Quantcast Lots of Minutes on DVD-R, Help Editing KDVD Templates? - digitalFAQ.com Forums [Archives]
  #1  
05-07-2003, 12:59 PM
baker baker is offline
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I was just thinking. The kvcd for dvd are currently set as low as 352x576, however dvd supports 352x288. I would like to use this res as I want to get as many simpsons episodes onto a dvd as possible, since its only animation the low res shouldn't really be a problem.

Anyway, basically, do I need to alter anything elese in the templet except the res.

Also the low detail in a cartoon and the high ammount of filtering I will be adding means that this dvd could hold a collesel ammount!! If I am right nearly 600mins!!!

Baker
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  #2  
05-07-2003, 11:22 PM
kwag kwag is offline
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Hi Baker,

If with the KDVD Half D1 template you can fit ~10+ hours on a DVD-R, you should be able to fit ~18+ hours with the same templates changed to 352x240(28 That's 1,080 minutes! Is that enough
Make sure you use file prediction though

-kwag
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  #3  
05-08-2003, 02:33 PM
baker baker is offline
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thats 50 episodes!!!


But I never understood the CQ thingy and I was wondering if the cq mode its at at the min is ok or should I change it to something else??

This simpsons dvd is going to rock!!! 54 episodes with a deadly menu!!

Baker
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  #4  
05-08-2003, 04:00 PM
kwag kwag is offline
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How long is each episode ~20 minutes
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  #5  
05-09-2003, 12:47 PM
baker baker is offline
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I would say about 20 yes. Plus 5 min ads every 15mins means an episode of the simpsons lasts 30mins.

I am about to capture one now so I will let you know.

Has anybody about here done anything like this yet???

Any info on dvd menu creation!!! I am defenetly going to need one!

Baker
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  #6  
05-09-2003, 01:10 PM
Racer99 Racer99 is offline
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Use Pegasys' DVD Author, It'll do the job quickly for you.
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  #7  
05-09-2003, 03:12 PM
kwag kwag is offline
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That's exactly what I was going to recommend

-kwag
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  #8  
05-09-2003, 05:23 PM
baker baker is offline
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oh yea and the simpsons episodes are 20mins in length.

Let yo know...

Baker
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  #9  
05-09-2003, 07:37 PM
vhelp vhelp is offline
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@ Baker..

50 ?? wow ..that's a lot of bart, dude hehe..

Yeah, I'm curious too.. ta see how you make out on that number

hay Baker.. what fps is that in by the way
I've never tackled this show. Is it Telecined or some crazy cartoon
Telecine (the ones that drive you crazy ) or is it 29.970 ??

Yeah, what the average megabytes per 20min show ??

Anyways.. good luck
-vhelp
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  #10  
05-10-2003, 02:32 AM
urban tec urban tec is offline
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Quote:
Telecine (the ones that drive you crazy ) or is it 29.970
I am so glad I live in pal land, the whole Ntsc thing seems to be such a legacy.
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  #11  
05-10-2003, 08:15 AM
baker baker is offline
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1,080/20=50+.

Thats right isnt it???

Anyway filters are my main problem at the minuit. I do live in pal land by the way. NTSC (never the same colour) is pretty crap though isnt it

Anyway as soon as I get the filters right I will let you guys know how the test encodes are.

Baker
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  #12  
05-10-2003, 08:35 AM
baker baker is offline
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Right I got the filters right using swiftavs, the avs file when played looks very very clean, but still detailed enough.

However the tmpegenc output has noise around all the edges.!

Has the kvcd matrix been tested with animation yet??? perhaps its unsuitible.

Baker
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  #13  
05-10-2003, 08:48 AM
kwag kwag is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baker
Right I got the filters right using swiftavs, the avs file when played looks very very clean, but still detailed enough.

However the tmpegenc output has noise around all the edges.!

Has the kvcd matrix been tested with animation yet??? perhaps its unsuitible.

Baker
For animation, you should shorten the GOP to 15 (PAL) or 18(NTSC).
Did you calculate the correct CQ with file size prediction

-kwag
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  #14  
05-10-2003, 02:54 PM
baker baker is offline
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Its actually a case of crap in crap out.

Where I am capturing from(digital satelllite) aslready has the noise and although convoloution3d does a great job of getting rid of most of it. Some of it is still there and causing this problem.

It dvd so the gop is already down to 15.

Anything less then a cq of 60 is getting bad, but I dont think I will need to go that far down anyway

Tmpegencs bitrate control flucuates a hell of a lot!!! So I can't really tell what the CQ is going to be until I have all my episodes captured and ready to convert. Also it takes about 1:30 hours per episode due to the filters I am using. So to convert the whole 1000 mins it going to take about 75hrs!!! So I am going to do it in batch mode so I can do a few every night.

