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  #221  
09-13-2003, 09:23 AM
jorel jorel is offline
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hy Otto,
i'm(trying to)encode Dalmatians2 and is breaking my head!
in dvd2avi is changing progressive/interlaced and ntsc/film(42% to 92%)
is a mad thing.....
i'm testing
GreedyHMA(1,0,1,0,0,0,0,0)
or
Telecide(1)
to see what's better ..using fieldeinterlace is horrible..show "ghosts"!

and using dvd2svcd i got:
"Hybrid Film activated. IVTC will be applied and will slow down the entire process!"
and the prog put in the script:
telecide()
Decimate(5)
but the result is horrible!

please Phil,Kwag,vmesquita,GFR,....all:
i need big help!
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  #222  
09-13-2003, 02:31 PM
Boulder Boulder is offline
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It could be that you can't get a good result no matter what you try.

Create a DVD2AVI project with "No Field Operation" and try a simple script:

MPEG2Source("path\video.d2v")

See if you can find a pattern between the progressive and interlaced frames.
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  #223  
09-13-2003, 03:54 PM
jorel jorel is offline
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i did the project like your recomendations
mpeg2source("D:\dvd\a1.D2V")
and in vdub got:
720x480, 29,970fps
in tmpgenc:
720x480,29,970fps,interlace.

i need more help Boulder,i'm really lost!
thanks.
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  #224  
09-13-2003, 04:13 PM
Boulder Boulder is offline
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See what that script produces in VirtualDub. Is there for example two or three frames out of 5 interlaced - that's what I meant with a pattern.
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  #225  
09-13-2003, 04:15 PM
kwag kwag is offline
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Hi jorel,

If your target is MPEG-2, encode @29.97fps "Interlaced" ( not 3:2 pulldown ).
No need to do anything else.

-kwag
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  #226  
09-13-2003, 04:25 PM
jorel jorel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boulder
See what that script produces in VirtualDub. Is there for example two or three frames out of 5 interlaced - that's what I meant with a pattern.
i choose one part with moviments from left to right:
in each 5 frames i got:
2 frames with transitions in the moviments(ghosts with thin lines)....
and 3 frames very clean.

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  #227  
09-13-2003, 04:36 PM
Boulder Boulder is offline
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Well, this looks like a pattern that should be IVTC'd by Telecide() followed by Decimate(). However, if the pattern changes during the film, the result is a poor quality video. As you already tried this, I think it's best to do as the chief (Kwag) says and encode as 29.97fps interlaced
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  #228  
09-13-2003, 04:56 PM
jorel jorel is offline
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oh yes Boulder,thanks!

thanks too Kwag, i see your last post now!


ps:
strange,i post "seconds" after Boulder and have a big distance
between mine and your last post Kwag...i didn't see you!
your post: Sat Sep 13, 2003 9:15 pm
my post: Sat Sep 13, 2003 9:25 pm

don't matter,the best was your help my friends....thanks!


i'm encoding a sample to test!
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  #229  
09-17-2003, 09:37 AM
jorel jorel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kwag
Hi jorel,

If your target is MPEG-2, encode @29.97fps "Interlaced" ( not 3:2 pulldown ).
No need to do anything else.

-kwag

believe me, the result is horrible on 2 players in 2 tvs!
i got "strange lines" in the moviments from top to botton...
like this:
_____
___
_
___
______

yes....like this!

and if i try to use telecide(), tmpgenc(avisynth) show the advice:
"telecide:you must specify the order parameter (0=bff, 1=tff).
refer to hte user manual for how to set it properly.
an incorrect setting will result in incorrect decombing."

...and i think:....oh,...right....i know the result will be incorrect!

then i read the manual....and the conclusion is:
...this is my best conclusion after read the manual,
i "can't see a thing"!.......
:banghead:

now i'm feeling like a the mad woman in dalmatian2:
i want to kill that dogs!

i see bubbles,balls and risks in everywhere...
maybe i'm worse than that woman,she can't see "risks"!


more hints?
...please!
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  #230  
09-17-2003, 09:50 AM
Boulder Boulder is offline
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jorel,

there's a tutorial included in the new Decomb v5.0 package which will guide you to proper processing. I didn't want to copy-paste the whole document here since it's quite long. However, it's very simple and easy to follow.

Basically, figure out the field order and the guidance.

Try these two scripts:

#Top field first
MPEG2Source("path\clip.d2v")
AssumeTFF().SeparateFields()

and

#Bottom field first
MPEG2Source("path\clip.d2v")
AssumeBFF().SeparateFields()

View both scripts in VDub. Pick up a scene which includes some motion, for example someone moving across the screen. Which one has smoother motion? If it's the first one (probably is), your video is top field first which means you'll set Telecide(order=1). If it's the second one, it will be Telecide(order=0).

