Purple-blue image passing thru DMR-ES10?

Kocane · #1 01-21-2022, 10:02 AM

I have this very odd issue.

I got a Sony EV-T2 (Hi8 / VHS combo) player that I connect to my Panasonic DMR-ES10 thru s-video. I've used it before, albeit over a year ago, and it worked fine. Now I am having an issue when on/off (but mostly on) the image looks like this. Like mentioned it comes and goes but I can't really find any pattern. It disappears instantly when pausing or reverse/fastforwarding.

So at first I thought the tape was bad, but it happened with other tapes as well. Then I ran a tape cleaner thru the Hi8 - no change. Then I thought my Hi8 player was going bad so I output the s-video directly my Hauppauge capture card (also tried my old dazzle, just to confirm it wasn't the Hauppauge) and then it output with zero issue. I've also tried connecting the Hi8 to the ES10 with composite and then output s-video to the capture card and that worked without issue as well. What's more; the VHS part of the same device also works and outputs just fine, thru the ES10 via s-video.

Then I figured it was the s-video IN on the ES10, but I just so happens to have a EV-C500E laying about and that one worked just fine in the same setup. I've tried all kinds of cable combinations with multiple s-video cables, but it doesn't change a thing.

Anyone have an idea whats going on?

latreche34 · #2 01-21-2022, 10:40 AM

When dealing with workflows always separate components to single out the bad one, never hookup up all things together and try to locate the problem even when changing components around, it's like finding a needle in a haystack. Also your post is confusing I read it 3 times and still couldn't comprehend what you did or what you are trying to achieve, maybe due to age, you can blame that on me.

Kocane · #3 01-21-2022, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by latreche34

When dealing with workflows always separate components to single out the bad one, never hookup up all things together and try to locate the problem even when changing components around, it's like finding a needle in a haystack. Also your post is confusing I read it 3 times and still couldn't comprehend what you did or what you are trying to achieve, maybe due to age, you can blame that on me.

It may be because I'm the author of the rambling but it makes sense to me.

I've tried seperating the components. Two different Hi8 players in the same setup where only the one of them has the issue. The it would obviously seem like it was the S-video Out on the bad Hi8 player that was the culprit but then it doesn't make any sense that it outputs directly to the capture card from s-video, without issue...? Not to mention how the VHS player on the "bad" device outputs out via s-video, thru the ES10 and to the capture card without issue, as well.

hodgey · #4 01-21-2022, 02:48 PM

I know there are some thing son the ES10 and similar that can fail causing some inputs/outputs to not work properly - on the ES10 I have the chroma part of s-video input doesn't work properly at all, though it only gives some faint color noise. From what I've read it's the input switching IC but not sure. Maybe something like that could be starting to go bad on yours and somehow something on the T2 triggers it?

There is of course also the issue with power supply capacitors going bad on the ES10 but I've never heard of that causing this sort of issue, that either causes it to fail to turn on at all or sometimes patterning/noise.

Kocane · #5 01-21-2022, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hodgey

I know there are some thing son the ES10 and similar that can fail causing some inputs/outputs to not work properly - on the ES10 I have the chroma part of s-video input doesn't work properly at all, though it only gives some faint color noise. From what I've read it's the input switching IC but not sure. Maybe something like that could be starting to go bad on yours and somehow something on the T2 triggers it?

Hm, wouldn't surprise. I just find it so very odd that it only happens with one of the Hi8 players. Would the ES15 be better, maybe

Quote:

Originally Posted by hodgey

There is of course also the issue with power supply capacitors going bad on the ES10 but I've never heard of that causing this sort of issue, that either causes it to fail to turn on at all or sometimes patterning/noise.

I replaced them some years ago, it did indeed go bad. Probably not the same capacitors this time though.

Here is a gif showing the issue and how it instantly disappears when freeze framing.

lordsmurf · #6 01-25-2022, 05:04 AM

Browser is blocking it, must have too many scripts/ads. Attach images to the forum.

Kocane · #7 01-25-2022, 05:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lordsmurf

Browser is blocking it, must have too many scripts/ads. Attach images to the forum.

Gotcha. Hereby attached in this post as an avi.

lordsmurf · #8 01-25-2022, 05:42 AM

Ugly chroma noise.

ES10 can have bad caps,. Not often, seen it very few times, but one possible issue here.

Kocane · #9 01-25-2022, 06:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lordsmurf

Ugly chroma noise.

ES10 can have bad caps,. Not often, seen it very few times, but one possible issue here.

But does it make any sense at all that my EV-C500E seemingly can pass s-video thru the ES10 without issue?

Kocane · #10 02-03-2022, 08:04 AM

Well, I bought another ES10 and it seems like the issue is gone. At least they're cheap.

If it's a matter of replacing a few caps, which I've already done before on one of these machines, then maybe it would be worth it. I've looked at them though and non of them seems obviously bad or bulging. How to identify :/?

hodgey · #11 02-03-2022, 01:06 PM

If you mean the power supply, C1406 and C1707 (6.3V 680 uF ELNA RJX) seem to be ones that start bulging eventually as noted in e.g this thread. Another user noted some more that measured bad on theirs in this post. Maybe worth replacing those two if you are at it. There are some suggestions for replacements in the first thread, you want something with equivalent uF value, same or higher voltage rating, and of a "low impedance/low ESR" type. You could of course also just swap in the power board from the other ES10 that you replaced caps on if you're not going to use it anyhow.

Idk if there are ones on the mainboards that can go bad too, on my newer EH57 replacing some of the electrolytic caps on the digital pcb helped get rid of patterning on the image, though those are surface-mount ones and a PITA to replace, I almost broke the pcb in the process. No idea if those can be an issue on the ES10 though. As noted in the other thread, the AV switching IC is known to often develop issues so it could be that that is causing trouble.

Kocane · #12 02-03-2022, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hodgey

If you mean the power supply, C1406 and C1707 (6.3V 680 uF ELNA RJX) seem to be ones that start bulging eventually as noted in e.g this thread.

Check the OP on that thread ;-). It's the very same ES10 thats acting up now. Last time it was just so very consistent - it didn't turn on. Now it's so very incredibly specific; s-video input from ONE of my devices? Incredibly odd. Maybe I should buy another just to have the spare!

The "new" one seems to be fully functional. Display is incredibly dim though, but who cares I guess. Still, would be cool to get the old working again but its hard with no blatantly bad caps.