Once I calculate the CQ as if all the files are one big file, then use the CQ on all the seperate batch encodes it shouldn't make a difference right?

Baker
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  #15  
05-10-2003, 05:14 PM
kwag kwag is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baker
Once I calculate the CQ as if all the files are one big file, then use the CQ on all the seperate batch encodes it shouldn't make a difference right?
Edit: As long as you take into consideration ALL the files stringed together for prediction. That means adding them up in a DVD2AVI project or so, and then creating a .d2v to process. Then you'll have prediction for your total number of episodes, and targeted to the size of your DVD-R.

And you "might" want to play a trick with quality
As you know, MPEG-1 shines on low bit rates, better than MPEG-2. So why don't you encode your episodes as MPEG-1, and then use 3:2 pulldown (with pulldown.exe) and then mux with your audio as ~DVD with BBMpeg
This way, you'll get better quality that MPEG-2 , and most probably it will still play correctly on your standalone. This works flawlessly on all my DVD players

-kwag
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  #16  
05-10-2003, 06:58 PM
baker baker is offline
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Heh kwag thats a deadly idea(!)

I have heard that to keep costs down some cheapo dvd players ie ps2, have a rterrible mpeg 1 encoder which is only there as it has to be there for dvd standard....

So it might not be good on some players, would also help me in the certain PM matter

By the way you guys use some deadly filters!! This cartoon had banding (due to a bad composit connection), noise,macro blocks, and composit line thingys along all edges..

Every single one of them is gone!! the output looks like a flash video!!!

@vhelp

The simpsons are made in 15fps, I am unsure how they go from there but my capture shows a LOT of interlace.

Baker
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  #17  
05-10-2003, 07:08 PM
vhelp vhelp is offline
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@ baker

so let me ask you.. for the broadcaster to keep their footage smooth (though
we are talking cartoons) and for PAL land, your actual frame speed is
25 fps ?? ..and that (in my NTSC experience) they insert a duplicate frame
or Interlaced duplicate frame to maintain the 25 PAL or 29.970 NTSC ??

So, based on that summtion, I would presume that a 15fps (from an NTSC
source)
would be about right, but that would introduce a slight hesitation or something..
right ?? Anyways.. I'm just trying to figure out some of these TV capture
fps issues.

I don't know what an NTSC capture of the Simpsons would look like in fps,
bout it would be interesting though.

Sorry to hear about your add'nL noise, but I'm glad Kwag and guys
have worked all these filtering stuff out. Good show.

-vhelp
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  #18  
05-11-2003, 12:00 AM
Racer99 Racer99 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kwag
And you "might" want to play a trick with quality
As you know, MPEG-1 shines on low bit rates, better than MPEG-2. So why don't you encode your episodes as MPEG-1, and then use 3:2 pulldown (with pulldown.exe) and then mux with your audio as ~DVD with BBMpeg
This way, you'll get better quality that MPEG-2 , and most probably it will still play correctly on your standalone. This works flawlessly on all my DVD players
-kwag
Hey Kwag,

Would you still set the VBV Buffer for the MPEG-1 at 40 or at 224 as you would for DVD?

Also, could you explain these steps in greater detail. Thanks

Racer99
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  #19  
05-11-2003, 12:32 AM
kwag kwag is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Racer99
Hey Kwag,

Would you still set the VBV Buffer for the MPEG-1 at 40 or at 224 as you would for DVD?
Use one of the KDVD templates, and change the resolution and format to MPEG-1. Leave everything as is, so that it will be DVD compliant.
Quote:

Also, could you explain these steps in greater detail. Thanks
Check this thread, and just substitute the resolution for 352x240(28 http://www.kvcd.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3764
No need to patch the mpeg file, as 352x240(28 is already a DVD compliant resolution.

-kwag
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  #20  
05-11-2003, 08:58 AM
baker baker is offline
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@Vhelp

A while back I was seeing how far down I could go with DivX bitrates, using tricks with filters and framerates etc..

I tried using a fps of 15, then getting it back up to 25fps. The results were completely hopeless! I have no idea how they get it up to 25 from 15, but on a normal pal tv set the image is sharp and smooth moving!!!

It can't be the duplicate frame thingy as that gives very very yucky quailty. Its very stoppy looking. It seems they must work out an interlace frame from two frames or something.

Also may I point out that I think tmpegenc has a bitrate problem, the bitrate seems to peak for the first few seconds of any clip encoded!

Baker
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