For field guidance see the step 2 in the tutorial.
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  #231  
09-17-2003, 09:58 AM
jorel jorel is offline
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thanks Boulder..i'm trying now:
using:
AssumeTFF().SeparateFields()
i got 59,940fps and the image is in the top to middle of the screen.
the middle of the screen to the botton is black(very dark green)!

using:
AssumeBFF().SeparateFields()
i got.....the same!


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  #232  
09-17-2003, 10:03 AM
Boulder Boulder is offline
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Don't mind the fps - see how the motion looks when you play the script in VDub
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  #233  
09-17-2003, 10:12 AM
jorel jorel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boulder
Don't mind the fps - see how the motion looks when you play the script in VDub
right Boulder...
AssumeTFF().SeparateFields()
seems better ! no ghosts or lines!
(but the middle to the botton of the screen is green)

what i do now?
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  #234  
09-17-2003, 10:35 AM
Boulder Boulder is offline
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But is the motion smooth, that's all that matters! You'll need to figure this one by yourself, I can't help you unless I see for myself. That green area does sound odd, though.

If you can figure out the field order, see the tutorial in the Decomb package. The next step is step 2, finding the pattern guidance.
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  #235  
09-17-2003, 11:05 AM
jorel jorel is offline
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ok!
thanks!
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  #236  
09-17-2003, 06:45 PM
jorel jorel is offline
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Bouuuuuuuuldeeeeeeer!


seems ok after read and following the advices...using:
Telecide(order=1,guide=1,post=2,vthresh=30)

i encode a sample and the image is great!
no ghosts,no risks,no marching ants and no blur!

details:
stay in 29,97 interlaced(means that i don't have to use pulldown,right?)
if i understand right how it works seems that using
Telecide(1) will give me the same effect like the line:
Telecide(order=1,guide=1,post=2,vthresh=30)
right?
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  #237  
09-17-2003, 08:01 PM
totonho03 totonho03 is offline
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Jorel:

Was this work for your cartoon film? If yes, can you post your script?
Thanks snd regards

Otto
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  #238  
09-17-2003, 08:41 PM
jorel jorel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by totonho03
Jorel:

Was this work for your cartoon film? If yes, can you post your script?
Thanks snd regards

Otto
yes Otto but see:
is for Dalmatians 2 (hibrid film) with 01:13:47 and got round CQ70...

mpeg2source("D:\dvd\Dalmatas.D2V")

Telecide(order=1,guide=1,post=2,vthresh=30)
#Telecide(1)

Undot()
ASharp(1,1)

BicubicResize(464, 352, 0, 0.6, 4, 0, 712, 480)

#STMedianFilter(8, 32, 0, 0 )
#MergeChroma(blur(1.50))
#MergeLuma(blur(0.1))

#Deen("c3d",1,10,12)
deen("a3d",3,4,1,4) # light cleaning
#deen("a3d",3,6,1,6) # medium cleaning
#deen("a3d",4,9,1,9) # heavy cleaning

DCTFilter(1,1,1,1,1,1,0.5,0)
AddBorders(8, 64, 8, 64)

i'm still doing tests with deen and waiting the final
observations about telecide from Boulder, Kwag or another master!
see details from my source in this thread,they are very important!
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  #239  
09-18-2003, 03:42 AM
Boulder Boulder is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jorel
details:
stay in 29,97 interlaced(means that i don't have to use pulldown,right?)
Yes, that's true. If you don't decimate, don't use pulldown.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jorel
if i understand right how it works seems that using
Telecide(1) will give me the same effect like the line:
Telecide(order=1,guide=1,post=2,vthresh=30)
right?
No, the defaults are guide=0,post=2,vthresh=35, so if you put Telecide(order=1), it would be the same as Telecide(order=1,guide=0,post=2,vthresh=35).

If your clip is hybrid content, you might want to try this (from the Decomb reference guide) :

Code:
Telecide(order=1,guide=1)
Decimate(mode=3,threshold=2.0)
This would produce 23.976fps video if I understood it correctly and you would have to use pulldown on it.

However, if the pattern stays the same all the time, with three clean frames and then two interlaced frames, you should use the Telecide options that you figured out and then add Decimate() after that.
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  #240  
09-18-2003, 06:09 AM
jorel jorel is offline
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to (great friends) Boulder, Kwag, vmesquita, GFR and all
that help me a lot to solve this problem, teach and help me
to understand what is ivtc,hibrid source,interlaced,telecide..etc:



it can be easy for you but was too big and great for me!
you change the to

the result is perfect!


thank you!
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