Panasonic TBC vs. JVC TBC vc. Datavideo TBC

vaccastracca · #1 08-11-2011, 07:24 AM

Hello everyone.
I recently got a Panasonic NV-FS200 (european version of the AG-1980) S-VHS deck.
I already owned a JVC HR-S9850, which I purchased new in early 2000s. It's a great machine, but for some reasons it never convinced me 100%!
So I wanted to try the Panasonic to see if it was any better!
Overall, the Panasonic seems a much sturdier and well constructed machine, but it doesn't make the JVC bite the dust like I was hoping.
Let's say they both have their points.
The thing that left be a bit puzzled though is the TBC. On the Panasonic it's almost like it didn't exist! ...when I switch it on, I don't see any big improvement in the picture...only some light cleaning, but barely noticeable!
On the JVC instead, when the TBC is on, the picture is WAY better! ...sometimes even too much!!! So clean that looks almost unreal!!!
So I was wondering if, even if they are both called TBC, they could be actually different things...because the difference on how they work in these two machines is HUGE!
In these days I was also getting infos about external TBC units, like the Datavideo TBC1000...and I was wondering if it works in the way Panasonic TBC does - that is very mild picture improvement (if any), and just correcting jitter or stuff like that - or in the way JVC TBC does - that is huge picture improvement and cleaning.
I am a bit stuck, because before starting passing my old VHS tapes to dvd I would like to be sure to have the best (or closest to best) quality possible with the machines combination!
My chain for now is very simple: JVC or Panasonic straight to dvd recorder (I have two: a Panasonic DMR-E75V and a Pioneer DVR-510H). Should I add an external TBC? Or even some color corrector units? I don't know anything about that...
With the JVC alone, things are generally good but sometimes the cleaning is so strong that the picture seems almost unreal...With the Panasonic the picture is more organic, but of course dirtier and grainier....what i am trying to find is a good balance between the two situations...would I reach that with the Panasonic and an external TBC? ...or should I switch to computer software? ...which I would prefer to avoid, I don't like messing with computers, it takes too much time!
OK, that's about all I had to ask I guess.
I hope someone can help me!
Cheers!
ERIK

NJRoadfan · #2 08-11-2011, 09:12 AM

The JVC Digipure system includes a dynamic noise reduction system that engages with the TBC. If the NV-FS200 is anything like the AG-1980, the TBC switch is just for the TBC, while noise reduction is controlled by a DETAIL/NOR/EDIT switch and a picture sharpness slider control.

admin · #3 08-11-2011, 09:42 AM

Quote:

If the NV-FS200 is anything like the AG-1980

The VCRs are identical, save for format:
- The Panasonic NV-FS200 S-VHS VCR is the PAL version.
- The Panasonic AG-1980P S-VHS VCR is the NTSC version.

There's actually more to it, too -- we'll get to that later today. We're a few days behind on forum queues.

vaccastracca · #4 08-12-2011, 01:16 AM

OK, so, Panasonic's TBC doesn't seem to have image improvement or chroma noise suppression of any of that...it offers noise reduction and soft/sharp picture control.
From what I'm reading around in forums, it seems that also Datavideo TBC 1000 doesn't feature picture improvement, but only eliminates Macrovision...which is useless for me since I think I own two or three vhs tapes with Macrovision out of thousands I have!
So, what should I look for to put after the Panasonic in order to clean the picture, suppress chroma noise and so on?

robjv1 · #5 08-17-2011, 12:31 AM

^ Well, the DataVideo TBC will also prevent a loss of synch the resultant dropped frames if you're capturing to a PC capture card.

vaccastracca · #6 08-17-2011, 01:13 AM

No, I'm not using a PC. Only standalone dvd recorder...i don't want to mess with PC.
So, I'd say Datavideo is useless to me.
What should I look for in order to clean the image (suppress chroma noise etc) to put AFTER the S-VHS and BEFORE the dvd-recorder?

Quote:

Originally Posted by robjv1

^ Well, the DataVideo TBC will also prevent a loss of synch the resultant dropped frames if you're capturing to a PC capture card.

lordsmurf · #7 08-22-2011, 01:16 PM

I've updated this post, as of today: http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/vide...html#post17020

Much more in depth, lots of new information. Go read that.
If you still have questions, come back here and ask them. (Or re-ask them, if that's the case.) At that time, I'll provide more answers.

Thanks.

vaccastracca · #8 08-25-2011, 11:15 AM

Thank you very much for the link.
I've read all that, and at this point I'm 100% sure that what I need is NOT a TBC!!!
I guess i was misleaded by my JVC S-VHS, which incorporated noise reduction in its TBC. Now I now that standalone TBC units don't offer what I look for!
I think what I should look for is some good proc-amp, because what i need to be working on is the quality of the image (colors, contrast, dirtiness, blacks etc...).

admin · #9 08-27-2011, 08:40 PM

Yes, TBCs are not color correctors, but signal stabilizers.
The primary function of external units has almost nothing to do with image quality.

Two good proc amps to consider are either the Elite Video BVP-4 (or BVP-4 Plus), or the SignVideo PA-100 (or dual PA-200). Good proc amps will probably run at least as much as the aforementioned TBCs ($200+ lowest cost). SignVideo gear is still sold new, for about $500, and seldom found used. Elite gear is only sold used, and can be somewhat scarce.

Good to hear that you're on the right track now!

vaccastracca · #10 08-28-2011, 01:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by admin

Two good proc amps to consider are either the Elite Video BVP-4 (or BVP-4 Plus), or the SignVideo PA-100 (or dual PA-200).

Problem is I live in Italy, therefore I need PAL equipment...and to my knowledge, both products you mention are NTSC tools...some say they work also for PAL, in some cases, but it's more a bet than a feature!

admin · #11 08-28-2011, 01:53 AM

The old composite Vidicraft units have been confirmed by members of this site to work with PAL.
There's one on eBay right now: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vidicraft-Pr...item1c1e6dc81e

And then check the marketplace sub-forum here in the digitalFAQ.com forums (I think there's some listed right now).

vaccastracca · #12 08-28-2011, 02:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by admin

The old composite Vidicraft units have been confirmed by members of this site to work with PAL.

Thanks for the hints! :-)
Is the Vidicraft comparable to the EliteVideo or the SignVideo in terms of quality? ...I see it comes pretty cheap, compared to the other two...

admin · #13 08-28-2011, 03:00 AM

It's composite and from the 1980s, the predecessor to the SignVideo gear. It's not bad, but its limited by the composite input. If you search the forum, you'll find many discussions on Vidicraft gear going back quite a few years. Those past posts should answer pretty much anything you could ask about. I doubt you'll find many better options for under $500.