To Crop or Not to Crop! - Page 14

kwag · #**261** 12-20-2002, 05:21 PM

@rendalunit

Hi ren,

I tried the LanczosResize on "The Green Mile", and the result looks worse than BilineraResize

. Maybe the added sharpness around the edges makes this difference. I didn't like the result, compared to the test sample that came out with BilinearResize. Looks more like the original LBR sample. Maybe Mr. Lan C. Zos (

) doesn't like low bit rates

-kwag

SansGrip · #**262** 12-20-2002, 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwag

How does "Untouchables" look SansGrip

Take a look

. This sample includes, at the beginning, about the worst Gibbs I could find in the whole clip...

kwag · #**263** 12-20-2002, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SansGrip

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwag

How does "Untouchables" look SansGrip

Take a look

. This sample includes, at the beginning, about the worst Gibbs I could find in the whole clip...

That looks VERY good for 2 hours

I viewed it with WMP, so I guess fully stretched in my TV it will look even better

I can see the Gibbs effect, but it's very little and blurred. I rather see this encode on my TV than the same thing encoded at 352x240. Look at the horses on the far background. You can even see some detail! At 352x240 they would look like "Something" moving in the background

-kwag

SansGrip · #**264** 12-20-2002, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwag

That looks VERY good for 2 hours

Yep

. I decided to take a chance with x3 given the Cinemascope aspect ratio. I think had it been regular 16:9 I probably would've had to use too low a CQ_VBR for one disc. However, I won't know until I try it...

Quote:

I rather see this encode on my TV than the same thing encoded at 352x240. Look at the horses on the far background. You can even see some detail! At 352x240 they would look like "Something" moving in the background

Exactly. I'm willing to put up with a little Gibbs (a little, mind you

) and encode at 528x480. I find the sharpness very pleasing. That said, even going from 352x240 to 352x480 makes a huge difference for me. I think it's that doubling of the vertical resolution that's the most important part.

Overall it looks like this encode came out well, and I can't wait to try it on the TV when the kids have gone to bed

.

syk2c11 · #**265** 12-20-2002, 06:51 PM

Hi guys,
Just got up and back to business. Yes, I did use FitCD to resize, and yes I did set Block TV overscan to 2, and yes I did use the new GOP (1-12-2-1-24). I used Flux, LegalClip, and Blockbuster as well. I just don't know what went wrong.

So, is the prediction script in FitCD still valid or we can now switch to:

IL = Framecount / 50
SL = round(Framerate) * 2
SelectRangeEvery(IL, SL)
[/quote]

kwag · #**266** 12-20-2002, 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SansGrip

Overall it looks like this encode came out well, and I can't wait to try it on the TV when the kids have gone to bed

.

Tell me about it

, I've been waiting for the TV to test my burned CD-Rs of "The Green Mile" and "Red Planet". My wife and my brother in law are watching a movie on the HDTV, and my kids are on the 60" old Magnavox playing Dreamcast

So I'm 3'rd in queue :P

-kwag

black prince · #**267** 12-20-2002, 07:09 PM

@SansGrip,

Quote:

Use the mask dialog to figure out the size of the existing borders on the frame, then let me know what they are and I'll post an updated version of your script to crop them in Avisynth. I think this might be what's causing the difference.

Tmpgenc's Clip Frame mask is top=73, bot=78, left=19, and right=17 for
resize 496x448 with borders (16,16,16,16)

-black prince

alfredini · #**268** 12-20-2002, 07:40 PM

Are these values valid for pal too?
I want to encode Brain Dead

Movie lenth is 99 min

Is this ok?:
IL = Framecount / 30 # interval length in frames
SL = round(Framerate)*2 # sample length in frames
SelectRangeEvery(IL,SL)

And what is the constant now? 0.89?

SansGrip · #**269** 12-20-2002, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by black prince

Tmpgenc's Clip Frame mask is top=73, bot=78, left=19, and right=17 for resize 496x448 with borders (16,16,16,16)

If that's the size of the borders before resizing then here's the script you can try:

Code:

LoadPlugin("E:\DVD Backup\2 - DVD2SVCD\MPEG2DEC\MPEG2DEC.dll") 
LoadPlugin("E:\DVD Backup\2 - DVD2SVCD\BlockBuster\BlockBuster.dll") 
LoadPlugin("E:\DVD Backup\2 - DVD2SVCD\LegalClip\LegalClip.dll") 
mpeg2source("D:\Temp\movie.d2v") 
# 
IL = Framecount / 60 
SL = round(Framerate) * 2 
SelectRangeEvery(IL, SL) 
# 
Crop(27, 73, 668, 328)
LegalClip() 
LanczosResize(496,256)
Blockbuster( method="noise", detail_min=1, detail_max=10, variance=1, seed=1 ) 
AddBorders(16,112,16,112) 
LegalClip()

Those are mighty big borders that you weren't cropping. No wonder the file size is so different

.

