan ChunkDaMan is offline
Free Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: United States
Posts: 36
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanks, LS!

I understand about the PI, but it's all I have at the moment. I'm sure you have tested many TBCs from the worst to the Datavideo over the years and can tell if one does better than the other. My JVC SR-MV45 is rigged to the PI, rigged to my AIW 9000, rigged to my Windows XP Pentium "capbox" (as I call it) and capping using VirtualDub. I've never lost a darn frame, especially for the recording time exceeding 6 hours. I will say that I have my timing resync settings set to "resampling" and the sync has been stable, even for the 6 hours. I'm sure I'm better off using the PI than no TBC of any kind and I'm also using it as my picture enhancer (sharpness and levels).
Reply With Quote
Reply




Tags
es10, panasonic, prime image, tbc, tbc freeze ii

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
TBC/VCR purchase advice, Prime Image TBC/Freeze II? JACFIS Capture, Record, Transfer 1 08-27-2018 07:53 AM
Prime Image TBC/Freeze II (50-II) in PAL mode? NTCT Restore, Filter, Improve Quality 3 07-19-2011 08:34 PM
Prime Image Freeze series TBC manual [DOWNLOAD] lordsmurf Video Hardware Repair 0 05-05-2011 06:53 AM
Prime image tbc Wineslurper Restore, Filter, Improve Quality 5 09-09-2005 08:40 PM
Prime Image 50 II Tom_n_Jonna Restore, Filter, Improve Quality 2 08-24-2005 11:22 PM

Thread Tools



 
All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:26 AM