VHS winding method?

[honey_lake]

Hi all,

I'm finally about to start recording our VHS tapes. I've read on various posts that forwarding and winding the tapes back is good practise, then letting the tape rest before recording. However I'm not sure whether it should be wound via a player or manually, and haven't found definitive advice. Although I've read that players tend to wind them too fast causing damage.

So 2 questions are:
1. Should the tapes be wound forward and then backward manually by hand before capture?
2. Roughly what's the recommended resting period before I can start capture after the winding process?

If I've missed some important article please let me know.


Thanks!

[latreche34]

If you have a patience to sit for 2 hours rewinding a VHS tape by hand then kudos.

[honey_lake]

Quote:

Originally Posted by latreche34

If you have a patience to sit for 2 hours rewinding a VHS tape by hand then kudos.

Yeah I know it seems like a drag, but thought if it was a one-off by hand it wouldn't be so bad... But we do have 10 tapes sooo yeah

I have another VHS at home (not the one for capturing) that I can use purely for forward/rewind. Pretty sure it has two speeds for the process but have to double check.

[timtape]

The ideal way to wind tapes for storage is to let them play through to the end at normal viewing speed, most practically while digitizing each tape. This is called a "play wind" or sometimes "library wind", a long time practice in professional tape archives.

This requires a little vigilance as when the end of the tape is reached in play mode, many later model VCR's automatically rewind and often at very high speed, usually leaving the tape in a raggedly wound condition with tape edges exposed at top and bottom and uneven tape tension. Fast wind is only for user convenience, not for long term tape preservation.

Manual winding is not good as it doesnt support the reels and creates a bad wind in more ways than one.

[Xhumeka]

Good info timtape!

I was reading through an old magazine and it suggested for long term storage to keep the tapes "tail out" - is that still recommended?

https://imgur.com/a/4MByEP2

[Gary34]

I am wondering that too are you supposed to rewind the tape before you store it?

[traal]

Quote:

Originally Posted by timtape

The ideal way to wind tapes for storage is to let them play through to the end at normal viewing speed, most practically while digitizing each tape.

This is a good idea for priceless tapes because sometimes you get only one chance before the oxide layer flakes off as the tape passes through the machine.

Then after it's played through to the end and rewound, digitize a 2nd time to further clean up the signal.

[latreche34]

OP, I think you're looking for a problem to a solution, Just pop the tape in the VCR and digitize it, Only when problems arose then see if you have tape tension problems, then and only then you sort to this kind of suggestions on how to recondition the tape to play perfectly.

[timtape]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xhumeka

Good info timtape!

I was reading through an old magazine and it suggested for long term storage to keep the tapes "tail out" - is that still recommended?

https://imgur.com/a/4MByEP2

Yes stored "tail out" means as I described, stored with tape fully played out and not rewound. In single side recorded tapes like VHS, Beta, 8mm, it can also help reduce some sound "echoes" forming when long term stored at the tape's beginning.

[timtape]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary34

I am wondering that too are you supposed to rewind the tape before you store it?

Well it's certainly recommended (Specs Bros no less) not to store the tape anywhere in the middle of an important recording as that section of the tape isnt as protected as when further inside the cassette and safely wound on the reel sandwiched in between all the other winds.

https://youtu.be/vKys32XTyUE

[honey_lake]

Thank you everyone for the quick and thoughtful responses! Unfortunately we do have some tapes that have been kept halfway Hopefully they won't be too bad.

Seems like I was overthinking things and thought any rewinding on the player would damage them, but glad you all clarified. Our tapes are in pretty good condition and will just rewind (at normal speed) with the VCR.

[Eric-Jan]

Isn't it, to ask one self, if the tape is in good condition, before doing a certain "method" ?
bad tapes often smell bad, or have maybe mould ? real bad tapes have "expired" glue, that won't keep the oxide particles to actual plastic tape, and need to be examed, and may need a "baking" in extreme cases, to reactivate the glue ?
normal condition tapes should handled like …. normal ? any difference will be minute, i only found very few really bad tapes in my collection of some over 80 VHS tapes, twowhere prerecorded ones, the other one was a cheap unknown rebrand of unknown make. most tapes i have are Fuji Maxxel, Hitachi (Maxxel made) TDK, BASF, Philips, Dupont PDMagnetics
with recordings starting from almost 40 years ago.