SansGrip · #**270** 12-20-2002, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alfredini

I want to encode Brain Dead

Don't worry, that's how I encode most of the time too

.

Quote:

IL = Framecount / 30 # interval length in frames

I would use 50 instead of 30, at least until we've thrashed out good values for this new GOP.

SansGrip · #**271** 12-20-2002, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwag

Tell me about it

, I've been waiting for the TV to test my burned CD-Rs of "The Green Mile" and "Red Planet". My wife and my brother in law are watching a movie on the HDTV, and my kids are on the 60" old Magnavox playing Dreamcast

Very simple solution: buy another TV -- maybe a 50" plasma widescreen?

Quote:

So I'm 3'rd in queue :P

Just tell them it's an encoding emergency...

alfredini · #**272** 12-20-2002, 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SansGrip

Quote:

Originally Posted by alfredini

IL = Framecount / 30 # interval length in frames

I would use 50 instead of 30, at least until we've thrashed out good values for this new GOP.

First of all... thank u verry much for the help.
But i still have some questions...

Quote:

Originally Posted by alfredini

Are these values valid for pal too?

And what is the constant now? 0.89?

Sorry but i don't get it yet

btw the quality is really superb with the new GOP

SansGrip · #**273** 12-20-2002, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alfredini

Are these values valid for pal too?

I can't think of a reason why not.

Quote:

And what is the constant now? 0.89?

I'm not sure -- best ask kwag about that one

.

alfredini · #**274** 12-20-2002, 08:02 PM

Thank you Sansgrip.
I'll just give it a try and post the results tommorrow. it's 3.00 AM in Germany

kwag · #**275** 12-20-2002, 08:09 PM

50:48, or better yet:

Code:

 (MovieTimeInMinutes / 2) : NTSC=48 or PAL=50

Where Snapshots will vary, depending on the movie time, and 48 is a fixed window width of 48 frame for NTSC or 50 for PAL
The factor i'm using is now .98, and seems to be pretty accurate.

-kwag

SansGrip · #**276** 12-20-2002, 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SansGrip

I can't wait to try it on the TV when the kids have gone to bed

.

Little did I know my wife would decide to order Divine Secrets of the Ya-Ya Sisterhood on PPV. DIVINE SECRETS OF THE YA-YA SISTERHOOD! For this I'm waiting...

kwag · #**277** 12-20-2002, 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SansGrip

Quote:

Originally Posted by SansGrip

I can't wait to try it on the TV when the kids have gone to bed

.

Little did I know my wife would decide to order Divine Secrets of the Ya-Ya Sisterhood on PPV. DIVINE SECRETS OF THE YA-YA SISTERHOOD! For this I'm waiting...

How about a trip to your circuit breaker box and

, power fail

-kwag

syk2c11 · #**278** 12-20-2002, 10:32 PM

Hi there,
I downloaded SansGrip's sample and watched in PC and TV, I now know it is called "Gibbs". This is the thing that I have been trying to describe to you people. What causes "Gibbs" and can we get rid of it??

kwag · #**279** 12-20-2002, 10:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by syk2c11

Hi there,
I downloaded SansGrip's sample and watched in PC and TV, I now know it is called "Gibbs". This is the thing that I have been trying to describe to you people. What causes "Gibbs" and can we get rid of it??

That's the next target

Quantization Matrix optimization

, improvements on the KVCD Q. Matrix.

-kwag

SansGrip · #**280** 12-21-2002, 12:21 AM

Well, I just finished watching Untouchables on the TV and all I can say is

, even though that's not a word

.

It really does look very close in quality to a DVD (at least on my TV), with the only noticible artifacts being caused by the Gibbs effect -- not so much visible mosquito noise as a "shimmering" of very high-frequency areas. It's barely noticible, though, once you stop looking for flaws and start enjoying the movie: my wife, who is untrained in the art of critical viewing, did not notice it at all

. I'd really love to try one of these encodes on an HDTV, but no-one I know has one. kwag, could you do me a favour by burning that clip onto CD-RW and testing it on your high-definition system?? I'd be fascinated to hear if the quality stays so good on such a setup...

One problem not related to the new GOP: three times during the very beginning of the movie, separated by perhaps a minute or two, the video and audio froze for about a second, then resumed as normal. Beyond roughly five minutes into the movie it didn't happen again. I know I need to replay and see if this occurs in the same places every time (indicating perhaps a media failure), but if it doesn't, what could be causing it? Since it's only right at the start could that signal a too-low minimum bitrate?

Anyway, apart from those two very minor issues the thing looks incredible considering it's on one disc (heck, it looks better than most of my old encodes that were on 3 discs for a 2-hour movie). Naysayers be damned

.