[timtape]

Rewinding in itself will rarely improve things. It must be done for a specific reason, knowing WHY it is being rewound, to to fix WHICH problem. One reason some offer is to "loosen up" or "relax" the tape before playing. But why would it do that? Normally we rewind because it's the only way to get back to the start.

[latreche34]

Out of hundreds of VHS tapes I have yet to come across a tape with oxide shed syndrome, maybe luck. I come across tapes that track bad but rewinding or playing them back twice did not fix the problem, I usually (and depends on the importance of the content) just transfer the reels to another good cassette shell. Also it is important to examine the reels if they are warp.

[Eric-Jan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by latreche34

Out of hundreds of VHS tapes I have yet to come across a tape with oxide shed syndrome, maybe luck. I come across tapes that track bad but rewinding or playing them back twice did not fix the problem, I usually (and depends on the importance of the content) just transfer the reels to another good cassette shell. Also it is important to examine the reels if they are warp.

Yes, correct i have a pre-recorded tape from the US which had a bad cassette mechanism, transfering to another case, solved the problem for me also, it has to be done careful, but is possible to do so, although recently i "found" an FullHD version on the internet of this documentairy, that i owned on a original pre-recorded VHS ntsc….
(if the original reels are warped, the tape needs to be transferred on the new reels too, complete with both leader tapes, one can push out the "circle sector" plug(s) out of the centre of the reels, reel by reel transportation, forward onto the new reel, from the old reel, so the tape can spooled back onto the 2nd new reel)

[dpalomaki]

"Tail out" was common advice for 1/4" reel-to-reel audio tape. Reel-to-reel tape had far less protection than a cassette, and often had a good uniform wind from the just completed play process, while a fast rewind could yield a less uniform wind. Also the print-thru echo mentioned above was a consideration.

I suspect advancements in tape materials including base strength, coatings, and lubricants along with the protection of the cassette shell have made it less beneficial for VHS and 7mm tapes.

[timtape]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dpalomaki

"Tail out" was common advice for 1/4" reel-to-reel audio tape. Reel-to-reel tape had far less protection than a cassette, and often had a good uniform wind from the just completed play process, while a fast rewind could yield a less uniform wind. Also the print-thru echo mentioned above was a consideration.

I suspect advancements in tape materials including base strength, coatings, and lubricants along with the protection of the cassette shell have made it less beneficial for VHS and 7mm tapes.

The case does protect the reels inside from having their flanges accidentally squeezed down onto the vulnerable tape but especially if wound unevenly. I guess I've got into the habit of leaving any tape in a "played out, tails out" state whether or not it's inside a protective cassette.

[dpalomaki]

It made sense with reel-to-reel because reels were large, and tape paths have few guides and rollers to help ensure uniform tape speed. Even a wee bit of friction due to tape-to-reel contact, or condensation caused stickiness could cause variations in tape speed (wow and flutter in playback audio). Thus the rewind before play helped ensure the tape was free to spool off the supply reel. (A practice that may not be good for tapes at risk due to physical aging and abuse if they are irreplaceable and not archived.)

In the consumer world convenience often trumps quality. Thus the popularity (for a brief period at least) of 8-track tapes, then compact cassettes. For a while it seems the #1 (non beer can) trash on road sides was damaged audio tapes tossed by frustrated drivers.

[timtape]

With open reel it was easier to obtain good w&f. Tape speed could be increased, and there was room to include as many tape guides and scrape flutter rollers as needed. The challenge was always low w & f at slow tape speeds especially in a cassette such as audio Compact Cassette, Beta, VHS etc and great progress was made.

[dpalomaki]

Quote:

Tape speed could be increased, and there was room to include as many tape guides and scrape flutter rollers as needed.

True for professional-class gear, but consumer grade gear used the minimum they could, often including tape head pressure pads to compensate for uneven tape tension and wrap around the head. Compact cassettes used pressure pads as well. Increasing tape speed also helped frequency response.